Anonymous
Post 02/12/2025 09:23     Subject: How long till the economy collapses?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Anyone who has lived through the collapse of a democracy or studied that topic is very worried. Are they crazy or just better informed than you about the signs that institutions are failing and power is being dangerously ceded to one man with authoritarian tendencies?

A lot depends on if the executive still follows the courts. The legislative branch has shown no signs of being a check. They’ve been verbally threatening not to follow court orders for a few days. Threatening judges. Project 2025 says ignore the court rulings and proceed with your policies.

Are we crazy for taking them at their word? Where do other people find the confidence to believe they wouldn’t actually do it?


Really something that reducing the size of the federal workforce and ending ridiculous spending by USAID = the end of democracy.



This hyperbole is really unhinged. Obama issued EOs that exceeded his authority and were blocked by courts. Biden did the same (ex. student loan forgiveness). This is not at all an uncommon practice and does not equal a Constitutional crisis. The courts will either uphold the EOs or block them. Our democracy won’t fall apart and the left loses credibility by claiming this.


One pretty important difference is that Biden and Obama complied with the court decisions. Trump is violating them.


This.
Anonymous
Post 02/12/2025 09:22     Subject: How long till the economy collapses?
Right now we're heading for stagflation. 1970s here we come!
Anonymous
Post 02/12/2025 09:21     Subject: How long till the economy collapses?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Anyone who has lived through the collapse of a democracy or studied that topic is very worried. Are they crazy or just better informed than you about the signs that institutions are failing and power is being dangerously ceded to one man with authoritarian tendencies?

A lot depends on if the executive still follows the courts. The legislative branch has shown no signs of being a check. They’ve been verbally threatening not to follow court orders for a few days. Threatening judges. Project 2025 says ignore the court rulings and proceed with your policies.

Are we crazy for taking them at their word? Where do other people find the confidence to believe they wouldn’t actually do it?


Really something that reducing the size of the federal workforce and ending ridiculous spending by USAID = the end of democracy.



If this is so obvious, why won’t he just propose these cuts to congress so they can pass a law cutting them? Why does he insist on doing it illegally?


Because congress is absolutely worthless and they can’t legislate. I am absolutely furious that because of them we are in this situation. The goal of Trump has been stated, to remove $2 Trillion from our spending. To have our debt 3% of GDP. Paying down our debt will have a massive positive impact. Will it be easy? No, but we must get our fiscal house in order.


So it’s ok to break the law and violate court orders because he can’t get congress to agree with him. Sounds like a dictatorship.


If the goal is to remove 2T from our spending and pay down the debt, why do a tax cut that ADDS 5-10T to the debt? Anyway, the US debt is 130% of GDP, annual deficit is ~6%. The tax cuts will add to it, twice as much as cutting spending. But hey, Republican math! Their counter to the inevitable inflation this will stoke is to induce a recession but cutting jobs and reducing spending power (and demand).
Anonymous
Post 02/12/2025 09:20     Subject: How long till the economy collapses?
Cut back like Clinton did. He involved Congress. He did it slowly and methodically. Through voluntary separations, early retirement, real buyouts. He used the system. He kept civil servant protections in place. But he was able to reduce the number of jobs by over 350,000 over 8 years.

Conduct systematic reviews using subject matter experts. If indirect costs to research universities is oversized, scale back over three years. Not just full stop. Don't blow stuff up to rebuild later.

You know, the rule of law.
Anonymous
Post 02/12/2025 09:20     Subject: How long till the economy collapses?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:We've stopped vaccinating people in other countries like airplanes and boats don't exist.

We've stopped funding cancer research.

We are deporting our agricultural workers.

We are ignoring environmental catastrophe and getting rid of NOAA and FEMA.

We are alienating our allies.

All of these things have consequences. Life has been hard for all of humanity until the last 100 years and we have chosen to go back in time.


So tell me where you would cut $2 Trillion from? How do you suggest we get to a good budget situation? I don’t think you realize that we can’t continue on this trajectory.


Every penny of those cuts and 3 trillion more will go out the door in tax cuts to the 1%. Common people will not see a penny of those savings, and they will increase the debt substantially. They are telling you this out loud. Watch for it when they announce the budget.
Anonymous
Post 02/12/2025 09:17     Subject: How long till the economy collapses?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:We've stopped vaccinating people in other countries like airplanes and boats don't exist.

We've stopped funding cancer research.

We are deporting our agricultural workers.

We are ignoring environmental catastrophe and getting rid of NOAA and FEMA.

We are alienating our allies.

All of these things have consequences. Life has been hard for all of humanity until the last 100 years and we have chosen to go back in time.


So tell me where you would cut $2 Trillion from? How do you suggest we get to a good budget situation? I don’t think you realize that we can’t continue on this trajectory.


A significant part of the deficit is from the tax cuts Trump and the Repubs imposed back in 2017. And it didn't deliver the benefits it promised. It just increased our debt.
Anonymous
Post 02/12/2025 09:04     Subject: How long till the economy collapses?
How will tax cuts for the wealthy lower our debt and get our economic house in order? Can someone please explain?
Anonymous
Post 02/12/2025 08:56     Subject: How long till the economy collapses?
Anonymous wrote:If the economy didn't collapse when my groceries went up from 275/week to over 400, gas up, utilities bezerk, 40-year high inflation, then think it would take another black swan event like march 2020.


This is my thought too. If a global pandemic was but a blip in the economy (and made so many people crazy revenge spenders - that I will never understand) then I think we can survive this.
Anonymous
Post 02/12/2025 08:53     Subject: How long till the economy collapses?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Anyone who has lived through the collapse of a democracy or studied that topic is very worried. Are they crazy or just better informed than you about the signs that institutions are failing and power is being dangerously ceded to one man with authoritarian tendencies?

A lot depends on if the executive still follows the courts. The legislative branch has shown no signs of being a check. They’ve been verbally threatening not to follow court orders for a few days. Threatening judges. Project 2025 says ignore the court rulings and proceed with your policies.

Are we crazy for taking them at their word? Where do other people find the confidence to believe they wouldn’t actually do it?


Really something that reducing the size of the federal workforce and ending ridiculous spending by USAID = the end of democracy.



If this is so obvious, why won’t he just propose these cuts to congress so they can pass a law cutting them? Why does he insist on doing it illegally?


Because congress is absolutely worthless and they can’t legislate. I am absolutely furious that because of them we are in this situation. The goal of Trump has been stated, to remove $2 Trillion from our spending. To have our debt 3% of GDP. Paying down our debt will have a massive positive impact. Will it be easy? No, but we must get our fiscal house in order.


Which Presidents contributed most to the national debt?
Anonymous
Post 02/12/2025 08:53     Subject: How long till the economy collapses?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:We've stopped vaccinating people in other countries like airplanes and boats don't exist.

We've stopped funding cancer research.

We are deporting our agricultural workers.

We are ignoring environmental catastrophe and getting rid of NOAA and FEMA.

We are alienating our allies.

All of these things have consequences. Life has been hard for all of humanity until the last 100 years and we have chosen to go back in time.


So tell me where you would cut $2 Trillion from? How do you suggest we get to a good budget situation? I don’t think you realize that we can’t continue on this trajectory.


DP but some of what Trump is doing will cost us money, not save it. He's proposing massive tax cuts for the wealthy. You think alienating our allies will save money? Even the fork proposal is a huge expense, paying workers who aren't working through September even though most who took it would have left (without severance) through normal attrition anyway.

Everyone knows if you really want to shrink the budget, you don't do it with USAID or NOAA, which are relatively small programs. Are they going to go after the defense budget, the national intelligence budget, Social Security, Medicare, or Medicaid? Because those are where the $$$ is. Yet he has promised not to touch them.


He should not touch Social Security or Medicare for anyone Gen X and older. We have been paying for these for decades. Any changes there should be phased in by age group.

Buying and developing Trump Gaza is going to cost billions.
Anonymous
Post 02/12/2025 08:52     Subject: How long till the economy collapses?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:We've stopped vaccinating people in other countries like airplanes and boats don't exist.

We've stopped funding cancer research.

We are deporting our agricultural workers.

We are ignoring environmental catastrophe and getting rid of NOAA and FEMA.

We are alienating our allies.

All of these things have consequences. Life has been hard for all of humanity until the last 100 years and we have chosen to go back in time.


So tell me where you would cut $2 Trillion from? How do you suggest we get to a good budget situation? I don’t think you realize that we can’t continue on this trajectory.


TAX THE RICH, ya fool. You don’t need to cut 2 trillion when you can raise 5 trillion by taxing Musk, Bezos, and Zuck.
Anonymous
Post 02/12/2025 08:48     Subject: How long till the economy collapses?
Yes, your fearless leader who wants to cut unnecessary spending wants to turn Greenland into Red White and Greenland 🙄

Sounds like a really good use of government money over cancer research.
Anonymous
Post 02/12/2025 08:28     Subject: How long till the economy collapses?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:We've stopped vaccinating people in other countries like airplanes and boats don't exist.

We've stopped funding cancer research.

We are deporting our agricultural workers.

We are ignoring environmental catastrophe and getting rid of NOAA and FEMA.

We are alienating our allies.

All of these things have consequences. Life has been hard for all of humanity until the last 100 years and we have chosen to go back in time.


So tell me where you would cut $2 Trillion from? How do you suggest we get to a good budget situation? I don’t think you realize that we can’t continue on this trajectory.


DP but some of what Trump is doing will cost us money, not save it. He's proposing massive tax cuts for the wealthy. You think alienating our allies will save money? Even the fork proposal is a huge expense, paying workers who aren't working through September even though most who took it would have left (without severance) through normal attrition anyway.

Everyone knows if you really want to shrink the budget, you don't do it with USAID or NOAA, which are relatively small programs. Are they going to go after the defense budget, the national intelligence budget, Social Security, Medicare, or Medicaid? Because those are where the $$$ is. Yet he has promised not to touch them.
Anonymous
Post 02/12/2025 08:21     Subject: How long till the economy collapses?
Anonymous wrote:We've stopped vaccinating people in other countries like airplanes and boats don't exist.

We've stopped funding cancer research.

We are deporting our agricultural workers.

We are ignoring environmental catastrophe and getting rid of NOAA and FEMA.

We are alienating our allies.

All of these things have consequences. Life has been hard for all of humanity until the last 100 years and we have chosen to go back in time.


So tell me where you would cut $2 Trillion from? How do you suggest we get to a good budget situation? I don’t think you realize that we can’t continue on this trajectory.
Anonymous
Post 02/12/2025 08:14     Subject: How long till the economy collapses?
We've stopped vaccinating people in other countries like airplanes and boats don't exist.

We've stopped funding cancer research.

We are deporting our agricultural workers.

We are ignoring environmental catastrophe and getting rid of NOAA and FEMA.

We are alienating our allies.

All of these things have consequences. Life has been hard for all of humanity until the last 100 years and we have chosen to go back in time.