Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have a home in a very red state, and we and the neighbors are all happily harboring an undocumented immigrant from Latin America who does tremendous yardwork for all of us. We pay very very well. And we advise on how to keep their head low and avoid ICE.


I have no qualms about this. What is going on in this country right now is morally wrong. These people work their butts off, are law abiding good people and make our country great. THEY’RE doing that. Not MAGA.

And, you are breaking the law.

Indeed. Are you willing to go to jail for years? When ICE comes, are you going to forcibly resist them? Just because you believe something is morally wrong doesn't mean you get to break the law.

I'm not going to jail. That's ridiculous. And ICE isn't allowed on my property without a warrant, and they don't know -- and can't know -- that he comes here to work because I pay cash.

Aiding and abetting an "illegal alien" (an unauthorized alien) is a federal crime under 8 U.S.C. § 1324 and can result in significant fines and imprisonment. The law prohibits actions such as smuggling, harboring, or transporting unauthorized aliens within the United States, as well as encouraging or inducing them to enter the country. Illegally employing aliens is aiding and abetting.

you would have to prove intent which would be difficult. You have no way of proving knowledge of immigration status.

Also don't be such useless jerk. Landscapers and housekeepers are not going to hurt you fool.

Tell that to Molly Tibbetts. Oh, you can't. She's dead. Killed by a Mexican illegal immigrant working illegally on a farm.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t agree with the way MAGAs are approaching this as hunting down immigrants for sport, but there needs to be humane immigration reform. Plenty of people all over the world are in bad situations and would love to live in the US. Laws need to be respected.

Drop me a lime with those laws or changed so that people like our guy have a realistic chance of legal immigration. Until then I’m hiding him.

That’s the crux: he’ll never have a realistic chance at legal immigration because his economic value and utility is *derived* from his undocumented status.

Your worker is a good person and you are well intentioned. Nonetheless, if your worker had legal status his costs of operating his business would go up. As it is, he is paid cash under the table, he accepts more risk than a worker with legal status would (risks that would more properly be allocated to you the homeowner), and he very likely does not report his income to the IRS. This all means he is cheaper than properly authorized labor. A cost savings that *you* are the true beneficiary of. The net effect is that you get cheaper cost services and domestic workers with legal status are priced out of the market.

I’m sure you think that using and harboring cheap labor is noble. But the reality is that no matter how good your intentions are and how decent a person your landscaper is, you are intentionally engaging in economic activity that benefits you materially, helps the undocumented laborer but undercuts the domestic workforce. You are selling out the American labor force so that you can have extra dollars. In doing so, you are perpetuating inequality and creating a permanent economic underclass.

If your laborer ever actually had legal status, he would find himself price undercut by undocumented labor. If you were using above board labor, your prices would go up.

No, he'll never have a legal chance at immigration because the current law doesn't allow it under any circumstances. And I'm not benefiting economically in any way, shape or form. As I said earlier, I also have a lawn service where the workers appear to be documented and I'm very sure -- based on what I pay the company -- that the workers are paid less than my undocumented guy. For your argument to make any sense, I would have to be paying my guy a low wage, but I'm not. And do you know why I'm not? Because he does a BETTER job than anyone I've used around here from your so-called "domestic" workforce. They don't do half as good a job that he does. I pay him what he's worth, and I'm not undercutting anyone. If the "domestic" workforce wants $30+ an hour to take care of my yard, it can do that by doing comparable work.

In short, the whole premise of your argument is that I'm underpaying, which I'm not. I'm paying generously. I always pay generously for good work. "Domestic" laborers, by and large, do shitty work and then blame immigrants.

"I pay him what he's worth"

no you don't, you pay him what YOU think he is worth, but in the mind of elites like yourself that is equivalent.

the contempt for US workers drips from your keyboard.

reminds me of a conversation with an Indian immigrant i worked with, he was saying how he didn't have to hire a company to do yardwork, he would go to home depot and hire a few folks and pay them in cash. he said it was cheaper and they did great work. He saw nothing wrong with this. being from a culture that allows the elites to treat the workers as trash, as dalits , it was to be expected.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t agree with the way MAGAs are approaching this as hunting down immigrants for sport, but there needs to be humane immigration reform. Plenty of people all over the world are in bad situations and would love to live in the US. Laws need to be respected.

Drop me a lime with those laws or changed so that people like our guy have a realistic chance of legal immigration. Until then I’m hiding him.

That’s the crux: he’ll never have a realistic chance at legal immigration because his economic value and utility is *derived* from his undocumented status.

Your worker is a good person and you are well intentioned. Nonetheless, if your worker had legal status his costs of operating his business would go up. As it is, he is paid cash under the table, he accepts more risk than a worker with legal status would (risks that would more properly be allocated to you the homeowner), and he very likely does not report his income to the IRS. This all means he is cheaper than properly authorized labor. A cost savings that *you* are the true beneficiary of. The net effect is that you get cheaper cost services and domestic workers with legal status are priced out of the market.

I’m sure you think that using and harboring cheap labor is noble. But the reality is that no matter how good your intentions are and how decent a person your landscaper is, you are intentionally engaging in economic activity that benefits you materially, helps the undocumented laborer but undercuts the domestic workforce. You are selling out the American labor force so that you can have extra dollars. In doing so, you are perpetuating inequality and creating a permanent economic underclass.

If your laborer ever actually had legal status, he would find himself price undercut by undocumented labor. If you were using above board labor, your prices would go up.

No, he'll never have a legal chance at immigration because the current law doesn't allow it under any circumstances. And I'm not benefiting economically in any way, shape or form. As I said earlier, I also have a lawn service where the workers appear to be documented and I'm very sure -- based on what I pay the company -- that the workers are paid less than my undocumented guy. For your argument to make any sense, I would have to be paying my guy a low wage, but I'm not. And do you know why I'm not? Because he does a BETTER job than anyone I've used around here from your so-called "domestic" workforce. They don't do half as good a job that he does. I pay him what he's worth, and I'm not undercutting anyone. If the "domestic" workforce wants $30+ an hour to take care of my yard, it can do that by doing comparable work.

In short, the whole premise of your argument is that I'm underpaying, which I'm not. I'm paying generously. I always pay generously for good work. "Domestic" laborers, by and large, do shitty work and then blame immigrants.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t agree with the way MAGAs are approaching this as hunting down immigrants for sport, but there needs to be humane immigration reform. Plenty of people all over the world are in bad situations and would love to live in the US. Laws need to be respected.

Drop me a lime with those laws or changed so that people like our guy have a realistic chance of legal immigration. Until then I’m hiding him.

That’s the crux: he’ll never have a realistic chance at legal immigration because his economic value and utility is *derived* from his undocumented status.

Your worker is a good person and you are well intentioned. Nonetheless, if your worker had legal status his costs of operating his business would go up. As it is, he is paid cash under the table, he accepts more risk than a worker with legal status would (risks that would more properly be allocated to you the homeowner), and he very likely does not report his income to the IRS. This all means he is cheaper than properly authorized labor. A cost savings that *you* are the true beneficiary of. The net effect is that you get cheaper cost services and domestic workers with legal status are priced out of the market.

I’m sure you think that using and harboring cheap labor is noble. But the reality is that no matter how good your intentions are and how decent a person your landscaper is, you are intentionally engaging in economic activity that benefits you materially, helps the undocumented laborer but undercuts the domestic workforce. You are selling out the American labor force so that you can have extra dollars. In doing so, you are perpetuating inequality and creating a permanent economic underclass.

If your laborer ever actually had legal status, he would find himself price undercut by undocumented labor. If you were using above board labor, your prices would go up.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t agree with the way MAGAs are approaching this as hunting down immigrants for sport, but there needs to be humane immigration reform. Plenty of people all over the world are in bad situations and would love to live in the US. Laws need to be respected.

Drop me a lime with those laws or changed so that people like our guy have a realistic chance of legal immigration. Until then I’m hiding him.

That’s the crux: he’ll never have a realistic chance at legal immigration because his economic value and utility is *derived* from his undocumented status.

Your worker is a good person and you are well intentioned. Nonetheless, if your worker had legal status his costs of operating his business would go up. As it is, he is paid cash under the table, he accepts more risk than a worker with legal status would (risks that would more properly be allocated to you the homeowner), and he very likely does not report his income to the IRS. This all means he is cheaper than properly authorized labor. A cost savings that *you* are the true beneficiary of. The net effect is that you get cheaper cost services and domestic workers with legal status are priced out of the market.

I’m sure you think that using and harboring cheap labor is noble. But the reality is that no matter how good your intentions are and how decent a person your landscaper is, you are intentionally engaging in economic activity that benefits you materially, helps the undocumented laborer but undercuts the domestic workforce. You are selling out the American labor force so that you can have extra dollars. In doing so, you are perpetuating inequality and creating a permanent economic underclass.

If your laborer ever actually had legal status, he would find himself price undercut by undocumented labor. If you were using above board labor, your prices would go up.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t agree with the way MAGAs are approaching this as hunting down immigrants for sport, but there needs to be humane immigration reform. Plenty of people all over the world are in bad situations and would love to live in the US. Laws need to be respected.

Drop me a lime with those laws or changed so that people like our guy have a realistic chance of legal immigration. Until then I’m hiding him.

That’s the crux: he’ll never have a realistic chance at legal immigration because his economic value and utility is *derived* from his undocumented status.

Your worker is a good person and you are well intentioned. Nonetheless, if your worker had legal status his costs of operating his business would go up. As it is, he is paid cash under the table, he accepts more risk than a worker with legal status would (risks that would more properly be allocated to you the homeowner), and he very likely does not report his income to the IRS. This all means he is cheaper than properly authorized labor. A cost savings that *you* are the true beneficiary of. The net effect is that you get cheaper cost services and domestic workers with legal status are priced out of the market.

I’m sure you think that using and harboring cheap labor is noble. But the reality is that no matter how good your intentions are and how decent a person your landscaper is, you are intentionally engaging in economic activity that benefits you materially, helps the undocumented laborer but undercuts the domestic workforce. You are selling out the American labor force so that you can have extra dollars. In doing so, you are perpetuating inequality and creating a permanent economic underclass.

If your laborer ever actually had legal status, he would find himself price undercut by undocumented labor. If you were using above board labor, your prices would go up.

Anonymous wrote:They crossed the border illegally. They may have a criminal record at how , you do not know. They did not follow the law. Many people have to wait for years to get a visa to come to the US and follow the rules.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t agree with the way MAGAs are approaching this as hunting down immigrants for sport, but there needs to be humane immigration reform. Plenty of people all over the world are in bad situations and would love to live in the US. Laws need to be respected.

Drop me a lime with those laws or changed so that people like our guy have a realistic chance of legal immigration. Until then I’m hiding him.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have a home in a very red state, and we and the neighbors are all happily harboring an undocumented immigrant from Latin America who does tremendous yardwork for all of us. We pay very very well. And we advise on how to keep their head low and avoid ICE.


I have no qualms about this. What is going on in this country right now is morally wrong. These people work their butts off, are law abiding good people and make our country great. THEY’RE doing that. Not MAGA.

Good for you. People like your landscaper have done more for our country than many of the MAGA crazies.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You pay VERY VERY well in CASH so that income doesn't get reported or taxed by your state or the federal government. The worker gets screwed if he gets hurt because he has no health or disability insurance when working with equipment that could be dangerous to his health. He gets no social security when he gets old and his body is worn down.

There is a chance your gardener actually can work legally in the US but it is a way better to get all you money in cash in the short-term because you don't have to report it. If your Gardner came in the last three years chances are they claimed asylum and can legally work.

He’s been here 20 years. Has never claimed asylum. There’s virtually zero chance he could ever legalize his situation—especially under the current administration. People who say stuff like that simply don’t understand how our immigration system and process works. Guys like him for all practical purposes can never, ever get legal status here under the law.

He doesn’t work with heavy equipment. You’re right — he can’t get social security or any benefits should he ever get hurt (or when he gets old) but there’s nothing I can do about any of that other than pay him well and hope he manages his money well.

Finally, the idea that I somehow personally benefit from paying in cash is ridiculous. He does not work for me full-time—he works throughout the neighborhood and elsewhere as well. I don’t know everything he does, but I know what I and the neighbor who recommended him to me pay him. I probably personally end up paying him maybe $1500 a season? I pay over $30 a hour.

The guy works like a horse and goes home. That’s all he does. I don’t know where he lives or who he lives with and I don’t ask. All I know is he isn’t married and doesn’t drink. Never has. He’s extremely honest and reliable. He’ll text when he plans to arrive; he shows up, does what he thinks needs to be done, and leaves. If I’m not here when he comes, he’ll text me how many hours he worked and the next time I see him I pay him.

I speak Spanish fluently. I text him from when I haven’t heard from him and make sure he’s ok and lying low—which he always is. I think he’s being pretty smart. If ICE finds him and does anything with him that puts firmly to rest any bullshit claim that they’re only going after the “bad guys.”

Wow. You know your IP number can be traced, right? Jeff won’t turn you in, I’m sure but I think LE could compell
Him to turn over your number.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You pay VERY VERY well in CASH so that income doesn't get reported or taxed by your state or the federal government. The worker gets screwed if he gets hurt because he has no health or disability insurance when working with equipment that could be dangerous to his health. He gets no social security when he gets old and his body is worn down.

There is a chance your gardener actually can work legally in the US but it is a way better to get all you money in cash in the short-term because you don't have to report it. If your Gardner came in the last three years chances are they claimed asylum and can legally work.

He’s been here 20 years. Has never claimed asylum. There’s virtually zero chance he could ever legalize his situation—especially under the current administration. People who say stuff like that simply don’t understand how our immigration system and process works. Guys like him for all practical purposes can never, ever get legal status here under the law.

He doesn’t work with heavy equipment. You’re right — he can’t get social security or any benefits should he ever get hurt (or when he gets old) but there’s nothing I can do about any of that other than pay him well and hope he manages his money well.

Finally, the idea that I somehow personally benefit from paying in cash is ridiculous. He does not work for me full-time—he works throughout the neighborhood and elsewhere as well. I don’t know everything he does, but I know what I and the neighbor who recommended him to me pay him. I probably personally end up paying him maybe $1500 a season? I pay over $30 a hour.

The guy works like a horse and goes home. That’s all he does. I don’t know where he lives or who he lives with and I don’t ask. All I know is he isn’t married and doesn’t drink. Never has. He’s extremely honest and reliable. He’ll text when he plans to arrive; he shows up, does what he thinks needs to be done, and leaves. If I’m not here when he comes, he’ll text me how many hours he worked and the next time I see him I pay him.

I speak Spanish fluently. I text him from when I haven’t heard from him and make sure he’s ok and lying low—which he always is. I think he’s being pretty smart. If ICE finds him and does anything with him that puts firmly to rest any bullshit claim that they’re only going after the “bad guys.”

Wow. You know your IP number can be traced, right? Jeff won’t turn you in, I’m sure but I think LE could compell
Him to turn over your number.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have a home in a very red state, and we and the neighbors are all happily harboring an undocumented immigrant from Latin America who does tremendous yardwork for all of us. We pay very very well. And we advise on how to keep their head low and avoid ICE.


I have no qualms about this. What is going on in this country right now is morally wrong. These people work their butts off, are law abiding good people and make our country great. THEY’RE doing that. Not MAGA.

And, you are breaking the law.

Indeed. Are you willing to go to jail for years? When ICE comes, are you going to forcibly resist them? Just because you believe something is morally wrong doesn't mean you get to break the law.

I'm not going to jail. That's ridiculous. And ICE isn't allowed on my property without a warrant, and they don't know -- and can't know -- that he comes here to work because I pay cash.

Aiding and abetting an "illegal alien" (an unauthorized alien) is a federal crime under 8 U.S.C. § 1324 and can result in significant fines and imprisonment. The law prohibits actions such as smuggling, harboring, or transporting unauthorized aliens within the United States, as well as encouraging or inducing them to enter the country. Illegally employing aliens is aiding and abetting.

you would have to prove intent which would be difficult. You have no way of proving knowledge of immigration status.

Also don't be such useless jerk. Landscapers and housekeepers are not going to hurt you fool.

Tell that to Molly Tibbetts. Oh, you can't. She's dead. Killed by a Mexican illegal immigrant working illegally on a farm.

Anonymous wrote:We have a home in a very red state, and we and the neighbors are all happily harboring an undocumented immigrant from Latin America who does tremendous yardwork for all of us. We pay very very well. And we advise on how to keep their head low and avoid ICE.


I have no qualms about this. What is going on in this country right now is morally wrong. These people work their butts off, are law abiding good people and make our country great. THEY’RE doing that. Not MAGA.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You pay VERY VERY well in CASH so that income doesn't get reported or taxed by your state or the federal government. The worker gets screwed if he gets hurt because he has no health or disability insurance when working with equipment that could be dangerous to his health. He gets no social security when he gets old and his body is worn down.

There is a chance your gardener actually can work legally in the US but it is a way better to get all you money in cash in the short-term because you don't have to report it. If your Gardner came in the last three years chances are they claimed asylum and can legally work.

He’s been here 20 years. Has never claimed asylum. There’s virtually zero chance he could ever legalize his situation—especially under the current administration. People who say stuff like that simply don’t understand how our immigration system and process works. Guys like him for all practical purposes can never, ever get legal status here under the law.

He doesn’t work with heavy equipment. You’re right — he can’t get social security or any benefits should he ever get hurt (or when he gets old) but there’s nothing I can do about any of that other than pay him well and hope he manages his money well.

Finally, the idea that I somehow personally benefit from paying in cash is ridiculous. He does not work for me full-time—he works throughout the neighborhood and elsewhere as well. I don’t know everything he does, but I know what I and the neighbor who recommended him to me pay him. I probably personally end up paying him maybe $1500 a season? I pay over $30 a hour.

The guy works like a horse and goes home. That’s all he does. I don’t know where he lives or who he lives with and I don’t ask. All I know is he isn’t married and doesn’t drink. Never has. He’s extremely honest and reliable. He’ll text when he plans to arrive; he shows up, does what he thinks needs to be done, and leaves. If I’m not here when he comes, he’ll text me how many hours he worked and the next time I see him I pay him.

I speak Spanish fluently. I text him from when I haven’t heard from him and make sure he’s ok and lying low—which he always is. I think he’s being pretty smart. If ICE finds him and does anything with him that puts firmly to rest any bullshit claim that they’re only going after the “bad guys.”

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have a home in a very red state, and we and the neighbors are all happily harboring an undocumented immigrant from Latin America who does tremendous yardwork for all of us. We pay very very well. And we advise on how to keep their head low and avoid ICE.


I have no qualms about this. What is going on in this country right now is morally wrong. These people work their butts off, are law abiding good people and make our country great. THEY’RE doing that. Not MAGA.

And, you are breaking the law.

Indeed. Are you willing to go to jail for years? When ICE comes, are you going to forcibly resist them? Just because you believe something is morally wrong doesn't mean you get to break the law.

I'm not going to jail. That's ridiculous. And ICE isn't allowed on my property without a warrant, and they don't know -- and can't know -- that he comes here to work because I pay cash.

Aiding and abetting an "illegal alien" (an unauthorized alien) is a federal crime under 8 U.S.C. § 1324 and can result in significant fines and imprisonment. The law prohibits actions such as smuggling, harboring, or transporting unauthorized aliens within the United States, as well as encouraging or inducing them to enter the country. Illegally employing aliens is aiding and abetting.

you would have to prove intent which would be difficult. You have no way of proving knowledge of immigration status.

Also don't be such useless jerk. Landscapers and housekeepers are not going to hurt you fool.