Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought Indian parents are Asian parents? Isn't India in Asia?

Yes but in American we call them Indian because only Koreans, Japanese, and Chinese are "Asian". Oh, and Russia's mostly in Asia too but no one calls them Asians.

Sorry, people from countries in eastern Asia that aren't South Korea, Japan, or China...

My closest Desi friends:

Pakistani Friend #1 - MD
Pakistani Friend #2 - Pharmacist
Indian Friend #3- Engineer
Pakistani Friends 4 and 5- MDs
Indian Friend #6 - Computer Engineering

Me (Non-Indian): Picked an easy undergrad and grad degree with crappy lifetime earnings potential. Should have followed the Desi route with STEM and not given up!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Calm down. No secret. Hard work. Intact family. Hard work. Educated parents. Hard work.

Lots of Western families esp in this area that work hard, have a traditional nuclear family, and are well educated -- but by and large you don't see them dominating academic contests and college admissions across the board -- so there's obviously something else there. I think it's just a culture of hard work, competition, and expectation within the whole community. When there is CONSTANT talk at every family party about how so-and-so just graduated Harvard Med and got a residency at Stanford and that's the best thing ever, and the kids hear that talk since birth -- it lights a bit of a fire as those kids start to think, that's what I want too.

I know in many Indian households it is common to make an "example" out of an older cousin or friend -- i.e. your cousin x was getting certain grades/scores/awards, that's what got him into MIT, just getting by with straight As won't be enough for MIT.

i don't think there's anything else there. What about the Western families whose kids are dominating in sports? You think that's not the result of hard work, competition, and expectation within the whole community? You don't think that Western families are talking about how cousin Johnny earned a football scholarship, and that's the best thing ever, and kids hear that talk since birth, and think, that's what I want too?

It was established a few pages ago that what Indians are doing for academics, white and black families are doing for sports scholarships -- hard work, lots of time, energy and money on camps and being seen by the right coaches; and stories and expectations that live on forever by the older ones who were recruited, went pro etc.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Calm down. No secret. Hard work. Intact family. Hard work. Educated parents. Hard work.

Lots of Western families esp in this area that work hard, have a traditional nuclear family, and are well educated -- but by and large you don't see them dominating academic contests and college admissions across the board -- so there's obviously something else there. I think it's just a culture of hard work, competition, and expectation within the whole community. When there is CONSTANT talk at every family party about how so-and-so just graduated Harvard Med and got a residency at Stanford and that's the best thing ever, and the kids hear that talk since birth -- it lights a bit of a fire as those kids start to think, that's what I want too.

I know in many Indian households it is common to make an "example" out of an older cousin or friend -- i.e. your cousin x was getting certain grades/scores/awards, that's what got him into MIT, just getting by with straight As won't be enough for MIT.

i don't think there's anything else there. What about the Western families whose kids are dominating in sports? You think that's not the result of hard work, competition, and expectation within the whole community? You don't think that Western families are talking about how cousin Johnny earned a football scholarship, and that's the best thing ever, and kids hear that talk since birth, and think, that's what I want too?

Anonymous wrote:Calm down. No secret. Hard work. Intact family. Hard work. Educated parents. Hard work.

Lots of Western families esp in this area that work hard, have a traditional nuclear family, and are well educated -- but by and large you don't see them dominating academic contests and college admissions across the board -- so there's obviously something else there. I think it's just a culture of hard work, competition, and expectation within the whole community. When there is CONSTANT talk at every family party about how so-and-so just graduated Harvard Med and got a residency at Stanford and that's the best thing ever, and the kids hear that talk since birth -- it lights a bit of a fire as those kids start to think, that's what I want too.

I know in many Indian households it is common to make an "example" out of an older cousin or friend -- i.e. your cousin x was getting certain grades/scores/awards, that's what got him into MIT, just getting by with straight As won't be enough for MIT.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:http://proto-knowledge.blogspot.com/2011/01/asian-vs-western-parenting-styles-and.html

""Asian" parents start with the premisse that their children's self-esteem will build up with improving performance. "Asian" parents believe that nothing is fun until you're good at it. To get good at anything you have to work hard, and as children on their own often do not want to work, they override their preferences. "Asian" parents see the academic success of their children as the result of successful parenting, and failure in school is therefore not the child's (or the school's) fault but the parent's. "Asian" parents can order their kids to get top grades. "Western" parents can only ask their kids to try their best. "

In my experience, the bolded parts are very true. Asian kids aren't given the freedom other kids have because Asian parents believe they know best. Secondly, a child bringing home an unacceptable grade is seen as a mistake by the parent, rather than a mistake of the child. Therefore, the parents become much more concerned about addressing the problem and making sure it does not happen again.

+1. To put it differently -- in (typical) Indian families it is all about working as hard as possible. If you can study for 30 min and get an A but for 3 hrs to get an A+, you are absolutely expected to put in the 3 hrs for the A+, even though there is little marginal difference in achievement. It is not about "trying your best" or an "A for effort" -- it's about being the absolute best in the class. I am Indian and was raised this way. I'm not saying it's perfect and it does lead to issues with feeling like nothing is ever enough, but all in all, it is not a bad way to raise kids and frankly, I see some "Western" families who could benefit from this approach.

My parents' view was -- go get that degree from an ivy and a certain baseline level of experience in your profession; if you end up not using that degree forever because something else appeals to you, fine, but you will always have it and no one can take that away.

Calm down. No secret. Hard work. Intact family. Hard work. Educated parents. Hard work.

Anonymous wrote:Ha ha - divorce and step families are much less common, but fighting goes on like crazy in Indian families!

Yes, and it sucks if you outlive your husband:
http://articles.latimes.com/2012/oct/16/world/la-fg-india-widows-20121016

Divorce would be much more humane.

Anonymous wrote:Ancient Chinese Secret.

Seriously, it's not genetic, and it's not even exactly cultural. It's US immigration policies related to what's called the "brain drain"-- basically well-educated immigrants are fast tracked through immigration. A lot of these parents are PhDs... Or the children of them.

According to Census data, the average Asian immigrant (and the average African immigrant) to the US is more likely than the average American to have a college degree. The best predictor of a child's performance in school is the mother's educational level. India has about a 50 percent high school attendance rate now, and in the 80's, when some of today's parents were in college, it was 25 percent. The people you are meeting here in the US are people who did really well for themselves,often against long odds, in India's educational system. They aren't a random sample.

Also, one reason that South Asians tend to do well in competitions like spelling bees is that general knowledge contests are very popular in India, and have been for decades.

I think that spelling contests and geography bees are fun, and the kids do learn some skills, but ultimately, such contests fell out of vogue here in the US because they don't represent higher order thinking skills. I did some spelling contests in high school, and for all of the talk about "learning Greek and Latin roots", doing well in spelling is about memorization, as English is so irregular that those Greek and Latin roots can be spelled in a couple of ways. Learning a romance language was great for learning Latin roots. I also found my days on the speech and debating team in high school to be much more useful in terms of teaching me to structure a presentation or an argument, research skills, and presentation skills.

Ha ha - divorce and step families are much less common, but fighting goes on like crazy in Indian families!

Most Indians also have stable family lives. Mom and Dad will not split up and mess up the kids. It is very comforting for children to know that they do not have to deal with divorce or fighting, or step-families.

I don't know if that has an impact on academic performance, but I am guessing that it would?

Sorry bright not right.

I can tell right away one of your issues. You start by saying your child is very right. The eastern parenting focuses less on smarts and more on hard work and triumph over difficulties. Smarts only get you so far. Your kid has to work hard, fail and keep trying. Reward her hard work and effort rather than telling her she is smart.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:...Indians do not push their kids to satisfy their own ego...

read on DCUM that some Indians think they're a superior race/people.

And most people here know that there's a lot of garbage written on DCUM that isn't true.

I am Indian. It does not matter what I think. All that matters is if I can convince you that I am from a superior race.

Anonymous wrote:http://proto-knowledge.blogspot.com/2011/01/asian-vs-western-parenting-styles-and.html

""Asian" parents start with the premisse that their children's self-esteem will build up with improving performance. "Asian" parents believe that nothing is fun until you're good at it. To get good at anything you have to work hard, and as children on their own often do not want to work, they override their preferences. "Asian" parents see the academic success of their children as the result of successful parenting, and failure in school is therefore not the child's (or the school's) fault but the parent's. "Asian" parents can order their kids to get top grades. "Western" parents can only ask their kids to try their best. "

In my experience, the bolded parts are very true. Asian kids aren't given the freedom other kids have because Asian parents believe they know best. Secondly, a child bringing home an unacceptable grade is seen as a mistake by the parent, rather than a mistake of the child. Therefore, the parents become much more concerned about addressing the problem and making sure it does not happen again.