Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:21:18 Both the FLES program and the immersion program teach core math and science instruction. One just teaches less of it. In other words, even in the FLES schools, children are pulled away from math and science instruction in English and taught math and science instruction in the foreign language instead during their FLES time.

My children were at a FLES school until they switched for AAP. They were taught math and science in English and their FLES language instruction was not at all math or science related. It was just treated as another special during the week.

This (the latter) was our experience when my child moved from base school to an AAP center between second and third grades in 2009. FLES instruction was twice a week, very basic, and not in any way tied to other topics -- certainly kids were not doing any math or science in Spanish (unless learning to count in Spanish would be considered doing math). Has the program changed in the past four years so that kids are expected to do substantial science and math instruction in their FLES language? I find that troubling -- math and science get so much attention as subjects in which kids need to get up to speed very quickly and get a very solid grounding before they move up; why would FCPS teach those topics to elementary students in a different language? Really would like to know from parents who have been there. Maybe it's great -- I don't know but I can't see that working well in terms of ensuring kids are getting a solid background for math and science.

Also, what about when kids move into middle school? If their middle school does not offer the language they had in FLES in elementary, it seems like the FLES experience was kind of a waste. I know several families who were not thrilled with FLES for that exact reason -- the language their school was assigned for FLES was one that was not on offer in either of the two middle schools that kids from that elementary school would be attending in 7th and 8th grades.

I'd be furious if the local schools tried to make my child learn Chinese. I think it's an ugly-sounding language and the corrupt and venal culture of the country, its politicians, and its business people speaks for itself.

^Or should we just give up now if we can devote only 1-2 hours per week to learning the language and are not likely to ever live in China?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mandarin, Russian, Arabic. These are lasnguages that matter. All the rest are a waste of time, esp. French.

Russian? I don't think so. Less valuable than French.

Mandarin - yes. It's ridiculous that FCPS isn't introducing it to elementary school students.

We have Mandarin FLES at our elementary school.

I lived in China and my kids started learning Mandarin. Was frustrated myself when we moved back here and it wasn't available. But I think saying it's ridiculous FCPS isn't introducing Mandarin to (all?) elementary school students is an overstatement. Learning Chinese is a life-long endeavour and certainly not for everyone. While starting with it in lower grades might demystify the characters vs. letters issue and pique some interest, it's naive to think it's going to impart some big advantage. There are no shortcuts and it will require many years of study and living in China to truly master the language. FCPS does offer Chinese starting in 8th grade, and although I'm not a big fan of the course, 7th graders can be exposed to Mandarin in Intro to Foreign Languages.

I'm not trying to be a downer, just a realist. In China, children begin studying English in grade school, but even college graduates can struggle.

As for which languages are most valuable to learn -- it depends what language your kid loves. Forcing a language on them because it's the "in" thing (Japanese was very "in" in the 1980s), is like forcing a musician to play music they hate the sound of. Once you learn one language well, it's much easier to learn others. But if you have a bad first experience you might not make it past that.

I should say, I'm also a language teacher at Berlitz, so I"m not just spouting off here.

I think that exposure to a language at a young age (before puberty) will help with a better accent later on? Is this not especially true of a tonal language like Mandarin? My hope with exposure at a young age is to plant seeds for later growth if a need later develops. I have no illusions of fluency for my kids through 1-2 hours per week in class but doesn't some familiarity at least help with building business relationships and friendships, even within the U.S.? I think it helps the kids develop an interest in China, at least.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mandarin, Russian, Arabic. These are lasnguages that matter. All the rest are a waste of time, esp. French.

Russian? I don't think so. Less valuable than French.

Mandarin - yes. It's ridiculous that FCPS isn't introducing it to elementary school students.

We have Mandarin FLES at our elementary school.

But it's an optional after school lesson, correct? It's not integrated into the daily day's lesson such as math, science, reading, writing, PE, and music?

FLES is a during-the-day program in the target language meant to parallel what is being learned in regular classes.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mandarin, Russian, Arabic. These are lasnguages that matter. All the rest are a waste of time, esp. French.

Russian? I don't think so. Less valuable than French.

Mandarin - yes. It's ridiculous that FCPS isn't introducing it to elementary school students.

We have Mandarin FLES at our elementary school.

I lived in China and my kids started learning Mandarin. Was frustrated myself when we moved back here and it wasn't available. But I think saying it's ridiculous FCPS isn't introducing Mandarin to (all?) elementary school students is an overstatement. Learning Chinese is a life-long endeavour and certainly not for everyone. While starting with it in lower grades might demystify the characters vs. letters issue and pique some interest, it's naive to think it's going to impart some big advantage. There are no shortcuts and it will require many years of study and living in China to truly master the language. FCPS does offer Chinese starting in 8th grade, and although I'm not a big fan of the course, 7th graders can be exposed to Mandarin in Intro to Foreign Languages.

I'm not trying to be a downer, just a realist. In China, children begin studying English in grade school, but even college graduates can struggle.

As for which languages are most valuable to learn -- it depends what language your kid loves. Forcing a language on them because it's the "in" thing (Japanese was very "in" in the 1980s), is like forcing a musician to play music they hate the sound of. Once you learn one language well, it's much easier to learn others. But if you have a bad first experience you might not make it past that.

I should say, I'm also a language teacher at Berlitz, so I"m not just spouting off here.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mandarin, Russian, Arabic. These are lasnguages that matter. All the rest are a waste of time, esp. French.

Russian? I don't think so. Less valuable than French.

Mandarin - yes. It's ridiculous that FCPS isn't introducing it to elementary school students.

We have Mandarin FLES at our elementary school.

But it's an optional after school lesson, correct? It's not integrated into the daily day's lesson such as math, science, reading, writing, PE, and music?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When I graduated from a high school in FCPS 15 years ago, nearly all of the native Spanish speakers took Spanish. No one else bothered with it because the class catered to them. I wouldn't assume much has changed. It's still an easy A. I believe FCPS should institute a rule at the high school level that the language studied cannot be the student's native language.

By your reasoning, English speakers shouldn't be allowed to take English. Is that really what you want? Foreign language instruction in high school also involves reading, writing and grammar. Just because a student speaks a language doesn't mean they can read and write it. Giving Spanish speakers the opportunity to learn these skills actually makes them more employable.

"English" class in HS is not learning the English language. It is a study of literatue and composition. You might get marginally close to a comparison if you wanted to compare an AP Spanish literature class. Otherwise, your comparison is just silly.

NP jumping in. HS English is literature and composition because kids have spent their entire academic lives up to that point learning English spelling, grammar, reading. Not true for Spanish speakers taking a HS Spanish class. It may be their first exposure to reading and writing in Spanish. I believe that Jackson Middle School does have a Spanish class especially for Spanish speakers.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When I graduated from a high school in FCPS 15 years ago, nearly all of the native Spanish speakers took Spanish. No one else bothered with it because the class catered to them. I wouldn't assume much has changed. It's still an easy A. I believe FCPS should institute a rule at the high school level that the language studied cannot be the student's native language.

By your reasoning, English speakers shouldn't be allowed to take English. Is that really what you want? Foreign language instruction in high school also involves reading, writing and grammar. Just because a student speaks a language doesn't mean they can read and write it. Giving Spanish speakers the opportunity to learn these skills actually makes them more employable.

"English" class in HS is not learning the English language. It is a study of literatue and composition. You might get marginally close to a comparison if you wanted to compare an AP Spanish literature class. Otherwise, your comparison is just silly.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When I graduated from a high school in FCPS 15 years ago, nearly all of the native Spanish speakers took Spanish. No one else bothered with it because the class catered to them. I wouldn't assume much has changed. It's still an easy A. I believe FCPS should institute a rule at the high school level that the language studied cannot be the student's native language.

By your reasoning, English speakers shouldn't be allowed to take English. Is that really what you want? Foreign language instruction in high school also involves reading, writing and grammar. Just because a student speaks a language doesn't mean they can read and write it. Giving Spanish speakers the opportunity to learn these skills actually makes them more employable.

I know when I took high school Spanish in the midwest...the one's who did have Spanish speaking parents or relatives actually did not do well in the class. They could speak it some...but could not write or read it very well.

Anonymous wrote:When I graduated from a high school in FCPS 15 years ago, nearly all of the native Spanish speakers took Spanish. No one else bothered with it because the class catered to them. I wouldn't assume much has changed. It's still an easy A. I believe FCPS should institute a rule at the high school level that the language studied cannot be the student's native language.

By your reasoning, English speakers shouldn't be allowed to take English. Is that really what you want? Foreign language instruction in high school also involves reading, writing and grammar. Just because a student speaks a language doesn't mean they can read and write it. Giving Spanish speakers the opportunity to learn these skills actually makes them more employable.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mandarin, Russian, Arabic. These are lasnguages that matter. All the rest are a waste of time, esp. French.

Russian? I don't think so. Less valuable than French.

Mandarin - yes. It's ridiculous that FCPS isn't introducing it to elementary school students.

We have Mandarin FLES at our elementary school.

Thread Reviver here. Could someone comment on Kent Gardens? I hope this won't turn into a thread bashing Spanish immigrants. We all want excellent educations for our kids so we can all contribute. With that said, anyone know my chances for French immersion at Kent Gardens being just outside the boundary? I have reached out to the school, but haven't heard back. Thanks!

When I graduated from a high school in FCPS 15 years ago, nearly all of the native Spanish speakers took Spanish. No one else bothered with it because the class catered to them. I wouldn't assume much has changed. It's still an easy A. I believe FCPS should institute a rule at the high school level that the language studied cannot be the student's native language.

They may leave with their non-citizen parents, but anyone born in the US is a citizen - http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis/menuitem.eb1d4c2a3e5b9ac89243c6a7543f6d1a/?vgnextoid=a2ec6811264a3210VgnVCM100000b92ca60aRCRD&vgnextchannel=a2ec6811264a3210VgnVCM100000b92ca60aRCRD