Anonymous wrote:Are there any secular homophobes? I've never heard of or met any.

I don't know any, but I'm sure there must be some out there. They are most likely uncomfortable with it or in the extreme they may be 'grossed out', but either way that would also not be a legitimate reason to ban it through our legal system.

Lots of things can make people uncomfortable or 'grossed out', vegetarians may find the sight of raw meat disgusting, some think fat people are gross, some feel uncomfortable around pregnant woman, some don't like to be around minority groups, some don't want to be around poor people, etc...

Are there any secular homophobes? I've never heard of or met any.

Yeah, remember that this country was stolen by people who were trying to escape religious persecution.

Back to the OP's post.. It's one thing to believe that homosexuality is "wrong" and if that's what your faith teaches you or how your interpret the teachings of your faith, then that's is between you and your faith and convictions. I have no problem with that and your are free to believe how you choose.

Where I do find the problem is when the faiths/interpretations of faiths/beliefs/convictions how ever you want to put it try to make laws that discriminate and criminalize against the rights of those that do not feel the same way.

If your faith doesn't believe in gay marriage, then your church/mosque just should not perform the marriages. That is completely within their rights and makes perfect sense if you don't condone it.

But why does your faith have to dictate the lives of others? It's between you and your religion and God. Not the government and not the personal lives of other individual human beings who are not "lesser" deserving of a married life than you.

It makes me very sad to see religions which can spread such love and acceptance into this world misuse their teachings and begin laying judgements. If the "traditional marriage' is really in danger, than it would make much more sense to outlaw divorce as well. But I doubt that would fly with many that tout their unwavering demands for so called "family values".

My best friend's grandfather thinks anyone non-white is a second-class human. I'm not particularly interested in me or anyone else changing his mind, but I sure as hell don't want him to be able to vote on what rights people deserve based on skin color.

When I speak to people who feel homosexuality is wrong, I don't try to change their entire mindset- I don't really have the power to do that. A lot of them are old and stuck in their ways. But I do try to convince them that even if they feel it's wrong for people of the same-sex to be romantically involved, their personal moral beliefs shouldn't have to be reflected in the country's law. I don't think we should be voting on which rights we afford people.

Anonymous wrote:
I will agree that no one has the right to discriminate, say offensive things, or give haircuts, but they are entitled to their beliefs and their vote..

Setting aside whether it's ok to hold discriminatory beliefs, but I have a problem with the concept of it eing ok to have a vote on whether it's ok to discriminate against a particular class of people. And, I have a problem with people voting to discriminate. But the biggest thing I don't understand is how people who have lived and breathed discrimination can vote to discriminate against others.

Gay people turn to gay sex inorder to avoid their Nazi tendencies. The anal violence satisfies their innate evil.

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Anonymous wrote:Ever noticed how nobody in their right mind shouts pro homosexual views when they are on their deathbed? I do. Talk your trash when you are dying and make sure your children bow at the alter of anal sex right before they die,then I will give you props.

Oh well. And just as "genetically wrong" was being so sensibly argued...

It's not an argument, it's a statement. When you die, you are on your own. The opinions of the NY Times and the gay pride parade thong float members no longer hold any weight. Talking b.s. when you feel safe and in control has no meaning. I would like to see a poll taken among terminal adult patients as to their opinion on the santification of gay marriage.

Yeah, gay kids really feel "safe and in control". More like harassed, humiliated, beaten and sometimes even killed. So based on your logic, there is more than enough proof among the living.

OP I question you agree with other ultra religious beliefs such as gender apartheid as practiced by the Taliban. Lashing for. violation of Sharia dress code, removal of fingers for wearing nail polish being the lighter of punishments. Or Hasidium's refusal to report child abuse, unwilling to testify against their owm. Or Muslim death sentences for cartooning the Prophet. What about the Iranian court that sentenced a convert to Christianity to death. for the crime of leaving Islam.
Who is to say their beliefs are wrong? Anyone with the intellect required to ask why would civilized people act in such a fashion

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ever noticed how nobody in their right mind shouts pro homosexual views when they are on their deathbed? I do. Talk your trash when you are dying and make sure your children bow at the alter of anal sex right before they die,then I will give you props.

Oh well. And just as "genetically wrong" was being so sensibly argued...

It's not an argument, it's a statement. When you die, you are on your own. The opinions of the NY Times and the gay pride parade thong float members no longer hold any weight. Talking b.s. when you feel safe and in control has no meaning. I would like to see a poll taken among terminal adult patients as to their opinion on the santification of gay marriage.

That's hilarious! What planet do you live on?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ever noticed how nobody in their right mind shouts pro homosexual views when they are on their deathbed? I do. Talk your trash when you are dying and make sure your children bow at the alter of anal sex right before they die,then I will give you props.

Ever notice how no one wants you around their deathbed? Wonder why...

Yeah, my mom only talked about vaginal intercourse in the missionary position on her deathbed. Case in point.

Hey if I call you a bigot then, that's not wrong either. I'm entitled to my opinion.

I've never understood why people expend so much energy worrying about other people's sex lives. Don't you have a million other things that should take precedence in your day?

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Anonymous wrote:People who are "against homosexuality" are really just simple thinkers.

They fall lower on the scale of moral development. They can't think past their own experience in deciding what is right/wrong. "I am not gay. I am good. So gay must be bad." Also, even more commonly, they don't think at all. "My preacher/imam/rabbi says gay is bad, so gay is bad."

Not surprisingly, when someone they love/respect comes out as gay, their view changes. "Bob is good. I like Bob. Bob is gay. Gay must be okay."

OP -- do you know/love anyone who is gay?

I used to think this and I am not sure that this is the case. I believe that some people have an innate aversion to the idea (mostly men), and that aversion probably existed before the Bible. However, I think that few people would have fallen into that category. It is no different than people who have a natural aversion to eating meat (from childhood), or those who dislike touchy people.
Also, there are some religious contemplative people who still see homosexuality as morally wrong. They did not go through the simple thought process that you describe.

I think most homophobic people are just scared that if they accept homosexuality, they may have to acknowledge their own repressed sexual fantasies.

That has actually proven to be untrue. I know that it is the thinking in many circles, but some studies have shown that most people who have an aversion to homosexuality are not homosexuals.

Wrong! http://gizmodo.com/5906144/homophobia-is-totally-gay-as-proven-by-science

Face it, gay bashers are really trying to stuff down their feelings. Esp. you, panty sniffer. You are way too enthusiastic in your portrayals of gay sex and you have obviously spent a lot of time googling about it. The only logical reason is that it gets you a little bit aroused.

Google lemon party and that is the gay life