Anonymous wrote:is the study showing that Schizophrenia correlates with pot, or is it causative?

after reading the link I found the abstract here:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2424288/

"This hypothesis assumes that cannabis use is one factor among many others (including genetic predisposition and other unknown causes) that together cause schizophrenia.
There are also other possible explanations of the association. Common factors may increase the risk of cannabis use and psychosis, without the two being directly related. Cannabis could also be used to self-medicate the symptoms of schizophrenia"

"Given this evidence, has the incidence of schizophrenia, particularly early-onset acute cases, changed during the 1970s and 1980s, when there have been very substantial increases in cannabis use among young adults in Australia and North America?" The answer was "NO"

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't get addicted to pot.
I might just call MCPD and let them deal with it.

Tell my brother that..........if you can get him to stop smoking he is now 55 smokes everyday because................ wait for it, he is addicted.

ok go on.

NO HES NOT! He is mentally attached not physically. Understand how THC works and you will know this to be true! Chemistry and biology do not lie!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't get addicted to pot.
I might just call MCPD and let them deal with it.

Tell my brother that..........if you can get him to stop smoking he is now 55 smokes everyday because................ wait for it, he is addicted.

ok go on.

clearly this poster meant physically addictive- because it is not- if you brother were to stop, his body would not go through withdrawals, he has not built up a chemical dependency... he is more than likely emotionally addicted- like some are to candy crush...

Anonymous wrote:You don't get addicted to pot.
I might just call MCPD and let them deal with it.

Tell my brother that..........if you can get him to stop smoking he is now 55 smokes everyday because................ wait for it, he is addicted.

ok go on.

Anonymous wrote:PP, thanks for your detailed responses. Since DD didn't express any strong opposition and I do occasionally struggle with the idea that I'm not the parent figure DD needs in her life, I think family therapy is worth a try.

I realize that the line about not bailing her out may seem harsh and unnecessary. What I was trying to imply is that while I can't control everything DD does away from my presence, where I can no longer strictly enforce my zero tolerance rule, the police still can. I wanted to remind her that pot is still illegal (and even when the activists get their way, it will surely remain illegal for minors). I let her know that I trust her to make the right call when she's out with her friend, which she seemed to appreciate. Still, while I will always love her no matter what happens, she is old enough to face the consequences of her own mistakes.

I agree that DD's safety and trust are both important priorities, but I also can't give her the green light to go get high outside of the house. Thanks again for your advice. I think you have your heart in the right place.

No problem! And I am in total agreement that you should not be giving her permission to go out and get high outside the house. It was pretty clear to me, as a teenager, that while my mom (also a single mom) was NOT supportive of me using drugs, she understood that they were around even among the "good" kids at school. I think a lot of my friend's parents would have been completely shocked to find out how much alcohol/pot/harder drugs were used by, for example, our class president. My mom knew if I was going to a party on a Friday night that there would likely be (at the very least) beer at that party. This was in the late 90s. I can only imagine the extent to which that's true now.

You sound like a good mom. My daughter is 3, but I hope I'm as thoughtful and patient as you seem to be when she is a teenager. Good luck with this situation!

PP, thanks for your detailed responses. Since DD didn't express any strong opposition and I do occasionally struggle with the idea that I'm not the parent figure DD needs in her life, I think family therapy is worth a try.

I realize that the line about not bailing her out may seem harsh and unnecessary. What I was trying to imply is that while I can't control everything DD does away from my presence, where I can no longer strictly enforce my zero tolerance rule, the police still can. I wanted to remind her that pot is still illegal (and even when the activists get their way, it will surely remain illegal for minors). I let her know that I trust her to make the right call when she's out with her friend, which she seemed to appreciate. Still, while I will always love her no matter what happens, she is old enough to face the consequences of her own mistakes.

I agree that DD's safety and trust are both important priorities, but I also can't give her the green light to go get high outside of the house. Thanks again for your advice. I think you have your heart in the right place.

Anonymous wrote:OP, I feel pretty strongly that you should ignore this advice, especially about therapy. PP is acting as if seeking therapy is a sign of weakness, or "brokenness". My DD had depression. It is not something you want to wait on and it is not something you want to deal with yourself. If she spent a month coughing, you would take her to a doctor. You wouldn't see it as a sign of "brokenness." This is no different. Its already possible that she's starting to self-medicate.

Sure, you don't have to assume the Dad is a "dangerous creep," but there's plenty of reason to consider it a possibility and stop him from getting high with your DD.

I'm the PP who gave the advice you think OP should ignore, and I actually do not totally disagree with what you've said. I also remember what it was like to change schools in high school and move to a community that was very different from where I grew up. It was hard. Social structures are already set by the time you get into high school, much less by 2nd to last year. It was hard for me to make friends with a group of kids who were very different from my previous friends. I spent a lot of time in MY room and would have been pretty heartbroken and likely to spend MORE time in my room if my mom told me that I could not spend time with the only friend I did have.

I wasn't saying " don't send her to therapy because it means you're weak or a terrible parent or there's something wrong with DD". I was just suggesting that given the life upheaval OP's DD has been through, I would expect some withdrawn-ness and acting out to be normal. It sounded to me like OP and her daughter have the kind of relationship where OP could just talk to her daughter and offer to send her to therapy if she thought it would help. This girl is 17 years old, not 12. She's nearly an adult and should absolutely have some agency in her own mental healthcare decisions.

I also agree that the friend's dad should not be getting high with OP's daughter. I just don't think that his willingness to do that is a clear indication that he's some kind of pothead pervert. If anything, it's a case for the OP getting to know her daughter's friend's parents.

OP, as for your statement about "not bailing her out if she gets arrested", I personally have mixed feelings on the subject. I worry that if your daughter is going to engage in experimentation, she could easily end up in situations that are uncomfortable or dangerous and the hard line approach will prevent her from calling you for help. As a parent, I would rather my child trust me enough to call me if they were scared or feeling unsafe. Obviously, this is not a popular approach and I accept that people probably disagree with me.

Anonymous wrote:OP, I think you sound like a great mom and I'm sorry that this transition has been so hard.

First of all, I would not be concerned that you immediately need to send your daughter to therapy. Since you have such a good relationship, you might ask her if she WANTS to go, but feeling isolated after a move to a very different area at the age she is is totally normal. Experimenting with drugs at her age is also pretty normal, and given that you guys were in CA before, probably pot is not as taboo to her as it may be to many people. These things combined would not be enough for me personally to take a hardline stance about therapy. If she wants to go, that's great. If she doesn't, don't force her. She's not BROKEN, she's adjusting after a life shake-up.

Secondly, I disagree with the many PPs who have characterized your daughter's friend's dad as some kind of sick person for getting high with his daughter. Clearly this is pretty normal for this family. My dad smoked pot when I was young (and still does as far as I know). We did not get high together, but I know he has smoked with my brother. I personally am not a fan of the effects, which is probably the only reason. My father and I have certainly had more than a few glasses of wine or cups of coffee together. The people who are up in arms about how pot is DIFFERENT are, in my opinion, overreacting. I think it's important to convey to your daughter the legal aspects that are dangerous. I think it's also important not to assume that her friend's dad is a creep unless there is other more compelling evidence that this is the case. I think it would be totally appropriate for you to have a conversation with the parents saying that you are not okay with them allowing your daughter to use drugs at their house, regardless of whether it's normal for their family, and that you find it disrespectful that they did this without talking to you about it first to get your permission. There's a big difference between thinking that someone made a really bad parenting call and that person being some sort of dangerous creep.

Lastly, I would steer very clear of telling your daughter that she's not allowed to associate with her friend. Taking away your daughter's only close friendship seems pretty drastic and likely to lead to more problems. I think it's probably time to have a(nother) pretty serious and specific conversation about intoxication and peer pressure with your daughter. What my mom did was to set up some pretty clear safety-based ground rules (if you're going to drink, get your own drinks, don't accept anything from anyone you don't know, if you leave your drink for a time, dump it and get a fresh one, always have an exit strategy, use the buddy system, have a designated driver, etc.) and impress upon me that no matter what I was into, it was always okay to call her if I needed help. She trusted my judgment and for the most part, I did not abuse that trust.

OP, I feel pretty strongly that you should ignore this advice, especially about therapy. PP is acting as if seeking therapy is a sign of weakness, or "brokenness". My DD had depression. It is not something you want to wait on and it is not something you want to deal with yourself. If she spent a month coughing, you would take her to a doctor. You wouldn't see it as a sign of "brokenness." This is no different. Its already possible that she's starting to self-medicate.

Sure, you don't have to assume the Dad is a "dangerous creep," but there's plenty of reason to consider it a possibility and stop him from getting high with your DD.

OP again. I called her friend's home this morning and talked to her mom, who let me know that dad is at work but they will make sure they won't provide any more means for DD to get high. Mom seemed very reasonable, and suggested that I call again after dinner or even come over to their home to talk with both of them, especially since she wasn't the one who smoked with DD.

I also had a talk with DD over lunch, and overall I think it went well. I told her that she can hang out with her friend as long as they don't go to her house (for now) or get in the car with someone high driving. This definitely cheered her up, and she immediately seemed more animated and talkative than before. She said she understands why I feel uncomfortable letting her go to their house, but hopes that after I visit their home and talk to both parents, I might change my mind. I've had the "drugs/alcohol talk" with her before, and reiterated again that she must educate herself before making unwise decisions and that when it comes to drugs. I reminded her that I have a zero tolerance policy regarding what I have the power to enforce (i.e. no drugs under my roof or in my presence, ever), along with the usual "I won't bail you out if you get arrested." DD said she understands and doesn't want to disappoint me, and will continue to be honest about her mistakes as long as I promise not to overreact.

DD responded enthusiastically to my suggestion of volunteering at a local SPCA (she immediately started googling local chapters on her phone), so thanks to the poster who suggested that! She has been begging me to visit friends in San Francisco over summer or winter break, which I told her she can do if she can make enough money to pay for the plane tickets and provides the address and home phone numbers of the friends she will stay with. In the mean time, I'm hoping that whatever job she finds to raise funds will help her meet co-workers in her age group, along with the volunteering.

I suggested a family therapist at the end of the conversation, and DD seemed to doubt it's effectiveness but said she's willing to give it a try. She said that she wants the therapist chosen for her to be a joint decision, which I agreed with, so we will begin our search together soon.

I'm not sure if DD is trying to fit in with the "popular" crowd. Instead, she seems to actively reject a lot of the popular kids at school, and insists that the new school is a lot more socially stratified. DD was always popular as far as I could tell, but that didn't mean that she was at the top of the social totem pole with the designer wardrobe... it just meant that she had a very diverse group of friends from many different social groups. Realistically, I don't think this can happen at her new school. I want DD to learn to appreciate the friends she has right now instead of longing for the past, which I believe a therapist could help with if she doesn't come to that realization on her own.

Anonymous wrote:Actually, we all did. It wasn't a big deal. My kids also drank beer, cider and such.

Yeah pp. And how has that turned out for you and all concerned? Never mind, I doubt you will answer honestly. If you can't see that you're an outlier with this experience and that your little anecdote about what you did does not necessarily apply to most people, well, *sigh*

Really??? If my daughter told me that she was smoking pot with the friend's DAD, it would be the last time my daughter would EVER visit that family. It is one thing if a good friend (teenager) was experimenting with pot and my DD "tried it" with her. While I would be pissed and my DD would be grounded for a long time, I would not forbid my DD to see that friend again if I thought it was youthful stupidity (good family).

Sounds like your daughter might be trying to fit into the popular crowd. From a PP think she might be a cheerleader. Advice before it is too late, please remember that often the popular kids flame out. It's the nerds that rule the world . My daughter is best friends with all the nerds and they are sweet, sweet little girls.

OP, I think you sound like a great mom and I'm sorry that this transition has been so hard.

First of all, I would not be concerned that you immediately need to send your daughter to therapy. Since you have such a good relationship, you might ask her if she WANTS to go, but feeling isolated after a move to a very different area at the age she is is totally normal. Experimenting with drugs at her age is also pretty normal, and given that you guys were in CA before, probably pot is not as taboo to her as it may be to many people. These things combined would not be enough for me personally to take a hardline stance about therapy. If she wants to go, that's great. If she doesn't, don't force her. She's not BROKEN, she's adjusting after a life shake-up.

Secondly, I disagree with the many PPs who have characterized your daughter's friend's dad as some kind of sick person for getting high with his daughter. Clearly this is pretty normal for this family. My dad smoked pot when I was young (and still does as far as I know). We did not get high together, but I know he has smoked with my brother. I personally am not a fan of the effects, which is probably the only reason. My father and I have certainly had more than a few glasses of wine or cups of coffee together. The people who are up in arms about how pot is DIFFERENT are, in my opinion, overreacting. I think it's important to convey to your daughter the legal aspects that are dangerous. I think it's also important not to assume that her friend's dad is a creep unless there is other more compelling evidence that this is the case. I think it would be totally appropriate for you to have a conversation with the parents saying that you are not okay with them allowing your daughter to use drugs at their house, regardless of whether it's normal for their family, and that you find it disrespectful that they did this without talking to you about it first to get your permission. There's a big difference between thinking that someone made a really bad parenting call and that person being some sort of dangerous creep.

Lastly, I would steer very clear of telling your daughter that she's not allowed to associate with her friend. Taking away your daughter's only close friendship seems pretty drastic and likely to lead to more problems. I think it's probably time to have a(nother) pretty serious and specific conversation about intoxication and peer pressure with your daughter. What my mom did was to set up some pretty clear safety-based ground rules (if you're going to drink, get your own drinks, don't accept anything from anyone you don't know, if you leave your drink for a time, dump it and get a fresh one, always have an exit strategy, use the buddy system, have a designated driver, etc.) and impress upon me that no matter what I was into, it was always okay to call her if I needed help. She trusted my judgment and for the most part, I did not abuse that trust.

Anonymous wrote:The problem isn't pot, thats a symptom. The problem is that it sounds like your DD is depressed, and is therefore drawn to pot, as well as isolating herself. She's not happy and thats the part you have to fix. I don't know if she'd be willing to see a therapist, but thats probably what she needs.

Smoking pot with the father is creepy and wrong and it has to end. You can call the father and say that what he does with his daughter is his business, but he cannot smoke pot with yours. Seriously, there are plenty of things other kids' parents wouldn't think of doing with someone's child without asking their permission. This should be high on the list.

Sure, everyone will be mad but if this guy thinks its OK to smoke pot with another child, he deserves what he gets. I would call the police if he doesn't heed your warning. But tell your daughter as well -- an adults are not supposed to do this kind of lecture -- so that she knows that HER conduct could get them in trouble.

The fact that your daughter is not eating and is spending time alone is a concern. And this creep should not be respected in any way shape or form.

^ listen to this!

What kind of father would smoke weed with his kids friends? wtf

Anonymous wrote:I think many of you are focusing too such on the pot and missing the wider dynamic. Yes, most kids experiment and its not entirely a bad thing -- they learn their limits while under your roof. HOWEVER, this should not be encouraged by parents, only recognized. I recommend Wendy Mogel's Lessons of a B-. She uses the Colbert term "truthiness" to describe her advice about parents and experimentation. Let your child know there are limits --because all teens need limits -- and that this is not something you condone, while recognize that they will go ahead and experiment anyway. Talk to them about safety because ultimately that is the biggest concern.

But thats not really the issue here. The issue here is twofold: OP's DD is showing signs of depression. This is not something that will go away on its own and pot will make it worse. Its fine to gab about how pot is just fine for most kids but OP's DD is not most kids -- she's a very vulnerable kid and the pot is going to make the situation worse.

Second, the other father is showing a shocking lack of boundaries which is a big red flag. He's a creep, and you have to wonder about the other ways in which he might not have boundaries. This is absolutely a situation in which OP's DD must be protected.

Finally, OP has issues of her own with respect to her DD. She is too invested in their friendship and in wanting her DD to have friends so that she isn't setting the proper boundaries of her own. All of this is understandable but OP has lost sight of the ways in which she is accommodating her DD's unhealthy situation rather than trying to change it. Both need professional support.

Also this.