I'm 25 almost 26 with 3 toddlers and one child in grade school. First child at 18 and the others followed within the next few years after. All of that to say:

1) I didn't sleep with random men that gave me compliments before DH and I don't need to sleep with them now.

2) An ego boost to me is, "Are all of those children yours? You look so young!" My reply, "Yes, they are". And then they reply, "Well, you look great!" An ego boost is NOT having sex with me that's an affair.

3) Not all people who have toddlers at a young age are as immature and selfish as the OP and his friends. I don't see where the couple in the original thread is anything that reflects perfection. Marriages aren't perfect-- and neither is mine-- but my husband and I don't do hall passes. If you want one, you will get divorce papers.

Anonymous wrote:If the woman is single, if she loves the married man and vice versa, if they are planning a future together, if the married man is separated* (living under the same roof as the wife but in separate rooms* while they prepare to inform their young kids about the upcoming divorce), if the man and his wife are indeed planning to divorce amicably* and have begun the divorce process*, and if the woman is concerned about her biological clock and doesn't want to wait for the divorce to be final, is it within the realm of reason for the woman to want and actively try to conceive a child with the married man (and for the married man to agree)? Or is it simply screwed up, crazy, stupid and selfish?

(*unverified beyond man's words and actions, but in all likelihood apparent to be true).

Wait until he is 1) Living in a separate residence. 2) Divorced 3) You have met his children enough times to have developed a positive loving relationship. The children who are already living should be the priority.

You are really obsessing over this guardian thing. The chances of you and your dh both dying at the same time is pretty slim. Does it happen? Yes, of course. Is it likely to happen, no.

Everyone has faults, everyone has baggage. If this woman is the best person you have to fall back on if a tragedy should strike, then so be it.

If she is basically a good person who genuinely loves, knows and spends time w/your kids that is the important thing. Of course, if she opts to detonate a bomb in her own life by involving herself with a married man and conceiving his child...her relationship with your kids might change and you might need to make other arrangements for guardianship. Good luck.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks. The woman is not pregnant, but they are trying to conceive, with the expectation that the divorce will take less than 9 months to be final. I did start a thread about her recently, in which I talked about the weird arrangement he and his wife are planning -- the kids will stay with the wife, and he will visit a couple of times a month -- and, even thought it wasn't her idea or her decision, the woman is happy about this plan because she doesn't want to be a step mother. Most (not all) posters agreed with my impression that it was a bizarre plan.

I care about her situation because I had named her as a guardian for my kids should something happen to me and my DH. When I mentioned that in the previous thread, most posters suggested that I consider a new guardian. We have really struggled with this issue because, despite appearances, she has always been an absolutely wonderful aunt to my kids, and a great person overall (at least prior to this affair) but this affair has revealed a side of her that I never expected to witness. We had decided to wait before changing guardians, as there is no clear alternative. But I just found out about their plan to actively try to conceive a baby before the divorce is final, and I am again troubled by her decision making process. It's as if she is different person when it comes to this affair. I am trying to think that, given her inexperience with matters of the heart, she is just being a temporary fool, and that she will at some point wake up. But perhaps I am being too optimistic and a charitable explanation to her behavior might be too unrealistic.

OP, your post is scary. you seem almost more concerned of your family member than your own kids. stop worrying about her. what she is doing is clearly a bad idea, on some many levels, as you and other posters have pointed out. but you have already talked to her, she does not listen, she is an adult and at the end responsible for her life. what it is scary is that you and your DH can have a car accident tomorrow (sorry for being blunt, but this is the reality), and next week your kids are shipped to this person's home, who does not want to be a step mother and is actively trying to get pregnant by a married buy still living with his wife, guy who is supposed to move in with her in less than a year. being a loving aunt and really very, very different than being a full time parent and your relative does not strike me like a person able to be a good, full time parent to your kids. she is likely going into a messy situation, do you want your kids there too? you can still love her without having her as your kids' guardian. think about your kids, and do it fast because you never know

Thanks. You are right: being a great aunt doesn't mean being a good full time parent, particularly in her situation. I know I need to change guardians. If DH or I had another family member in the position to be a good guardian, we would have made the change yesterday. But there are no obvious alternative candidates -- a couple of good friends, in (seemingly) good marriages with kids, but we are not that close. They would certainly be a little bit shocked if I asked them, and perhaps reluctant. Furthermore, DH says, "how can we know these friends don't have private family issues that makes them not ideal to be our kids' parental figures? We know of her messy situation, but who knows whether these friends don't have messy situations of their own that we don't know about?" I see his point. To me and DH, being a guardian is something you ask a family relative to be -- we feel like friends won't have the same devotion to our kids that a family member will have. We need to come to terms that won't be feasible here. I wish we had a larger extended family!

I am separated from my husband and he now has a child with his gf (the ow). My situation is not exactly like your friend's but I can share with you how this has affected my family and what I suspect is going on in their household. Of course, my dc's are angry and confused. My 7 yo asked why ow has a baby with her father when he is married to me. Older ds actually physically attacked his father one day when he announced he had to go home after a visit with dc's. I am confused and hurt bc he gave me very mixed signals about reconciliation. There was some part of me that wanted to have my family together if at all possible. If your friend thinks he isn't still sleeping with his wife while they are under the same roof, she is crazy. My husband attempted to have sex with me on multiple occassions while separated (no thanks). I had to make my husband tell our dc's about this baby bc I didn't want it to be some big secret that was sprung on them years later (which he would have been ok with). My dc's have not shared the information with anyone which tells you how they feel about the situation.

As for what is happening with them, I can only speculate but I know this man very well (I have know him for over 30 years). I noticed several months ago that he had begun drinking very heavily and later learned this is when she was in the early stages of her pregnancy. I guess he wasn't very excited about it. Shortly after this baby was born, he ran into one of my gf's who said he was acting like he was embarrassed (she didn't bring up the baby but he likely knew I had told her). I know for a fact she is pressuring him to marry her and he has told her he will divorce me and marry her BUT he has made no move in that direction and actually hems and haws when I suggest divorce mediation. For financial reasons, I won't push right now and am waiting for it to become an urgent issue for him.

It is a tawdry situation and I wouldn't wish it on anyone. You should share with your friend that even a physical separation won't ensure that she will be anything other than a baby mama. Perhaps she is ok with this but if she is wanting marriage, she should wait to have a baby until he is actually divorced and they are actually married. Also, she needs to be prepared to deal with the fallout re dc's from his marriage. I know how difficult this has been for my dc's and can only imagine the hell they are giving their father and his gf. People don't think about the reality of this choice when making a decision to have a baby with an unavailable man.

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks. The woman is not pregnant, but they are trying to conceive, with the expectation that the divorce will take less than 9 months to be final. I did start a thread about her recently, in which I talked about the weird arrangement he and his wife are planning -- the kids will stay with the wife, and he will visit a couple of times a month -- and, even thought it wasn't her idea or her decision, the woman is happy about this plan because she doesn't want to be a step mother. Most (not all) posters agreed with my impression that it was a bizarre plan.

I care about her situation because I had named her as a guardian for my kids should something happen to me and my DH. When I mentioned that in the previous thread, most posters suggested that I consider a new guardian. We have really struggled with this issue because, despite appearances, she has always been an absolutely wonderful aunt to my kids, and a great person overall (at least prior to this affair) but this affair has revealed a side of her that I never expected to witness. We had decided to wait before changing guardians, as there is no clear alternative. But I just found out about their plan to actively try to conceive a baby before the divorce is final, and I am again troubled by her decision making process. It's as if she is different person when it comes to this affair. I am trying to think that, given her inexperience with matters of the heart, she is just being a temporary fool, and that she will at some point wake up. But perhaps I am being too optimistic and a charitable explanation to her behavior might be too unrealistic.

OP, your post is scary. you seem almost more concerned of your family member than your own kids. stop worrying about her. what she is doing is clearly a bad idea, on some many levels, as you and other posters have pointed out. but you have already talked to her, she does not listen, she is an adult and at the end responsible for her life. what it is scary is that you and your DH can have a car accident tomorrow (sorry for being blunt, but this is the reality), and next week your kids are shipped to this person's home, who does not want to be a step mother and is actively trying to get pregnant by a married buy still living with his wife, guy who is supposed to move in with her in less than a year. being a loving aunt and really very, very different than being a full time parent and your relative does not strike me like a person able to be a good, full time parent to your kids. she is likely going into a messy situation, do you want your kids there too? you can still love her without having her as your kids' guardian. think about your kids, and do it fast because you never know

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Oh man I remember that other thread. The real concern here is her almost pathological lack of concern for the kids, and her stated unwillingness to be a stepmother. How is she going to feel when he goes and stays at the other family's house when she has an infant?

She sees no problem with it. More or less in her words, "it's good that he goes take care of his kids twice a month. That way, I can keep part of my independence." I think it's a self-centered (and overly optimistic) answer, to say the least. That is the point: everything is self-centered. As I mentioned, if I had been asked before the affair, I would have said that she is a wonderful person and the best aunt in the world. I don't know why she is thinking so selfishly. I think she waited too long to live this -- a strong relationship with whom she calls "the man of her life." She now wants to live things she never experienced in the past, and doesn't want to wait. I am sure she wishes the best for his kids, but right know they are not the priority -- her new experiences are her priority. At the appropriate time, would she be able and willing to be a loving stepmother? I do think so, but obvio

We can't easily change guardians because, despite these flaws, we don't see an alternative person whom we could trust with our kids.

Once she has an infant she won't want him to leave so his other kids will be seriously short-changed.
No one is thinking about them, not even their own mother who dreamed up this ridiculous plan.

I'd find another guardian. You can always switch it back if she comes to her senses; but why chance putting your kids in this situation?

Let all babies come into this world. Sounds like they both want the baby, so it is OK
As long as the baby is wanted and loved

Anonymous wrote:Tell him you're pregnant & how you're looking forward to your life together. He'll probably faint

Apparently he is on board, and very excited about the prospect of having a kid with her. (At least the are on the same page! I think they are even going together to Ob-gyn appointments.)

Anonymous wrote:I would give up on reasoning w/ this woman and I would find another guardian. You can't save people from themselves, but you sure can save your children from having to grow up w/ her.

In my heart of hearts I know this is true. It's just sad to "demote" my kids's only aunt who, until this affair, was their "second mom," to such a relegated position.

Tell him you're pregnant & how you're looking forward to your life together. He'll probably faint

Anonymous wrote:You are too naive for motherhood If you have to asterisk your future with a man, you have no future

+1000

^^ family home

By all accounts, he is madly in love with her (or madly in lust, or madly infatuated, depending on interpretation). He wants to have a child with her, although it sounds like he is more inclined to wait a little bit longer than she is. He sees no problem introducing a new sibling to his kids shortly after (or even shortly before!) divorcing and living the family huh one, and kids, behind.