Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just got some popcorn to witness the Fed v Fed back and forth.

Pathetic Feds. I have run into a few who are MIA from there jobs and others who have come into meetings with gin or vodka in their cups.

Pathetic.

Huh, funny, I have worked in 2 fed agencies over 12 years, and never seen anything like that even once. Makes me think you're making this up.

You need to Agency hop. Assume you are good at doing that...stop protecting your own.

Anonymous wrote:Pathetic Feds. I have run into a few who are MIA from there jobs and others who have come into meetings with gin or vodka in their cups.

NP here. I have been a federal contractor for 22 years at my agency. My wife has been a civil servant at her agency for 25 years. In my experience the feds who are creative with their timesheet accounting are monitored like a hawk. If they are not up to snuff on their work, this becomes the excuse to shuffle them either out the door or off to another agency. If they are keeping caught up on work, it can be overlooked. However, both of us know a handful of employees who were either fired from the civil service or sent to another agency due to inappropriate timekeeping issues.

OP, as another PP noted, you have no idea what the work schedules are like, whether the person has temporary shift work, whether they have personal issues for which they have been granted temporary telework options (my wife has standard telework options and occasionally gets temporary extra telework hours/days around treatment for her documented medical issues), or have some other issues. You should report what you see to this person's direct supervisor. It is only that supervisor's business. For all you know this person is working telework hours at home in the evenings and thinks he is just waiting until the next day to record the hours working. But whatever the case, the only one who should be advised and who can take care of addressing it appropriately is the supervisor.

report it to your IG. At least at my agency this is the kind of thing our (very overstaffed) IG loves to investigate.

Anonymous wrote:The Federal government time keeping world can be strange to outsiders. At my agency, you have to record all of the time you work, but it is not possible to record if you work more than 10 hours in a day or 80 hours in a pay period. Rules say you may not work past 7 pm or on weekends without getting special authorization. Every day you are required to take a 45 minute non-paid lunch break -- so a person's set hours are not 9-5 but 9 to 5:45. If your normal schedule is 8 hours, 9 to 5:45, rules say that to deviate from that schedule, you need to obtain prior permission; you cannot start work early or stay late without permission.

If you work more than 80 hours in a pay period you are entitled to "comp time", but before you work those hours, you have to request it by filling out forms and getting approving signatures.

In my office, my supervisor puts substance over form. You record you 8 hours, whether you worked 9 hours or 7 hour, you record 80 hours whether you worked 82 hours or 78 hours, because over time it averages out.

When I am getting ready for a hearing or engaged in litigation, you can be assured that I am working many more hours than the 80 hours recorded on my time sheet for the pay period.

I my office, everyone is a professional and no one has abused the system -- there is no need to do so as everyone has ample leave and the supervisor grants it when requested because people don't use leave in a way that hampers work.

It is a crazy system.

And I am on leave today.

This is true in my office as well. And I completely agree, it's crazy.

I had a team mate whose absenteeism directly affected my work, the timeliness of our team's deliverables, and my ability to take on special projects that my boss wanted to give me but I couldn't find time to do when covering both my portfolio & the coworker's. I attempted to resolve it directly with my coworker. That didn't work, so I then brought it to the attention of our lead. When those two steps didn't resolve the issue, I brought it to my director's attention but the conversation was entirely about the special project I was excited to be given, would like to delve into immediately, but wouldn't be able to do so until I was relieved of covering for coworker's unpredictable and unexcused absences. I didn't point out that he comes in at 10, leaves at 4, and takes a two hour lunch - it's not my job to track that and honestly, that wasn't the crux of my problem. My problem was he wasn't getting his work done and that affected my work.

Anonymous wrote:If you need the person, send them an email and set up a meeting. I would let them know that I've been frustrated trying to find them, but that's me. Sometimes letting people know that their coworkers are aware of their behavior when the bosses are away is a good thing.

But I absolutely wouldn't tell a supervisor unless you had crystal clear evidence of abuse. Abusers will get found out eventually.

I was a PP and this is similar to what I would do. I would email that person to tell them that "we are trying to have a meeting and based on the log and the fact that I did not see you around the office, I could not tell whether you were available or not. Let me know what time we can meet."

MYOB. Just worry about your own time sheet, damn!

If you need the person, send them an email and set up a meeting. I would let them know that I've been frustrated trying to find them, but that's me. Sometimes letting people know that their coworkers are aware of their behavior when the bosses are away is a good thing.

But I absolutely wouldn't tell a supervisor unless you had crystal clear evidence of abuse. Abusers will get found out eventually.

It drives me crazy to see people gaming the system too - because those of us who do show up and do our work in a timely manner (the fact that we're here really helps with that) are given bigger loads to make up for these kind of people BUT that's life and even in the private sector - the busiest person is rewarded with more work.

If there is some portion of your portfolio that requires collaboration with this person, focus on getting your work done. If he isn't able to deliver his share of the work in a timely manner, then focus on that - first talk to him about it and try to get it resolved directly. If he continues to slack and you have to pick up portions of his work to get your collective deliverable on time, let your supervisor know what's going on and leave it at that.

Some one else's comings & goings are not really your business, but some one doing so little that you have to take work home to make up for his absentee-ism is. Try to prioritize here and be careful what you complain about because it reflects poorly on you if you're on the dot on time every day but your work is sloppy and you're complaining that so & so coming in 7 minutes late if he does better work than you. From the supervisor's perspective - how does that look? Not great for you. So just be sure you're not being that person.

Anonymous wrote:It is a crazy system and I think the unions got us into this mess.

I would agree except that that system was in place at my agency long before there was any union at the agency.

It is a crazy system and I think the unions got us into this mess.

The Federal government time keeping world can be strange to outsiders. At my agency, you have to record all of the time you work, but it is not possible to record if you work more than 10 hours in a day or 80 hours in a pay period. Rules say you may not work past 7 pm or on weekends without getting special authorization. Every day you are required to take a 45 minute non-paid lunch break -- so a person's set hours are not 9-5 but 9 to 5:45. If your normal schedule is 8 hours, 9 to 5:45, rules say that to deviate from that schedule, you need to obtain prior permission; you cannot start work early or stay late without permission.

If you work more than 80 hours in a pay period you are entitled to "comp time", but before you work those hours, you have to request it by filling out forms and getting approving signatures.

In my office, my supervisor puts substance over form. You record you 8 hours, whether you worked 9 hours or 7 hour, you record 80 hours whether you worked 82 hours or 78 hours, because over time it averages out.

When I am getting ready for a hearing or engaged in litigation, you can be assured that I am working many more hours than the 80 hours recorded on my time sheet for the pay period.

I my office, everyone is a professional and no one has abused the system -- there is no need to do so as everyone has ample leave and the supervisor grants it when requested because people don't use leave in a way that hampers work.

It is a crazy system.

And I am on leave today.

Anonymous wrote:Wow, I'm shocked to know that federal employees don't consider cheating on their time cards to be stealing -- because as a tax payer I certainly do!!!! You all who are claiming OP should MYOB are part of the problem. I hate that people say to look the other way when someone cheats or steals. This is not an MYOB situation -- it's stealing our money, pure and simple.

OP, I would make an anonymous complaint. This guy is a thief. FYI -- my former bosses did this routinely. I know because I was in charge of time sheets. One would come in half an hour before everyone else, leave earlier than everyone else, take a half day every friday and every friday off as "flex pay." Scam. Other one would come in at 4:45 in the afternoon and claim an entire day. It's sickening. Hard to respect people like this. Please report them, OP -- we as taxpayers need to get rid of these cheats.

I would not listen to this advice. You don't know why those people missed clocking in or out. I'm sure there are instances when one forgets to do it. Or perhaps they had approved leave or an emergency. There may be a whole host of reasons. If you make a stink about it, and it turns out that you are wrong, then it only makes you look bad in the eyes of management and coworkers. If your management is only out this week, then even if these people are "cheating" things should go back to normal when management returns, right? Maybe you are presuming the worst. I think that managers, if they are on top of things, will come to realize who is working and not working. If not now, they will eventually.

Anonymous wrote:Who makes professionals sign in and out like that!?! Sounds like kindergarten.

And MYOB.

+1. Fed managers are the worst!!! Making people sign in and out and micromanaging their time instead of managing their actual work product.

Honestly, I wouldn't say anything about the time sheet per se. But I would let his supervisor know that you've seen on the sheet that X was in the office, but been unable to locate him when trying to schedule a meeting, etc. Just point out that others need to be able to rely on the time sheets.