I have twins. One is academically-gifted and will likely earn a PhD in a scientific discipline. The other is classically autistic and will never live independently. My DH and I always did well academically and socially. If I had a choice, I would rather have two absolutely average kids who could enjoy each other and have fulfilling lives. Normal is under-rated.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My traditional Asian upbringing is coming out, but there's nothing wrong with telegraphing to a child that they're not "good enough." It helps them up their game. It obviously doesn't make them more intelligent, but it makes them work that much harder until they get the top grades, awards etc. Asian countries are built on this model. Before you say that those parents don't love their kids -- the view is that it's a tough world out there, if we demand their best and toughen them up, nothing that they face after this will be hard for them.

I could not disagree more. In an Asian culture, perhaps this works, but here in the US, it's a terrible way to raise a child. Children should be taught to do their best, but to tell them that their best isn't good enough, well, go to it if it works for your kid, PP, but I think it's a recipe for an unhappy childhood.

OP said nothing about effort, she talked about her disappointment in her child's lack of ability in academics and athletics.

If you tell them their best is good enough, they'll be content to stay there -- who wants to work harder than they have to. If you tell them there's room for improvement, they'll work to improve. I believe the OP is talking about her kid's drive. It's not like all Asian kids are SO intelligent -- it's that they are driven, competitive and will work to be the best. Sorry but that just won't happen if you keep saying -- Johnny's doing his best, love him for who he is. OP hasn't said that there are any learning disabilities or any other reasons to tread lightly, so why not push a little bit to see how he responds? He's 12 not 2, he won't break. Some kids do respond great when that competitive fire is lit within them -- again, impossible if you keep giving him A's for effort.

OP you might be sabotaging your kid's ability to make full use of his natural talents. He maybe underachieving because of the parent child dynamic you have created. I've watched it happen several times. The parents demand so much from a kid he completely checks out and lacks motivation, because he either feels he will never live up to his parents' expectations, or he's over scheduled and over controlled to the point he just goes with the flow and loses all motivation.

In any event, I think therapy could help a lot. Both to realign your expectations and maybe set up a healthier parenting dynamic that will encouraging your son to shine in whatever way he is meant to.

OP - I am sorry you are feeling like this. You have to try and stop comparing him to you, your husband and other kids. Like the other posters said - spend time with him in a non pressure environment - play a board game, go for a hike, something where you can intereact with him in a relaxed settign so you can see him for who he is, not for who he isn't. Even if he never finds a calling - there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. I would have to guess that most people have never found a calling. Success can happen in many ways. Keep introducing him to new and different experiences - not with the goal of trying to find something he is good at but to find something he likes to do. Think outside of the box for this one - hiking, rock climbing, experiments. Again, not everyone has a passion, but i have to think most people have interests and pursuing these interests is what makes life fun. And what he may enjoy today may chnage next year.
I would worry more about him being happy than successful.

FWIW - my daughter is average and yes, there was a time where I wished she could excel at sports. We went from sport to sport to sport and tried several non-sport activities. Nothing clicked - even though she enjoyed some activities, she just wasn't great at any of them. And - she was unmotivated at school. Fast forward a couple years, she is still unmotivated at school, but has discovered singing which she loves! She isn't great, but she does it with such passion that people, esp. me, just love watching her perform. The look on her face as she sings is amazing and makes me want to cry. It was then that i realized that whatever feeling she has while on stage is more imprtant than her getting straight A's or being on a winning sports team. I hope things work out for you guys.

OP, I'm the people-pleaser PP.

I understand it is hard when your child is so different from you, especially since you and DH have hit all the traditional markers for success, but you need to really consider what it means to be successful. After about 22, it's not about grades and scores. It's about having a sense of direction when the world doesn't tell you what is best. It's about work ethic, creativity, dedication, -- feeling productive and content, etc. Does he have that? Does he care about anything? Is he passionate about anything? Does he work toward anything? Have you spoken to his teachers about your concerns?

DH's older brother excelled academically and professionally. He was always the golden child. DH was lost for a while, and I'm sure his parents were concerned. But he is more intuitive and perceptive. He is also capable. But he's laid back, patient, and values the work-life balance a lot more than a lot of the 20-/30-somethings we know who are far more ambitious in their careers. It took him time to come into his own and find his niche, but now he's got a great career and lots of important goals he's working toward.

I share this to help you see your child from a different perspective.

Read "Growth Mindset" by Carol Dweck. Intelligence is not fixed.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My traditional Asian upbringing is coming out, but there's nothing wrong with telegraphing to a child that they're not "good enough." It helps them up their game. It obviously doesn't make them more intelligent, but it makes them work that much harder until they get the top grades, awards etc. Asian countries are built on this model. Before you say that those parents don't love their kids -- the view is that it's a tough world out there, if we demand their best and toughen them up, nothing that they face after this will be hard for them.

Have you heard of Carl Rogers and unconditional positive regard? This is the foundation of therapy: unconditional positive regard. It's what a child needs most from a parent, and the lack of it is a real problem.

but i find it tiring to say "great job" constantly when it isn't...

You really need to get back to Parenting 101. Read Between Parent and Child by Hiam Ginott. Rule #1: Praise the effort, not the child. Got that?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks for the helpful replies and I agree I probably need to talk to a therapist to work through this. My child is not 7 - he is almost 12 - but still very young in the big scheme of life. And while I realize he could be very different some day, I do think you can tell a lot already. I have always been very sharp and driven and I've always been drawn to that same type with regard to my spouse and friends. So it is hard for me to connect with my child or admire him. But I really really do love him and I want to be a better parent to him. This has been the most shameful post I've ever typed.

Don't add guilt to your list, OP!

It is normal - and healthy - to grieve the loss of something or someone. Let that process develop within yourself, but always do your best to project confidence in his abilities.

I constantly have to make adjustments to my expectations for my GT/LD son, who frustrates the dickens out of me. I love him so much, yet he makes me crazy, because he can make highly intelligent remarks and get perfect grades one week and then get all wrong answers and seem apathetic the next. DH and I have no idea what the future holds for him, since his performance is so unequal.
Loving him for who he is? Well, who is he??? For some children, this can be really hard to pinpoint. I am his mother, I know him best in the world, and yet I don't know him very much at all... Parenting my other children is so much easier!

Don't worry too much, OP. You don't have to be a perfect parent, just a good-enough parent. From one type A, perfectionist personality to another, I know that is tough to hear

I wrote the above and wanted to add that having a special needs child really was the best thing to happen to "me", personally (not him, obviously!).
Parenting such a child taught me humility and grace under pressure. It made me practice being tolerant. That intelligence, as measured by IQ, and academic achievement are not as important as I thought they were (his IQ subscores range from gifted to way below normal, the psych. told us his total IQ, being the average of subscores, was therefore meaningless). That other abilities are just as precious and important in life, namely, seeing the glass half full. That I really want him to be independent and happy, not to go to the most prestigious university, especially since it is not a guarantee of financial success or indeed of happiness. Our partly-Asian families place a stratospherically high premium on academics, grades and labels in general. My mother scorns "underachievers" and "stupids". They don't understand DS at all, since he can't be measured by simplistic, traditional methods. DH and I are his safe zone, where he can be himself, whatever that means, free from criticism and anxiety.

So see this as an opportunity, rather than a burden.

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks for the helpful replies and I agree I probably need to talk to a therapist to work through this. My child is not 7 - he is almost 12 - but still very young in the big scheme of life. And while I realize he could be very different some day, I do think you can tell a lot already. I have always been very sharp and driven and I've always been drawn to that same type with regard to my spouse and friends. So it is hard for me to connect with my child or admire him. But I really really do love him and I want to be a better parent to him. This has been the most shameful post I've ever typed.

I do get where you are coming from OP. Feeling disappointed in your child is also a way of feeling disappointed in yourself. If you had more self confidence, you wouldn't feel so badly that your child is not a superstar. I do feel twinges of disappointment in my children when I realize they won't do the things I've done, that they are not driven as I am driven, but then I pull myself together and remember that they are not me, nor are they extensions of me, nor do they represent me. It is no reflection on me that my children are not like me. What does reflect on me is how happy and well-adjusted my children are, and no way will they feel self-confident if they feel they have disappointed me simply for being who they are. One of my children is likely to go into a very low-paying profession. He's not ambitious, doesn't care about making money or having a career. He wants a job that makes him happy. He really enjoys life as it comes, and is not looking to prove himself. I was disappointed when I realized he wasn't on his way to Harvard, but after that momentary falter, I pulled myself together and accepted that my child is wonderful just the way he is, and no amount of prodding or pushing will change him into someone else. After that, I started getting along a lot better with DS and appreciating all the wonderful things about him that much more. Children won't live with you forever, OP. You need to figure out how to get along with your child now, love and accept and embrace him for who he is, not who you want him to be, or you are going to alienate him, and he's going to leave without looking back as soon as he can. I want to have a long, loving relationship with all my children for the rest of my life, and I'm not going to let my foolish ambitions for my children get in the way of that.

Anonymous wrote:My traditional Asian upbringing is coming out, but there's nothing wrong with telegraphing to a child that they're not "good enough." It helps them up their game. It obviously doesn't make them more intelligent, but it makes them work that much harder until they get the top grades, awards etc. Asian countries are built on this model. Before you say that those parents don't love their kids -- the view is that it's a tough world out there, if we demand their best and toughen them up, nothing that they face after this will be hard for them.

This may work for some kids, but I know a number of people who were raised this way who are too bitter and angry to form relationships, and a few who are still trying to meet their parents' impossible standards into their forties, I.e., they never separated themselves from their parents to become healthy adults.

Anonymous wrote:My traditional Asian upbringing is coming out, but there's nothing wrong with telegraphing to a child that they're not "good enough." It helps them up their game. It obviously doesn't make them more intelligent, but it makes them work that much harder until they get the top grades, awards etc. Asian countries are built on this model. Before you say that those parents don't love their kids -- the view is that it's a tough world out there, if we demand their best and toughen them up, nothing that they face after this will be hard for them.

I could not disagree more. In an Asian culture, perhaps this works, but here in the US, it's a terrible way to raise a child. Children should be taught to do their best, but to tell them that their best isn't good enough, well, go to it if it works for your kid, PP, but I think it's a recipe for an unhappy childhood.

OP said nothing about effort, she talked about her disappointment in her child's lack of ability in academics and athletics.

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks for the helpful replies and I agree I probably need to talk to a therapist to work through this. My child is not 7 - he is almost 12 - but still very young in the big scheme of life. And while I realize he could be very different some day, I do think you can tell a lot already. I have always been very sharp and driven and I've always been drawn to that same type with regard to my spouse and friends. So it is hard for me to connect with my child or admire him. But I really really do love him and I want to be a better parent to him. This has been the most shameful post I've ever typed.

OP, while you're at the therapist, you might get a conversation going on why you are so truly impressed with yourself. That might be a starting point. You may be surprised to learn that the rest of the world does not view you as "very sharp and driven" and all of the other positive accolades you have used to describe yourself and your DH. Your mutual admiration club may indeed be very small.

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks for the helpful replies and I agree I probably need to talk to a therapist to work through this. My child is not 7 - he is almost 12 - but still very young in the big scheme of life. And while I realize he could be very different some day, I do think you can tell a lot already. I have always been very sharp and driven and I've always been drawn to that same type with regard to my spouse and friends. So it is hard for me to connect with my child or admire him. But I really really do love him and I want to be a better parent to him. This has been the most shameful post I've ever typed.

Don't add guilt to your list, OP!

It is normal - and healthy - to grieve the loss of something or someone. Let that process develop within yourself, but always do your best to project confidence in his abilities.

I constantly have to make adjustments to my expectations for my GT/LD son, who frustrates the dickens out of me. I love him so much, yet he makes me crazy, because he can make highly intelligent remarks and get perfect grades one week and then get all wrong answers and seem apathetic the next. DH and I have no idea what the future holds for him, since his performance is so unequal.
Loving him for who he is? Well, who is he??? For some children, this can be really hard to pinpoint. I am his mother, I know him best in the world, and yet I don't know him very much at all... Parenting my other children is so much easier!

Don't worry too much, OP. You don't have to be a perfect parent, just a good-enough parent. From one type A, perfectionist personality to another, I know that is tough to hear

Anonymous wrote:I am in the same position OP and it's not something that is going to go away with therapy or anything else. I think it is true disappoint and you just have to work through it.

It's called maturity. For God's sake, Grow Up!!!

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks for the helpful replies and I agree I probably need to talk to a therapist to work through this. My child is not 7 - he is almost 12 - but still very young in the big scheme of life. And while I realize he could be very different some day, I do think you can tell a lot already. I have always been very sharp and driven and I've always been drawn to that same type with regard to my spouse and friends. So it is hard for me to connect with my child or admire him. But I really really do love him and I want to be a better parent to him. This has been the most shameful post I've ever typed.

Boys mature a lot later than girls too.