Anonymous wrote:As MTV says on 16 & Pregnant - "Pregnancy is 100% preventable." For any woman with half a brain (and I like to think that all of us have a whole brain), there is no need in the year 2013 to get pregnant when you don't want to.

I imagine that victims of rape who end up pregnant would be happy to know they have "half a brain". Also, sometimes birth control legitimately fails!! That's obviously not what happened here, but no need to make extreme hyperbolic statements about women who may choose to have an abortion for whatever reason. Do I disagree with using abortion as a form of birth control? Yes. Do I think that describes the majority of the women who have elective abortions? No. Does it mean that I don't think a woman who doesn't want to raise a child even one conceived through her own decision not to use birthcontrol isn't better off not carrying/raising that child? No. And have I ever made a dumb decision that could've/did had/have major, life-altering consequences? Yes.

I say all of the above as someone who (though never had to make the choice) has always been adamantly pro-choice while also feeling it was not a moral decision I could make for myself.

As for OP, I think the whole point of an anonymous forum is to voice the things that you know are wrong and wouldn't say in public. I assume that you really don't wish IF on your friend...but I also think it's understandable that you're having a hard time relating to her as a friend right now. You're both going through difficult things that require support from those around you; it doesn't sound like either of you is in a good place to be able to support the other right now. Do I occasionally hope not to hear that another friend is announcing her pregnancy? In the abstract, yes. In the concrete, no. A friend whose wedding I missed last year due to a m/c just told me she was pregnant. I knew she'd been trying since soon after getting married, and she was starting to worry it was taking several months. She was nervous to tell me (and waited to tell anyone until 12 weeks), and she was a little surprised that I went out of my way to tell her I was really happy for her. But I am. Just a little sad for myself to have another milestone marking our lack of success

Anonymous wrote:

And. I would have a really hard time respecting this woman because it sounds like the pregnancy was simply "inconvenient" and was totally preventable. I believe in a woman's right to have an abortion, but abhor that women have to make that choice. I believe most women who make that choice understand that having a child would not be in their or the child's best interests at the time. But someone who is financially stable, in a stable partnership in which they plan to have children (just not then), in their 30s and got pregnant because they chose not to use any form of protection? It turns my stomach.

+1

I am extremely fortunate in that I have had two children. In other words I do not have the pain of infertility clouding my judgment.

And. I would have a really hard time respecting this woman because it sounds like the pregnancy was simply "inconvenient" and was totally preventable. I believe in a woman's right to have an abortion, but abhor that women have to make that choice. I believe most women who make that choice understand that having a child would not be in their or the child's best interests at the time. But someone who is financially stable, in a stable partnership in which they plan to have children (just not then), in their 30s and got pregnant because they chose not to use any form of protection? It turns my stomach.

As MTV says on 16 & Pregnant - "Pregnancy is 100% preventable." For any woman with half a brain (and I like to think that all of us have a whole brain), there is no need in the year 2013 to get pregnant when you don't want to.

OP, I totally feel you. I've also struggled with multiple miscarriages, horrible emotional and physical pain, but was finally blessed with a beautiful child. Just know that karma rears its head in the most unbelievable way....

OP, we all have to go through our lives as best we can, coping with whatever challenges we have as best we can. Bitterness and jealousy changes nothing, it just makes us unhappy. I hope you can start the family you want. Just as important, I hope you can find peace within yourself.

I think if I were in the exact same situation as OP I might have these types of feelings despite myself and despite knowing that it is wrong and I am being a big jerk. It's ok, OP, you're not a bad person (I think). If you don't want to continue your friendship with this person I think it is ok and valid. Maybe time apart from her without being reminded about this will help you get over it the best way.

Anonymous wrote:So a friend (30ish, PhD, government job, stable relationship - just got engaged and lives were her now fiance) got pregnant. He didn't like condoms and she went off the pill because it caused her skin to look bad (I sh*t you not). At the time she didn't want to spend the money on an IUD. They continued to have sex and got pregnant. She decided to go ahead and have an abortion because the timing is inconvenient. She avoided kids and babies for a few months but now all is well and she is planning her wedding.

I had fertility issues as a number of us have had in the group. Her fiance is several years younger than her and wants to wait many more years before trying to have kids (he feels he is still too selfish). I know that I am a terrible person but I don't think that they deserve to have children together and I secretly hope that they wait too long and it isn't on the table for them anymore.

I understand how you feel. Just wanted to say that. Haven't read all the other comments.

I don't think I could remain friends with someone who is so irresponsible. But that's just me. Why don't you just let the friendship die and concentrate on people whose beliefs and behaviors are more like your own? That's what I would do.

Hey I agree OP. Just forget about this loser and selfish person. Seriously. She's a jerk.

I agree with OP a million percent. I tell myself that karma is a bitch, and decisions like that will come back to haunt those who make them one way or another. Flame away!!!

Anonymous wrote:Would you judge her if you weren't dealing with infertility or would you understand? Simply put, you're projecting. Your friend is not you and this wasn't your baby. Wishing bad "karma" on her in the future would lend itself to attributing your issues to your past behavior. And that sucks. Look, I might not like the way my rich friends spend money. Or the way my beautiful friends meet crappy men all the time. But those are their choices to make, and just because I don't have their options I refuse to try to make their decisions. I'm not in charge. You're not in charge. You may need to terminate for health issues when you finally get pregnant. Many of my friends have. You'll be thankful to have the option then. Right now you're angry because your choiceless in the matter. But you're first impulse is to take away another's freedom of choice. That makes you ethically troubled, I'd say.

Very thoughtful reply.

You're right -- it's not appropriate to wish bad things on this OP; it's clear she's going through a difficult time.

I think the reason this conversation has been so hot is because there are probably women here who had abortions in their youth, thinking that it would be easy to have children later, when the time is right, when the money is there, when the husband/boyfriend is more stable, whatever. And I'm sure those women have wondered in their heart of hearts if their infertility now is punishment for younger indiscretions.

To hear someone else lay it out so plainly -- "I hope my "friend" never gets pregnant because she had an abortion for what I consider to be stupid reasons" -- well, that's a very harsh thing to think. I can have compassion for the OP, but that doesn't mean that I have to agree with her or empathize, because I don't. I have never wished infertilty on someone else, because it's hell.

Thoughts are perfectly normal and the PPs who are sanctimoniously judging the OP and wishing bad things on her must be moronic not to see their hypocrisy.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
If you killed the baby inside you while I've been giving everything I have to hold onto one, then I am NOT going to be sympathetic, I'm not the one to turn to for comfort, and guess what--that's OK. You're going to have to go somewhere else for understanding, not to a woman who has been turned inside out and tortured with infertility.

Yeesh, we're expected to be perfectly non-judgmental, compassionate saints in addition to everything else we're dealing with?

A) Why is it about you? If you were specifically asked to contribute with sympathy, sure you have a reason to excuse yourself.

B) Yeah, actually. If all you've been through hasn't opened your eyes a bit to the need for humans to be warm and compassionate, then I'm sure it's been a REALLY hard road for you.

Uh, OP's friend was confiding in her, knowing about OP's infertility struggle. And she had a "hard time for a while". . . and people here are asking OP to be sympathetic? No. That's superhuman. Why does OP have to summon that kind of compassion when IF probably has her scraping the bottom of the barrel for strength (that's how I feel anyway). And where was this friend's compassion for OP when confiding in her?

You don't have to be everything to everybody. And when you're dealing with IF, you have enough on your plate. I think it was selfish of this woman to even tell OP about the abortion, knowing what she's going through. SHE's the insensitive one, OP is having a rather understandable reaction.

Why should the OP be compassionate? Because it's the right thing to do. You have your understandable reactions (even if they're nasty) and then you behave with compassion and grace, because that's what good people do. No one's struggles belittle your struggles. Your journey is no easier by having cruel thoughts about someone.

Would you judge her if you weren't dealing with infertility or would you understand? Simply put, you're projecting. Your friend is not you and this wasn't your baby. Wishing bad "karma" on her in the future would lend itself to attributing your issues to your past behavior. And that sucks. Look, I might not like the way my rich friends spend money. Or the way my beautiful friends meet crappy men all the time. But those are their choices to make, and just because I don't have their options I refuse to try to make their decisions. I'm not in charge. You're not in charge. You may need to terminate for health issues when you finally get pregnant. Many of my friends have. You'll be thankful to have the option then. Right now you're angry because your choiceless in the matter. But you're first impulse is to take away another's freedom of choice. That makes you ethically troubled, I'd say.

Uh, OP's friend was confiding in her, knowing about OP's infertility struggle.

Where are you getting that from? I'm asking seriously. There's been a flurry of posts here and I legitimately may have missed one, but I don't see where the OP said that this friend was confiding in her, or that this friend knows about the OP's fertility struggles.

But let's just say that the Abortion-haver did confide this situation. They're supposedly friends. Don't friends often confide in each other? If they're true friends, at least. Why would I think that my having an abortion (or not) would affect my friend's fertility?