Anonymous
11/15/2025 18:33
Subject: Camp Mystic lawsuits filed
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:So many parents dont investigate. They just assume someone is taking care of that stuff, even more so with rich people.
I’ll admit I’m guilty of this. DD spent a good chunk of her summers from ages 10-18 at a camp that I never saw much beyond the pickup/dropoff point, which looked lovely and very safe. Last year, she finally took us on a tour of the entire camp and I was shocked at how isolated and remote some of the areas were. I do think that they had excellent emergency plans in place, but I could also see how things could get dangerous really fast.
I mean, it was a camp for rich/upper middle class girls that has been around for generations. A lot of us go off of word of mouth recs from other parents rather than analyzing camp maps and flood risk data.
But yes the camp deserves to be sued. The wife of the camp owner who died had to be helicoptered out one year because of flood waters. They certainly knew how dangerous the situation was.
The husband knew enough to petition the state to have the doomed cabins removed from the flood plain so that he would be allowed to let girls sleep there.
They petitioned FEMA, likely hoping to reduce their flood insurance costs. And FEMA agreed with them. That seems to refute the claim they knew this was a plausible risk.
I grew up in the upper midwest with floods, but those were far slower floods than flash floods like this incident. It is mind-boggling to me how quickly this flood progressed-- the river rose 26 feet in 45 minutes!
Yes, the area was known for flash flooding, but every aspect of this was a worst-case scenario. This was the highest recorded flood level. It rose extraordinarily fast, even for this area. It happened over a holiday weekend, with less support/warning from local emergency services. And it occurred overnight, likely delaying their understanding of how bad the flood was getting and impairing evacuations.
I do think it was negligent to have cabins with kids that close to the river. And I think the camp should have been more careful with monitoring the situation and calling for evacuations. But it also seems like this was both a truly exceptional event and a situation where emergency services should have more infrastructure in place in detect and warn of major floods as they occur.
The bolded is no reason to not have reasonable plans. It was in a flood plain that had flooded badly in the past. The owners knew and should have been concerned just based on the weather forecast.
Anonymous
11/15/2025 16:20
Subject: Camp Mystic lawsuits filed
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:So many parents dont investigate. They just assume someone is taking care of that stuff, even more so with rich people.
I’ll admit I’m guilty of this. DD spent a good chunk of her summers from ages 10-18 at a camp that I never saw much beyond the pickup/dropoff point, which looked lovely and very safe. Last year, she finally took us on a tour of the entire camp and I was shocked at how isolated and remote some of the areas were. I do think that they had excellent emergency plans in place, but I could also see how things could get dangerous really fast.
I mean, it was a camp for rich/upper middle class girls that has been around for generations. A lot of us go off of word of mouth recs from other parents rather than analyzing camp maps and flood risk data.
But yes the camp deserves to be sued. The wife of the camp owner who died had to be helicoptered out one year because of flood waters. They certainly knew how dangerous the situation was.
The husband knew enough to petition the state to have the doomed cabins removed from the flood plain so that he would be allowed to let girls sleep there.
They petitioned FEMA, likely hoping to reduce their flood insurance costs. And FEMA agreed with them. That seems to refute the claim they knew this was a plausible risk.
I grew up in the upper midwest with floods, but those were far slower floods than flash floods like this incident. It is mind-boggling to me how quickly this flood progressed-- the river rose 26 feet in 45 minutes!
Yes, the area was known for flash flooding, but every aspect of this was a worst-case scenario. This was the highest recorded flood level. It rose extraordinarily fast, even for this area. It happened over a holiday weekend, with less support/warning from local emergency services. And it occurred overnight, likely delaying their understanding of how bad the flood was getting and impairing evacuations.
I do think it was negligent to have cabins with kids that close to the river. And I think the camp should have been more careful with monitoring the situation and calling for evacuations. But it also seems like this was both a truly exceptional event and a situation where emergency services should have more infrastructure in place in detect and warn of major floods as they occur.
No. You are wrong. Stop making excuses for these people.
For the last two summers I worked for a few weeks at an overnight summer camp in NC. Had in-depth conversations with the camp owner about what it means to responsible for hundreds of young people in your care. How you anticipate problems, even worst case scenarios. How you spend money to make sure your camp is as safe as possible, and you happily invite inspections so you can be accredited.
She was so angry and disgusted with the Camp Mystic owners. As am I. They knew better, but were happy to cut corners and take those risks.
You often don't know you're in a worst-case scenario until after it's over. That's the problem. You need to make decisions off incomplete information. How do you balance the moderate-impact risks that are direct and apparent (i.e., an evacuation at night through severe weather) against unprecedented (and thus, highly unlikely) risks with catastrophic impacts (i.e., a record-level flood that grew in record time)?
Suppose it had been like the 1987 flood, but they chose to evacuate through dangerous conditions, leading to (a much smaller number of) injuries or deaths? People now would be saying they should have sheltered-in-place, on the basis that this kind of flood was highly unlikely.
Anonymous
11/15/2025 16:11
Subject: Camp Mystic lawsuits filed
This is Texas they didn’t give a shit about Ulvade
Anonymous
11/15/2025 16:09
Subject: Camp Mystic lawsuits filed
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I was a camp counselor and at that age was very obedient to authority. I hope I would have had the presence of mind and confidence in my judgement to evacuate the kids despite being told to stay, but I'm not sure I would have, especially never having lived through major flooding. I likely would have trusted that the owners knew best. It's such a tragedy.
Those counselors that moved the kids are heroes.
The counselors that moved the kids, and the ones who stayed and died with their kids are all heroes. The counselors didn't have phones. They didn't have walkie talkies or weather radios. They aren't to blame for realizing that the camp leadership was giving them misinformation.
Was it misinformation, though? Or a [ultimately incorrect] risk assessment based on limited information, with dire consequences?
If this has been like the previous catastrophic flood in 1987, the water would have made it into some of the cabins, but probably wouldn't have posed a real danger. Unlike attempting an evacuation through severe weather with small kids, in the dark.
I don't think some of you understand how quickly the water rose and how exceptional the situation was compared to past floods.
I don't know what the camp officials knew or when they knew it. But I'm remembering my days at camp in the midwest. What if a severe storm had come through at night- one with the hallmarks of a storm that generates tornadoes? Do we hunker down in the tents? Hike through the storm to the shelter? At what point do head for a ditch or low ground? Obviously these days we'd expect to be notified of tornadoes based on radar and weather alerts, but that wasn't always the case.
Anonymous
11/15/2025 13:56
Subject: Camp Mystic lawsuits filed
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:So many parents dont investigate. They just assume someone is taking care of that stuff, even more so with rich people.
I’ll admit I’m guilty of this. DD spent a good chunk of her summers from ages 10-18 at a camp that I never saw much beyond the pickup/dropoff point, which looked lovely and very safe. Last year, she finally took us on a tour of the entire camp and I was shocked at how isolated and remote some of the areas were. I do think that they had excellent emergency plans in place, but I could also see how things could get dangerous really fast.
I mean, it was a camp for rich/upper middle class girls that has been around for generations. A lot of us go off of word of mouth recs from other parents rather than analyzing camp maps and flood risk data.
But yes the camp deserves to be sued. The wife of the camp owner who died had to be helicoptered out one year because of flood waters. They certainly knew how dangerous the situation was.
The husband knew enough to petition the state to have the doomed cabins removed from the flood plain so that he would be allowed to let girls sleep there.
They petitioned FEMA, likely hoping to reduce their flood insurance costs. And FEMA agreed with them. That seems to refute the claim they knew this was a plausible risk.
I grew up in the upper midwest with floods, but those were far slower floods than flash floods like this incident. It is mind-boggling to me how quickly this flood progressed-- the river rose 26 feet in 45 minutes!
Yes, the area was known for flash flooding, but every aspect of this was a worst-case scenario. This was the highest recorded flood level. It rose extraordinarily fast, even for this area. It happened over a holiday weekend, with less support/warning from local emergency services. And it occurred overnight, likely delaying their understanding of how bad the flood was getting and impairing evacuations.
I do think it was negligent to have cabins with kids that close to the river. And I think the camp should have been more careful with monitoring the situation and calling for evacuations. But it also seems like this was both a truly exceptional event and a situation where emergency services should have more infrastructure in place in detect and warn of major floods as they occur.
No. You are wrong. Stop making excuses for these people.
For the last two summers I worked for a few weeks at an overnight summer camp in NC. Had in-depth conversations with the camp owner about what it means to responsible for hundreds of young people in your care. How you anticipate problems, even worst case scenarios. How you spend money to make sure your camp is as safe as possible, and you happily invite inspections so you can be accredited.
She was so angry and disgusted with the Camp Mystic owners. As am I. They knew better, but were happy to cut corners and take those risks.
Anonymous
11/15/2025 13:32
Subject: Camp Mystic lawsuits filed
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:So many parents dont investigate. They just assume someone is taking care of that stuff, even more so with rich people.
I’ll admit I’m guilty of this. DD spent a good chunk of her summers from ages 10-18 at a camp that I never saw much beyond the pickup/dropoff point, which looked lovely and very safe. Last year, she finally took us on a tour of the entire camp and I was shocked at how isolated and remote some of the areas were. I do think that they had excellent emergency plans in place, but I could also see how things could get dangerous really fast.
I mean, it was a camp for rich/upper middle class girls that has been around for generations. A lot of us go off of word of mouth recs from other parents rather than analyzing camp maps and flood risk data.
But yes the camp deserves to be sued. The wife of the camp owner who died had to be helicoptered out one year because of flood waters. They certainly knew how dangerous the situation was.
But maybe you shouldn’t just use word of mouth when it comes to the safety of your kids. That’s the lesson.
I mean these are people who are outsourcing all their kids’ basic needs to other people from the time they’re born. They’re in the habit of choosing the highly-rated help and trusting the reputation
That doesn’t describe most of these families at all. I know tons of former and current Mystic campers and can assure you most of them have very involved, hands-on parents.
Anonymous
11/15/2025 13:25
Subject: Camp Mystic lawsuits filed
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:One of the lawsuits makes it very plain that if they had only allowed the girls to walk the short distance to the rec hall even 20 mins earlier or hours earlier..they’d be alive.
Also mentioned they moved equipment to higher ground before evacuating a single camper. [/quote]
WHAT?? I did not know this before. This is criminal.
“The Camp Ignored the Warnings and Protected Equipment, Not Girls.
68. Richard and Edward met in the main office around 1:45 a.m., some 30 minutes after the warning. Rather than turning to the cabins, they convened the grounds crew and started securing equipment. The Camp reports it has a picture of Richard Eastland with the grounds crew at 2:13 a.m. still working on this task. By that point, 59 critical minutes had passed since defendants were warned
by the weather service of “life threatening flash flooding” impacting their camp.”
Page 15.
https://www.courthousenews.com/wp-content/uploads/2025/11/bellows-v-camp-mystic-lawsuit.pdf
Anonymous
11/15/2025 13:13
Subject: Camp Mystic lawsuits filed
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:The camp owners should have discussed and involved the grieving families in their decision to reopen, and designing a memorial without family input is terrible.
I know it’s cultish and that has its appeal to some, but I can’t imagine sending my kids to a camp where children died and still have not been found and still knowing absolutely no idea how their last moments played out.
It was God's plan...
BS no GoD wants kids dead
You disgusting cult member
Anonymous
11/15/2025 13:13
Subject: Camp Mystic lawsuits filed
Anonymous wrote:One of the lawsuits makes it very plain that if they had only allowed the girls to walk the short distance to the rec hall even 20 mins earlier or hours earlier..they’d be alive.
Also mentioned they moved equipment to higher ground before evacuating a single camper. [/quote]
WHAT?? I did not know this before. This is criminal.
Anonymous
11/15/2025 13:10
Subject: Camp Mystic lawsuits filed
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:They also pretended to the families that girls were missing when they knew they had died, the filings allege.
Exactly. They found many campers dead in the car with the owner, but kept telling the parents they were “missing”. At least one found dead in a cabin. Parents and the rest of the world were told “missing” for days and days.
I was on pins and needles for days! I can’t imagine how they felt.
They probably couldn't positively identify the bodies. The kids wouldn't have ID or nametags.
Anonymous
11/15/2025 13:01
Subject: Camp Mystic lawsuits filed
Anonymous wrote:I was a camp counselor and at that age was very obedient to authority. I hope I would have had the presence of mind and confidence in my judgement to evacuate the kids despite being told to stay, but I'm not sure I would have, especially never having lived through major flooding. I likely would have trusted that the owners knew best. It's such a tragedy.
Those counselors that moved the kids are heroes.
The counselors that moved the kids, and the ones who stayed and died with their kids are all heroes. The counselors didn't have phones. They didn't have walkie talkies or weather radios. They aren't to blame for realizing that the camp leadership was giving them misinformation.
Anonymous
11/15/2025 13:01
Subject: Camp Mystic lawsuits filed
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:So many parents dont investigate. They just assume someone is taking care of that stuff, even more so with rich people.
I’ll admit I’m guilty of this. DD spent a good chunk of her summers from ages 10-18 at a camp that I never saw much beyond the pickup/dropoff point, which looked lovely and very safe. Last year, she finally took us on a tour of the entire camp and I was shocked at how isolated and remote some of the areas were. I do think that they had excellent emergency plans in place, but I could also see how things could get dangerous really fast.
I mean, it was a camp for rich/upper middle class girls that has been around for generations. A lot of us go off of word of mouth recs from other parents rather than analyzing camp maps and flood risk data.
But yes the camp deserves to be sued. The wife of the camp owner who died had to be helicoptered out one year because of flood waters. They certainly knew how dangerous the situation was.
But maybe you shouldn’t just use word of mouth when it comes to the safety of your kids. That’s the lesson.
I mean these are people who are outsourcing all their kids’ basic needs to other people from the time they’re born. They’re in the habit of choosing the highly-rated help and trusting the reputation
Anonymous
11/15/2025 12:56
Subject: Camp Mystic lawsuits filed
Anonymous wrote:I was a camp counselor and at that age was very obedient to authority. I hope I would have had the presence of mind and confidence in my judgement to evacuate the kids despite being told to stay, but I'm not sure I would have, especially never having lived through major flooding. I likely would have trusted that the owners knew best. It's such a tragedy.
Those counselors that moved the kids are heroes.
Everyone should read the Gift of Fear to learn how to listen to your gut instinct in situations like this. I had the same feeling after 9/11 — if I’d been in the towers I know I would have stayed at my desk when told despite every cell of my body screaming GET out!
Anonymous
11/15/2025 12:47
Subject: Camp Mystic lawsuits filed
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:They also pretended to the families that girls were missing when they knew they had died, the filings allege.
Exactly. They found many campers dead in the car with the owner, but kept telling the parents they were “missing”. At least one found dead in a cabin. Parents and the rest of the world were told “missing” for days and days.
I was on pins and needles for days! I can’t imagine how they felt.
Were you really? It was clear that they had died. I understand the parents holding out hope, but assumed the general public was more realistic.
Anonymous
11/15/2025 12:46
Subject: Camp Mystic lawsuits filed
I was a camp counselor and at that age was very obedient to authority. I hope I would have had the presence of mind and confidence in my judgement to evacuate the kids despite being told to stay, but I'm not sure I would have, especially never having lived through major flooding. I likely would have trusted that the owners knew best. It's such a tragedy.
Those counselors that moved the kids are heroes.
Those counselors that moved the kids are heroes.