Anonymous wrote:Again, I can't speak for the OP, but they asked where he was from and he answered with his hometown. At that point if they were looking to get to know him better or looking for common ground he had given them that to work with. They could have then said "oh I have a sister in Williamsburg" or "one of my favorite places to visit is NYC" or whatever to keep the conversation going. The weirdness is not that they asked where he was from, but that when he answered they weirdly routed the conversation to random bits of "yay, Asia!" info about their school.

With your post above, PP. If you asked Kaysone Phomvihane where he is from and he said "Louisville, Kentucky" then that is the info he is giving you to get to know him better. It would then be appropriate to talk/ask about Kentucky. If instead you started randomly saying things like "I have a friend from Mongolia!" and "I've always loved Thai food" then it might be reasonable for Kaysone Phomvihane to feel like he was being viewed as a generic "foreigner" rather than as the person he was presenting himself as (just an American).

The point is it is rude to put labels on people that they aren't labeling themselves with at the time. Yes, they may have been looking for common ground but in so doing they made someone feel like an "other" or a novelty. No one likes feeling that way. That's not inclusive even if it is well intentioned. In trying to demonstrate that they are accepting/appreciative of cultural differences, they just made a person feel different even though he didn't feel that way when he walked in. And really if you come across as lumping all Asian cultures together as if they are the same then that's not really appreciative of cultural differences at all, it's just oblivious and kind of rude.

Great response!

SAM2 wrote:[
Thanks for your response, and to others who responded to my question. To summarize, it seems that if I ask a question about your ancestry or ethnic background, you will be offended because you assume I am making all sorts of negative judgments about you, and implicitly questioning whether you are "American enough." Is that a correct summary of your view? If so, your assumption is both unfortunate and inaccurate (at least for me personally, and perhaps for many others). Like I said, people are curious about other people; that's just human nature. If I ask about you and your background, that doesn't mean I'm judging you.

If I meet someone named "Kaysone Phomvihane" at some school event, I'd almost certainly ask about the origin of his name. So why would you think I'm questioning his right to be at that school or in the United States? I'd be asking because it's the kind of name I don't hear every day, and I'd be very curious about its origin. I'd really hope for a simple response of "It's Laotian," or even better "It's Laotian. Even though I am from Kentucky, my parents wanted me to have a traditional name." Those might put us on the path of getting to know one another better, and perhaps even liking each other. But if he is secretly thinking (or even saying), "You jerk! How dare you ask me about my name when we've just met! Quit questioning my right to live here! I'm just as American as you are!," then our conversation might not go so well.

I'm not saying there aren't rude jerks out there, or that some people don't make inappropriate judgments based on appearance or name or accent. We've all encountered those people. Those kind of people are going to judge even if they never talk to you at all. It seems that the type of person who asks you a question is at least open to some discussion about it, which I think is a positive step.

Thanks again for your responses. They are interesting.

By the way, does it matter what my apparent ethnicity is? If I'm somewhat foreign-looking or foreign-sounding myself, does that change your assumptions when I ask about your background?

This is the perfect example of the exoticized "other." The assumptions you make aren't necessarily negative in YOUR mind, but they might be for the Asian person. No one wants to be a museum piece to be probed and examined. There are a couple unexamined assumptions in this post: 1) Asians have an "exotic" name. If you met someone named, say, Patrick O'Connor, would you ask about the origins of his name? Why is the Asian name so much more "interesting" to you? What do you consider to be "American"? 2) I'm assuming that you are white or black, but the assumption here is that if you are Asian you are "foreign-looking." Why, after all these posts, would you assume that someone who is Asian is "foreign"?

Again, I can't speak for the OP, but they asked where he was from and he answered with his hometown. At that point if they were looking to get to know him better or looking for common ground he had given them that to work with. They could have then said "oh I have a sister in Williamsburg" or "one of my favorite places to visit is NYC" or whatever to keep the conversation going. The weirdness is not that they asked where he was from, but that when he answered they weirdly routed the conversation to random bits of "yay, Asia!" info about their school.

With your post above, PP. If you asked Kaysone Phomvihane where he is from and he said "Louisville, Kentucky" then that is the info he is giving you to get to know him better. It would then be appropriate to talk/ask about Kentucky. If instead you started randomly saying things like "I have a friend from Mongolia!" and "I've always loved Thai food" then it might be reasonable for Kaysone Phomvihane to feel like he was being viewed as a generic "foreigner" rather than as the person he was presenting himself as (just an American).

The point is it is rude to put labels on people that they aren't labeling themselves with at the time. Yes, they may have been looking for common ground but in so doing they made someone feel like an "other" or a novelty. No one likes feeling that way. That's not inclusive even if it is well intentioned. In trying to demonstrate that they are accepting/appreciative of cultural differences, they just made a person feel different even though he didn't feel that way when he walked in. And really if you come across as lumping all Asian cultures together as if they are the same then that's not really appreciative of cultural differences at all, it's just oblivious and kind of rude.

I knew an Irish/American from a well known DC family who used to think it was very funny to say "chinks" out loud after passing any group of asians on the street. She is dead now though and died young. So, there's that.

Anonymous wrote:@8:09: I get it - and I am not saying it's the best situation - I also said if it makes her feel uncomfortable then don't send her kids there.

But I think she is an adult and may want to wonder - hmm! Why does this make me so uncomfortable.

I have a friend who is from Puerto Rico who gets mistaken for Asian all the time.
I have a friend who is black but we go to get Peruvian chicken and they speak Spanish to her - she is like - dude - no comprende.

A boy who is from El Salvador said to my friends daughter who is Peruvian - something about food. She was like hey I'm Peruvian - we are all about the squid and raw fish we don't eat that food. How is the kids to know - to him Hispanic is Hispanic.

We are all just learning - nobody is perfect.

People need to just chilll - why not say - Oh - My grandmother was <fill in the blank>. The OP won't even say what the heritage is - just hey "I'm NOT Chinese".

I have been in a school where I was the only white girl - it was brought to my attention by professors - like "yea we got a white girl" (Not really like that - so I could have been sensitive and I did ask one professor did they only accept me because they needed a white girl on their roster - he said - no but it really helps the class room with a different perspective - I was doing computer modeling of drug disposition. The librarian would say - so you want to be a model - I was like - this book is on COMPUTER modeling.)

I am not saying that OP should send their kids to a school if they do not feel comfortable our kids are not social experiiments. But she asked "am I being sensitive" and I frankly think "yes".

I get it sucks being called something you are not or having assumptions made about you. This was 1 teacher from the school.

There is a trend among whites to say: "I have this black friend --or I have this biracial friend and..." then go on to say that their friend isn't affected by whatever form of racism is being discussed. You are mistaken usually--your friend of color had no reaction in front of you because you are white. Clearly you don't get it and your "friend" or your kid's friend didn't feel comfortable teaching you in that moment. How long will you be learning, I wonder? You're an adult and you can't quickly learn to not ask prying weird questions of asians? To not ask Black girls if you can touch their hair? To not assume Black people cannot swim or ski or ice skate? It's not the 1950's no matter how you dress, you know?

Anonymous wrote:

If you think questions about your ancestry or ethnic background are offensive, what is it you find offensive about those questions? Please educate me.

I find it offensive that despite the fact that I was born and raised in the United States and am as American as the next guy, that I am still treated as a foreigner. I find it offensive that when my colleague who is an immigrant but white is not being asked questions such as "Where are you from?" that make him feel like an outsider or foreigner, I am. You assume o r at least make me feel like you assume that I am not from here, I am not American and I am not "one of us" but don't treat the Caucasian person who is a foreigner that way.

Until you know how much importance *I* place on my ethnic heritage, then you shouldn't place more importance on it than I do because otherwise you imply that my heritage is more important than I, as an individual, am.

Thanks for your response, and to others who responded to my question. To summarize, it seems that if I ask a question about your ancestry or ethnic background, you will be offended because you assume I am making all sorts of negative judgments about you, and implicitly questioning whether you are "American enough." Is that a correct summary of your view? If so, your assumption is both unfortunate and inaccurate (at least for me personally, and perhaps for many others). Like I said, people are curious about other people; that's just human nature. If I ask about you and your background, that doesn't mean I'm judging you.

If I meet someone named "Kaysone Phomvihane" at some school event, I'd almost certainly ask about the origin of his name. So why would you think I'm questioning his right to be at that school or in the United States? I'd be asking because it's the kind of name I don't hear every day, and I'd be very curious about its origin. I'd really hope for a simple response of "It's Laotian," or even better "It's Laotian. Even though I am from Kentucky, my parents wanted me to have a traditional name." Those might put us on the path of getting to know one another better, and perhaps even liking each other. But if he is secretly thinking (or even saying), "You jerk! How dare you ask me about my name when we've just met! Quit questioning my right to live here! I'm just as American as you are!," then our conversation might not go so well.

I'm not saying there aren't rude jerks out there, or that some people don't make inappropriate judgments based on appearance or name or accent. We've all encountered those people. Those kind of people are going to judge even if they never talk to you at all. It seems that the type of person who asks you a question is at least open to some discussion about it, which I think is a positive step.

Thanks again for your responses. They are interesting.

By the way, does it matter what my apparent ethnicity is? If I'm somewhat foreign-looking or foreign-sounding myself, does that change your assumptions when I ask about your background?

I'm Asian and I seek multicultural programs so I want to know that their are programs available and Diversity. I am so use to "cultural" reference anyway growing up and always getting it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People need to just chilll - why not say - Oh - My grandmother was <fill in the blank>. The OP won't even say what the heritage is - just hey "I'm NOT Chinese".

As to my "heritage," I don't want to out myself, though I probably already did. Honestly, I thought I handled the tour very well and with some humor to cover over the awkward moments. Also, it was 1 real awkward teacher conversation, then followed by 3 conversations where culture day and an another asian parent was emphasized unsolicited, and then followed by 3 conversations where I wouldn't have noticed anything unusual because of asian themes (i.e. Origami) but at that point I had 7 asian themed conversations in a 2 hour period where in 2 prior tours at other schools I hadn't had any. The other ones were just nuts and bolts do you have any questions type interactions and they responded to my concerns about stuff like the curriculum. So yes, it stood out quite a bit to me.

I'm just venting and maybe I am overreacting. I just thought it was weird. And as an asian american, at very points in your life you do get in situations where you feel that people don't consider you a real American or that we are immigrants, so we can get a little touchy about it. Nothing big, but just a bunch of slights that grate over time. I guess I'm kind of worried that will happen to me.

Don't get me wrong - I think it is weird - the whole thing is weird. People count how many students are X, Y and Z and judge the school based on that. And X, Y and Z better be noticable by skin color or other outward appearances. In this area if you say the school is diverse we have children whose parents grew up in Germany, Poland, Holland and Greece - people around here are like - "oh World Bank diverse" which means the kids have white skin and are not considered diverse enough. It's weird to say the least.

My neices and nephews are "asain" looking - their mom is Chinese (which I have been told I am not allowed to say that - she's American) anyway, my bro gets "we adopted too" all the time, like at the park. It bothered him at first but really nobody is trying to be mean they are just people.

BTW - my kids asked why they celebrate Chinese new year and I said because Aunt A is chinese - I got told off - she is American. Whatever - I wasn't being prejudice - people need to chill.

Anonymous wrote:People need to just chilll - why not say - Oh - My grandmother was <fill in the blank>. The OP won't even say what the heritage is - just hey "I'm NOT Chinese".

As to my "heritage," I don't want to out myself, though I probably already did. Honestly, I thought I handled the tour very well and with some humor to cover over the awkward moments. Also, it was 1 real awkward teacher conversation, then followed by 3 conversations where culture day and an another asian parent was emphasized unsolicited, and then followed by 3 conversations where I wouldn't have noticed anything unusual because of asian themes (i.e. Origami) but at that point I had 7 asian themed conversations in a 2 hour period where in 2 prior tours at other schools I hadn't had any. The other ones were just nuts and bolts do you have any questions type interactions and they responded to my concerns about stuff like the curriculum. So yes, it stood out quite a bit to me.

I'm just venting and maybe I am overreacting. I just thought it was weird. And as an asian american, at very points in your life you do get in situations where you feel that people don't consider you a real American or that we are immigrants, so we can get a little touchy about it. Nothing big, but just a bunch of slights that grate over time. I guess I'm kind of worried that will happen to me.

Anonymous wrote:Why did they even care which country your ancestors are from? If they are interested in checking the "Asian" box, they know you are that by looking at you.

It wasn't the admission folks, who are fantastic. It was a few teachers and a parent. It was they just seemed to want a way to brag about their culture day, other asian parents and how culturally aware they were, thinking that stuff would be important to me. It was just really awkward.

Anonymous wrote:What SCHOOL is it?

OP here, I think you can understand why I don't want to disclose it.

OP again, my wife also makes a good point that when I went to public school growing up, I was subject to a lot of taunts and kind of indifferent teachers. We had a lot of white ethnics that like to make racial jokes, so when my friends dropped a fly ball, hearing "you stupid chink," "you fool Hindu" or "you dumb Mick" and the gym teachers just acted like it was just boys being boys. I assume that stuff isn't tolerated anymore, but I KNOW it wouldn't be tolerated at this school. And they at least genuinely seemed interested in my family and strongly encouraged us to apply, where a lot of other schools were kind of indifferent and it was hard to get a word in with the head of schools or admissions directors (especially the elite ones famous for being diverse and inclusive).

What SCHOOL is it?

Anonymous wrote:Until you said 15% black I would have guessed this was a certain MD school where I got a similar vibe but not the same type or level of stupid comments. (I am black and we are rare at that school.) Yes, they are trying to be nice and trying to reach out to you, but no, you are not overreacting and you do not need that stupid crap from well-meaning white folks. nor does your child. You know what good intentions lead to, don't you? Why couldn't they just treat you like a person instead of like 'the Asian.'

Your DC deserves better than that. Can't you find a better school for DC? I don't just mean a better 'fit,' I truly mean a better school that is grounded in the 21st century.

Good luck!

Thanks. This is the OP. I think you hit it on the head. I felt that I was "the Asian." They were really nice and obviously going out of their way to make me feel comfortable there, but I went in thinking I was normal and left thinking they thought I was different. I don't care if people ask me about my ethnicity (immigrant asians ask me all the time after just meeting me), but the context of it was just weird, as if they thought I needed reassurance that they value my asianness.

Anyways, my wife is like "get over it, you put me in charge of picking the schools to apply and DC and I like this one," and it's about DC not my insecurities. Who knows if DC will even get in, as it could all be moot in a couple of weeks. Thanks for letting me vent.

Why did they even care which country your ancestors are from? If they are interested in checking the "Asian" box, they know you are that by looking at you.