Anonymous wrote:I go to drop-off and pickup every day at Oakland Terrace Elementary and talk to moms all around me and no one has ever mentioned disliking the curriculum. I am not the pp, but I agree that DCUM seems like a whole other world than my world on this question. My child has made tremendous progress this year in writing, reading, and math.

Who talks about that stuff at drop off and pickup? I know a lot of parents in our neighborhood who dislike the curriculum, but you only hear them talk about it at PTA meetings on the subject or when they are withdrawing their child from school and going private and even then parents will often say "it just wasn't a good fit" or when you are comparing notes about difficulties with close friends.

PP@13:40: Please explain what you want MCPS to do about this. Please also explain a way to split Montgomery County into two or three parts that is actually politically feasible.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well it strikes me that 2.0 is an effective way to deal with capacity issues. Hearing that families are fleeing the system probably doesn't bring a tear to the eyes of MCPS administrators who would see a pretty big problem solved if, say, 20% of current students left the public system in favor of private.

(Note: I am the PP who does not work for MCPS.)

K-5 enrollment is 68,332. There are 132 elementary schools, so the mean number of students per elementary school is 518. 20% of 68,332 is 13,667. Do you think that 13,667 students (equivalent to the enrollment at 26 average-sized elementary schools) are going to leave MCPS and go to private school because of 2.0?

(By the way, which private elementary schools in the area have the capacity for 13,667 more students?)

Also keep in mind that overall, 33% of MCPS students have FARMS status. Let's assume that's 33% of K-5 enrollment as well. That's 22,550 elementary school students whose parents almost certainly cannot afford private school. So the 13,667 elementary students are actually a subset of the 45,782 students who do not have FARMS status. In other words, 30% of K-5 elementary students who do not have FARMS status will leave MCPS and go to private school because of 2.0.

Alternatively, 42% of MCPS students have had FARMS status at some point. Let's make the same assumptions. 42% of K-5 enrollment, 29,041 students can't afford private school, 39,291 maybe can, 13,667 is 35% of 39,291 -- so 35% of K-5 elementary students who have never had FARMS status will leave MCPS and go to private school because of 2.0?

I actually this is kind of fun. But meanwhile, you all really need to get out more. There are a million people in Montgomery County. You and your friends and acquaintances are not a representative sample. (Mine aren't either.)

Nail on the head: MoCo is too large to be one single county, it should be split into 2 or 3.
It can't service any of its constituents well and that is the whole purpose of localized government. Props they thing they can gravy trim Bethesda for all their pet projects elsewhere, but those people are the most mobile.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well it strikes me that 2.0 is an effective way to deal with capacity issues. Hearing that families are fleeing the system probably doesn't bring a tear to the eyes of MCPS administrators who would see a pretty big problem solved if, say, 20% of current students left the public system in favor of private.

(Note: I am the PP who does not work for MCPS.)

K-5 enrollment is 68,332. There are 132 elementary schools, so the mean number of students per elementary school is 518. 20% of 68,332 is 13,667. Do you think that 13,667 students (equivalent to the enrollment at 26 average-sized elementary schools) are going to leave MCPS and go to private school because of 2.0?

(By the way, which private elementary schools in the area have the capacity for 13,667 more students?)

Also keep in mind that overall, 33% of MCPS students have FARMS status. Let's assume that's 33% of K-5 enrollment as well. That's 22,550 elementary school students whose parents almost certainly cannot afford private school. So the 13,667 elementary students are actually a subset of the 45,782 students who do not have FARMS status. In other words, 30% of K-5 elementary students who do not have FARMS status will leave MCPS and go to private school because of 2.0.

Alternatively, 42% of MCPS students have had FARMS status at some point. Let's make the same assumptions. 42% of K-5 enrollment, 29,041 students can't afford private school, 39,291 maybe can, 13,667 is 35% of 39,291 -- so 35% of K-5 elementary students who have never had FARMS status will leave MCPS and go to private school because of 2.0?

I actually this is kind of fun. But meanwhile, you all really need to get out more. There are a million people in Montgomery County. You and your friends and acquaintances are not a representative sample. (Mine aren't either.)

I was the poster who said 2.0 was an effective way to deal with capacity issues. This was my first post on this thread. I was just making a joke. No analysis needed My kids aren't even in the MCPS system yet and I don't really know anything about 2.0 or have anything with which to compare it. I don't actually think it will result in this kind of mass exodus, it's just funny to read some of the posts that complain about capacity as a problem, and then see posts about how 2.0 is driving families away.

Anonymous wrote:Well it strikes me that 2.0 is an effective way to deal with capacity issues. Hearing that families are fleeing the system probably doesn't bring a tear to the eyes of MCPS administrators who would see a pretty big problem solved if, say, 20% of current students left the public system in favor of private.

And yet enrollment is increasing at public schools. We are in the Whitman cluster where many people could afford private but choose public. The school is over capacity.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kids went through ES pre-2.0 and there was only ever 1 teacher conference per year. There are 2 1/2 days over Veterans Day..same as now. Teachers/parents could of course request more if there was an issue..I am VERY impressed that a teacher gave up there own time to schedule multiple conferences during the year for every child.. I would not expect to ever find another teacher like that I am sorry to say.

I agree-- we've only ever had 1 parent-teacher conference, which always seemed a shame to me as I would like more feedback when the teachers know the kids better, but I guess it is a lot of effort to schedule them for 25 kids.

Do parent-teacher conferences stop in MS or HS?

Definitely aren't any in HS. Kids have 7 different teachers each day. Each teacher can have 150 students over the course of the day. With edline we feel like we know what's going on and could contact the counselor if there was a problem.

Anonymous wrote:Well it strikes me that 2.0 is an effective way to deal with capacity issues. Hearing that families are fleeing the system probably doesn't bring a tear to the eyes of MCPS administrators who would see a pretty big problem solved if, say, 20% of current students left the public system in favor of private.

(Note: I am the PP who does not work for MCPS.)

K-5 enrollment is 68,332. There are 132 elementary schools, so the mean number of students per elementary school is 518. 20% of 68,332 is 13,667. Do you think that 13,667 students (equivalent to the enrollment at 26 average-sized elementary schools) are going to leave MCPS and go to private school because of 2.0?

(By the way, which private elementary schools in the area have the capacity for 13,667 more students?)

Also keep in mind that overall, 33% of MCPS students have FARMS status. Let's assume that's 33% of K-5 enrollment as well. That's 22,550 elementary school students whose parents almost certainly cannot afford private school. So the 13,667 elementary students are actually a subset of the 45,782 students who do not have FARMS status. In other words, 30% of K-5 elementary students who do not have FARMS status will leave MCPS and go to private school because of 2.0.

Alternatively, 42% of MCPS students have had FARMS status at some point. Let's make the same assumptions. 42% of K-5 enrollment, 29,041 students can't afford private school, 39,291 maybe can, 13,667 is 35% of 39,291 -- so 35% of K-5 elementary students who have never had FARMS status will leave MCPS and go to private school because of 2.0?

I actually this is kind of fun. But meanwhile, you all really need to get out more. There are a million people in Montgomery County. You and your friends and acquaintances are not a representative sample. (Mine aren't either.)

Well it strikes me that 2.0 is an effective way to deal with capacity issues. Hearing that families are fleeing the system probably doesn't bring a tear to the eyes of MCPS administrators who would see a pretty big problem solved if, say, 20% of current students left the public system in favor of private.

I go to drop-off and pickup every day at Oakland Terrace Elementary and talk to moms all around me and no one has ever mentioned disliking the curriculum. I am not the pp, but I agree that DCUM seems like a whole other world than my world on this question. My child has made tremendous progress this year in writing, reading, and math.

Anonymous wrote:I don't believe you don't know a person who hates 2.0. This in itself makes me believe you work for MCPS.

Yeesh. Is there anything else you deny? How do you feel about Obama's birth certificate, the 9-11 bombings, and the moon landing?

I don't believe you don't know a person who hates 2.0. This in itself makes me believe you work for MCPS.

Anonymous wrote:18:29 People probably think you work for MCPS because you are parroting the same inappropriate comments that MCPS officials seem to make with great frequency. A parent who likes 2.0 and I honestly haven't met any would talk more about their child not the bureaucratic line.

You think I work for MCPS because why? Because I don't find the P/I/N grading system any less informative than the letter grading system? Because I don't think that grades should be a major motivation for elementary school students? (I don't think I've ever heard MCPS say that.) Because I point out things that people say about 2.0 (fewer parent/teacher conferences! assessment based solely on observation!) that aren't true? Because I said that people tend to complain about change, even if it's for the better?

But ok, I will talk about my child. I was in a panic about 2.0 at the beginning of the school year, because of all the dire things I'd read on DCUM. What was the reality? Compared to my pre-2.0 first grader, my 2.0 first grader is getting more and better social studies, more and better science, more and better writing, more interesting things to read, more emphasis on basic math facts, and less prep for standardized tests.

Does that persuade you, or will you continue to refuse that there could be such a thing as a parent who likes 2.0, just because you personally haven't met any?

I personally haven't met any parent who hates 2.0. I nonetheless believe that they exist.

Again: you (collective you who believe that everybody hates 2.0) need to get out more.

Anonymous wrote:You are not alone. I have a kindergartener in the BCC cluster. I, too, moved out of the District for the so-called wonderful schools. My child's kindergarten class has 25 kids, no aide, and one recess. Maybe this is the same in neighboring regions, I just don't know. I beginning to think that all the "greatness" of MCPS is simply the high-SES concentration. These are kids who are going to probably test well regardless of where they go to school. I could be wrong, but my sense is that MCPS used to be better. If I had to do it again, I'd move to Virginia where I hear the class sizes are smaller. I also detect a lot of racism, classism and other forms of snobbery in the county -- and I'm white. I agree with PP that no school will ever be a panacea and sometimes you will get stuck with poor teachers.

VA parent here...one kid of mine had 29 in her kindergarten class, the other had 29.

My kids are in private but have a friend whose kids are in public and she is a big dem and hates, hates 2.0. 2.0 is ensuring my kids stay in private.

18:29 People probably think you work for MCPS because you are parroting the same inappropriate comments that MCPS officials seem to make with great frequency. A parent who likes 2.0 and I honestly haven't met any would talk more about their child not the bureaucratic line.

I've lived in this area for a long time. I never heard anyone talk about moving away or heard the degree of dissatisfaction about the school system until recently. The negative issues keep coming and coming. First, it was the budget mistakes and lack of capacity. planning. Second, it was the bad curriculum and ending math acceleration. Third, it was the poor budget decisions that led to the explosion of class sizes and poor student:teacher ratios. Fourth, it was the ridiculous new grading system. Fifth, it was the utter failure to effectively teach math and be transparent with the community with the bad scores. The Washington Post doesn't keep negative articles about a school system because only a few parents are upset. These are major issues that you can't sweep under the rug.

It is a problem and a pretty big one. I don't think people will continue to support the school system as there is too much negativity. The more MCPS tries to manage its PR, the more it seems to offend the parents. The only solution is to actually change course which an organization as large as MCPS probably will not do fast enough to avoid serious damage.

Its terribly unfortunate because the kids who are part of this experiment will be the ones who suffer most. The truly gifted kids will come out OK but the kids in the middle who could have used a strong education to get ahead will grow up to be mediocre at best students. This will follow them through college and they will be less marketable in the workforce. The special needs kids will suffer as they will not get the resources they need to learn appropriately. Sadly, nothing will change for the kids who struggle academically. Their existence will be temporarily hidden as MCPS continues to try to cook their books.

Eventually, it will change. MCPS takes a larger % of county revenues than most systems. Its been able to hold onto this position on the basis that it is an important cash cow that drives the real estate market. The perception has already changed that the place to go for good schools is Montgomery County. Without the argument that the schools drive the market, MCPs will lose its preferential funding position. When enough people in MCPS start losing their jobs from budget cuts, you'll see some change.

Public education doesn't have to be bad or mediocre. It can be good or great but it will take quite a bit of work to get MCPS out of the hole its dug for itself.