Anonymous
Post 11/26/2011 10:25     Subject: Re:Washington Hebrew
Don't know about KAMIT, but let's say its goal (like many of charters) is to meet educational needs of a substantial subset of DC students, e.g. AA, low income/aspiring (KIPP), college bound (BASIS, Latin), bilingual (YY).

Can't say that about Hebrew school -- plus it appeals to a religious subset, unlike all other charters and public schools of any kind.


You can, actually.

If you go back and carefully read the proposal for Washington Hebrew, and then carefully read the proposal for Washington Latin, they read almost exactly the same. No joke, I'll sit here and wait while you do it. The only difference is that the Latin instruction is mandatory but not immersion; the Hebrew instruction is mandatory and taught "using the immersion model." A rigorous, classic curriculum appeals to a substantial number of DC children.

You're getting hung up on the fact that American Jews study the Hebrew language in advance of bar/bat mitzvah. That alone is not enough under the U.S. Constitution to defeat a proposal like this under the 1st amendment. If there is not even a whiff of religious instruction offered, current case law would suggest this kind of school should pass legal muster.

Anonymous
Post 11/26/2011 10:04     Subject: Washington Hebrew
^^ its not it's, sorry.
Anonymous
Post 11/26/2011 10:04     Subject: Washington Hebrew
I think I'm with 9:02. KIPP and the hotel/services school serve needs that we share as a society -- helping disadvantaged kids get ready for college, and vo-tech training for kids who won't go to college.

Whereas it's hard to argue that a school fills the same societal need if it teaches Hebrew to kids who, I think we all agree, already have many advantages. This catering-to-advantaged kids thing is evident on this very thread, in the smug, and somewhat off-putting, comments about what a "select" group of kids this will be.

I'm the PP who wrote about maybe trying to increase it's appeal beyond a religious subset, by offering "peace studies" and maybe even arabic. To the PP who is accusing the skeptical of calling this a "constitutional crisis" or being hyper-sensitive about JKLM schools, you are missing the entire point.
Anonymous
Post 11/26/2011 09:02     Subject: Washington Hebrew
Don't know about KAMIT, but let's say its goal (like many of charters) is to meet educational needs of a substantial subset of DC students, e.g. AA, low income/aspiring (KIPP), college bound (BASIS, Latin), bilingual (YY).

Can't say that about Hebrew school -- plus it appeals to a religious subset, unlike all other charters and public schools of any kind.

In DC, Judaism is a small religious and ethnic subset whose interest in learning Hebrew is currently met appropriately through its religious institutions.
Anonymous
Post 11/26/2011 08:16     Subject: Washington Hebrew
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Let's go back to the "convincing the Charter Board that everybody and especially the poverty stricken kids in SE" will have to want this school and benefit from it.

That doesn't sound bad on its face. In fact it sounds good.

But then, can someone explain how the various niche charters got approved that are 100% irrelevant to the 3% families that fill Ward 3 and some of Ward 2? The same Charter Board probably wasn't convinced that KIPP, say, would appeal to families in Tenleytown. Nobody needed to prove to the Charter Board that that Hotel and Service Industry vocational-lite school would be good for the affluent kids in Cleveland Park.

Now someone is going to read this and reflexively yell "You shut up you have great JKLM choices in Ward 3 so just shut your mouth blah blah blah disadvantaged children in Ward 8 blah blah so therefore you never get to poke holes in any illogical statements blah blah blah Deal."

Howver, that doesn't get to the point. If this proposed Hebrew language school must appeal to kids in every Ward, shouldn't that have been true for some of the existing **niche** charters that don't appeal to DC children with lawyer/lobbyist parents? Are there 2 sets of regulatory criteria in the charter law?




KIPP and Latin and the other charter schools have nothing to do with religion. Hebrew does. It just does. No denying it.


Who cares? As long as they're not keeping you our because you're not Jewish, this isn't the Constitutional crisis you imagine it to be.

KAMIT was allowed to have a charter even though the focus was purely AA. It sucked though, so badly its charter was revoked. The point remains however, that it foundered because of the execution, but not because a charter with an explicitly AA curriculum was infeasible, despite the inherently racist nature of it.
Anonymous
Post 11/26/2011 08:05     Subject: Washington Hebrew
Anonymous wrote:Let's go back to the "convincing the Charter Board that everybody and especially the poverty stricken kids in SE" will have to want this school and benefit from it.

That doesn't sound bad on its face. In fact it sounds good.

But then, can someone explain how the various niche charters got approved that are 100% irrelevant to the 3% families that fill Ward 3 and some of Ward 2? The same Charter Board probably wasn't convinced that KIPP, say, would appeal to families in Tenleytown. Nobody needed to prove to the Charter Board that that Hotel and Service Industry vocational-lite school would be good for the affluent kids in Cleveland Park.

Now someone is going to read this and reflexively yell "You shut up you have great JKLM choices in Ward 3 so just shut your mouth blah blah blah disadvantaged children in Ward 8 blah blah so therefore you never get to poke holes in any illogical statements blah blah blah Deal."

Howver, that doesn't get to the point. If this proposed Hebrew language school must appeal to kids in every Ward, shouldn't that have been true for some of the existing **niche** charters that don't appeal to DC children with lawyer/lobbyist parents? Are there 2 sets of regulatory criteria in the charter law?







I think I agree with you, but I sure do wish you'd chosen to make your point more coherently.
Anonymous
Post 11/25/2011 21:42     Subject: Washington Hebrew
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Hebrew offers unique chances to explore the most ancient texts and study 5,000 year-old ideas.
You're kidding, right? If not then I assume you're referring to ancient Hebrew. Which, like ancient Greek and Latin, are compelling intelectually, but not applicable to a bilingual elementary school. The Hebrew charter "movement" (all 6 of them nationwide) focuses on modern Hebrew. In DC proper, an Amharic charter would probably be more practical.

I've been expecting an Amharic immersion school for some time now, and am surprised it hasn't come along yet. I'm someone who believes that bilingual education is good in & of itself, so the fact that Amharic, like Hebrew, has limited use, is of little consequence to me.
Anonymous
Post 11/25/2011 20:57     Subject: Washington Hebrew
Anonymous wrote:Let's go back to the "convincing the Charter Board that everybody and especially the poverty stricken kids in SE" will have to want this school and benefit from it.

That doesn't sound bad on its face. In fact it sounds good.

But then, can someone explain how the various niche charters got approved that are 100% irrelevant to the 3% families that fill Ward 3 and some of Ward 2? The same Charter Board probably wasn't convinced that KIPP, say, would appeal to families in Tenleytown. Nobody needed to prove to the Charter Board that that Hotel and Service Industry vocational-lite school would be good for the affluent kids in Cleveland Park.

Now someone is going to read this and reflexively yell "You shut up you have great JKLM choices in Ward 3 so just shut your mouth blah blah blah disadvantaged children in Ward 8 blah blah so therefore you never get to poke holes in any illogical statements blah blah blah Deal."

Howver, that doesn't get to the point. If this proposed Hebrew language school must appeal to kids in every Ward, shouldn't that have been true for some of the existing **niche** charters that don't appeal to DC children with lawyer/lobbyist parents? Are there 2 sets of regulatory criteria in the charter law?




KIPP and Latin and the other charter schools have nothing to do with religion. Hebrew does. It just does. No denying it.
Anonymous
Post 11/25/2011 20:36     Subject: Re:Washington Hebrew
An article in the NY Times says that the Hebrew Language Charter in NYC is very diverse --- "But as the school’s first year draws to a close, its classrooms are filled with a broad range of students, all seeming confident enough to jabber away as if they were elbowing their way down Ben Yehuda Street in Jerusalem. Perhaps surprisingly, the school has become one of the most racially mixed charter schools in the city. About a third of the 150 students are black, and several are Hispanic."

Here is the full article: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/25/nyregion/25hebrew.html



Anonymous
Post 11/25/2011 20:22     Subject: Washington Hebrew
Let's go back to the "convincing the Charter Board that everybody and especially the poverty stricken kids in SE" will have to want this school and benefit from it.

That doesn't sound bad on its face. In fact it sounds good.

But then, can someone explain how the various niche charters got approved that are 100% irrelevant to the 3% families that fill Ward 3 and some of Ward 2? The same Charter Board probably wasn't convinced that KIPP, say, would appeal to families in Tenleytown. Nobody needed to prove to the Charter Board that that Hotel and Service Industry vocational-lite school would be good for the affluent kids in Cleveland Park.

Now someone is going to read this and reflexively yell "You shut up you have great JKLM choices in Ward 3 so just shut your mouth blah blah blah disadvantaged children in Ward 8 blah blah so therefore you never get to poke holes in any illogical statements blah blah blah Deal."

Howver, that doesn't get to the point. If this proposed Hebrew language school must appeal to kids in every Ward, shouldn't that have been true for some of the existing **niche** charters that don't appeal to DC children with lawyer/lobbyist parents? Are there 2 sets of regulatory criteria in the charter law?



Anonymous
Post 11/25/2011 20:10     Subject: Washington Hebrew
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I guess if we've got a latin school, why not a hebrew school, right? but I bet they don't teach the RC mass at Latin school.

Will the new charter be teaching the hebrew scriptures?

How about an Arabic school, with no reading from the Koran, of course.

Or a Christian school, not focusing on religion, but rather all the wonderful cultural changes christianity has brought humanity through the ages - music, art, crusades, gingerbread men, the inquisition, the moral majority, tinsel.

All can apply. Jews that lose the lottery at the Hebrew school are especially welcomed.


You're verging on anti-Semitic. Cool it.
Apparently the plan is to focus on Hebrew as a language only. Not on Hebrew as a cultural component of Judaism.
http://www.forward.com/articles/141654/ [although the article reads as though they've already been approved by the charter board - which they have not]


Wow, you think this is anti-semitic and not, you know, pretty anti-christian? Where is the anti-semitism, anyway? You must have your blinkers on.
Anonymous
Post 11/25/2011 20:04     Subject: Washington Hebrew
Anonymous wrote:Hebrew offers unique chances to explore the most ancient texts and study 5,000 year-old ideas.
You're kidding, right? If not then I assume you're referring to ancient Hebrew. Which, like ancient Greek and Latin, are compelling intelectually, but not applicable to a bilingual elementary school. The Hebrew charter "movement" (all 6 of them nationwide) focuses on modern Hebrew. In DC proper, an Amharic charter would probably be more practical.
Anonymous
Post 11/25/2011 19:45     Subject: Washington Hebrew
Hebrew offers unique chances to explore the most ancient texts and study 5,000 year-old ideas.
Anonymous
Post 11/25/2011 19:18     Subject: Washington Hebrew
Let's say Latin charter is elitist. Given its demographics, it appeals to elites of several ethnic/racial groups and even some FARM kids -- maybe more as time goes on.

It offers a broad education and the model is available in many other cities and attractive to college-bound students of all religions.

Compare that to Hebrew school..........

Anonymous
Post 11/25/2011 18:55     Subject: Washington Hebrew
Anonymous wrote:I had actually thought that identification with "The Hebrews" was a traditional part of many AAs' culture, no? They certainly did in the 19th century, but even today I'd say it's around in some strains of Protestantism.



Maybe so but that doesn't mean they want to study hebrew - or that it's relevant to their lives --unlike Latin which informs so much of our american language and culture - and the language and culture and history of so many other cultures.