Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Upper middle has at least some income through a w-2 and actually needs to work to maintain their lifestyle/savings.

Upper class can fully sustain themselves with investments.

Plenty of FIRE people “sustain themselves with investments.” But they are living on $100k a year in a LCOL area. That doesn’t make them upper class.

But many upper class people are cheap as hell.

For sure. But that doesn't have anything to do with whether or not they are UC.

My mother wouldn't let me order sour cream on my baked potato at Ponderosa because it cost 25 cents extra. Drive up the road from that Ponderosa (just about the only place we ever ate out, unless you count BK, which was also rare) a ways and you would come across a uni building with our name on it. Lol. She was a money hoarder -- it's a mental illness and had nothing to do with how much money there actually was, or the fact that she had grown up the way most UC people do. She was just nuts. I remember one evening at the Country Club we were having dinner with my grandparents and my grandfather looks up from the menu and says to my grandmother "Larla, we can't afford this!" and she just shook her head at him annoyed -- they could afford every dinner in the place and the building it was in to boot, and more. People have weird relationships with money and get very controlling around spending and sometimes having a lot of money doesn't really matter. My grandfather's dad jumped off a building in NYC in 1929 though (yeah, not a myth, it did happen) -- so we will allow him his trauma and controlling feelings around money.

Anonymous wrote:I don't have to work BUT I also don't have washboarded gravel or go foxhunting.

whats stopping you? get yourself a chesapeake bay retriever and teach that boy to hunt

I just love the A plane vs THE plane, lol.

I don't have to work BUT I also don't have washboarded gravel or go foxhunting.

If you have to work, you’re not upper.

Anonymous wrote:Once again, lots of people are conflating class with money, which itself is a very middle class way of looking at things.

UMC has a home theater; UC has a (live) theater subscription.

UMC has a power boat; UC has a sailboat.

UMC is terribly concerned with meeting the right people; UC already knows them. (Whether they like them is a whole 'nother matter.)

UMC has a freshly paved and sealed driveway. UC has washboarded gravel.

UMC children are William (never Will or Billy) and Charlotte (never Lottie or Char). UC children are Bungy, Lala, Chip/Trey/Quinn, and Roo.

UMC fly on A plane. UC fly on THE plane.

UMC kids learn golf from the club pro. UC kids learn from their parents and grandparents.

UMC horse-crazy daughters buy $1200 boots for horse shows. UC daughters go fox hunting in their mom's old tweeds.

You describe old money vs new money, not UMC vs UC.

Bill Gates is most certainly UC, but his horse riding daughter spends tons on the latest fashions.

Jeff Bezos owns a $250MM super yacht, not a sailboat.

None of their children are Bungy or Roo.

Neither of these terms has any fixed meaning. The end.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Upper middle class goes to Hawaii. Upper class has a condo in Hawaii.

Upper middle either lives in a great school district or sends their kids to private school. Upper class does boarding school.

Upper middle class has a cleaning lady once or twice a week. Upper class has a housekeeper.

Condos are for poor people. Not accurate

Uh not necessarily. One set of my relatives keeps a condo in Bal Harbour. They fly private and have a large place in the Caribbean, an apartment building named after our family which they own, and several other residences on the east coast. I also have additional close family members who chose a similar set up because they didn’t want the hassle of a main house as they got older. They’re multigenerational wealthy that also keep a summer home and winter home. Of course, the condo in question is a half a floor (probably 3,000 square feet) with its own private garage overlooking prime waterfront and worth at least $5 million.

Anonymous wrote:Upper middle class goes to Hawaii. Upper class has a condo in Hawaii.

Upper middle either lives in a great school district or sends their kids to private school. Upper class does boarding school.

Upper middle class has a cleaning lady once or twice a week. Upper class has a housekeeper.

Condos are for poor people. Not accurate

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Based on these responses you can be upper class while earning $100k in investments, sitting on a not for profit board and living extremely modestly. But upper middle while earning $1 million.

We are borderline of UMC and UC. $3m HHI, few properties, can technically retire but cannot maintain current lifestyle without working.

Some people may say we are definitely UC. I consider ourselves UMC.

What is your net worth?

Around $15m, enough to retire but not maintain our lifestyle. We have 3 minor children.

What's your lifestyle and yearly spend? At $15m you could spend >500k/yr forever.

We have 3 kids to pay for college, grad school, weddings, down pays. Yes, we can retire but we are still in our forties and will probably work for another ten years.

The people I consider UC are ones with generational wealth where you don’t have to work. I always tell my kids they aren’t rich because they will have to get a job after college.

Upper middle = works for a living
Upper = doesn’t have to work/lives on dividends

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Based on these responses you can be upper class while earning $100k in investments, sitting on a not for profit board and living extremely modestly. But upper middle while earning $1 million.

We are borderline of UMC and UC. $3m HHI, few properties, can technically retire but cannot maintain current lifestyle without working.

Some people may say we are definitely UC. I consider ourselves UMC.

What is your net worth?

Around $15m, enough to retire but not maintain our lifestyle. We have 3 minor children.

What's your lifestyle and yearly spend? At $15m you could spend >500k/yr forever.

Anonymous wrote:Once again, lots of people are conflating class with money, which itself is a very middle class way of looking at things.

UMC has a home theater; UC has a (live) theater subscription.

UMC has a power boat; UC has a sailboat.

UMC is terribly concerned with meeting the right people; UC already knows them. (Whether they like them is a whole 'nother matter.)

UMC has a freshly paved and sealed driveway. UC has washboarded gravel.

UMC children are William (never Will or Billy) and Charlotte (never Lottie or Char). UC children are Bungy, Lala, Chip/Trey/Quinn, and Roo.

UMC fly on A plane. UC fly on THE plane.

UMC kids learn golf from the club pro. UC kids learn from their parents and grandparents.

UMC horse-crazy daughters buy $1200 boots for horse shows. UC daughters go fox hunting in their mom's old tweeds.

Your formulation makes it seem like "upper class" people, who I guess have ages of meritless wealth, are better than the sad, striving "upper middle class." Jokes on you. They are mostly all losers.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Based on these responses you can be upper class while earning $100k in investments, sitting on a not for profit board and living extremely modestly. But upper middle while earning $1 million.

We are borderline of UMC and UC. $3m HHI, few properties, can technically retire but cannot maintain current lifestyle without working.

Some people may say we are definitely UC. I consider ourselves UMC.

You are kidding. You are very wealthy and up.

Upper middle class flies business, upper class flies private