Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The how pay to play doesnt necessarily mean bad quality.

My son is at Princeton now and he spent 2.5 weeks at Sciences Po summer program. It was an amazing program and experience for him.
High Quality: check
Recognized by top schools: check
100% Merit Based? Not quite. Sure there is an application process, but I’m not sure it is very selective. The only 4 kids I know that went there were accepted.

dont you need to be 18 for that? how can you do it for two years in HS

No. It is a program for under 18 (pre-college kids).

Admissions Angle on substack has a bunch of suggestions:

https://admissionsangle.substack.com

Summer Science Program. It's pretty hard core and a disproportionate number go on to MIT and ivies and other top programs.

Anonymous wrote:so nobody here has pointed to a list of high-value, high-reputation, no-fee summer programs. Is there such a list?

Private college counselors can give it to you.

so nobody here has pointed to a list of high-value, high-reputation, no-fee summer programs. Is there such a list?

Anonymous wrote:UChicago, not cheap but some great ones

I can’t imagine these would be helpful for anywhere but UChicago (and their ED0). Their programs seem unreasonably expensive - 15k for “stones and bones” fossil course.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Most college counselors will tell you NOT to list the college program on your activities list or resume for other colleges (meaning, include ND Leaders for ND; YYGS for Yale; Wake for Wake; MIT for MIT etc).

The exceptions are for "fully funded" programs where the application process is selective AND there is no (zero) fee to attend. In this case, the activity description should include the following: "fully funded (academic/leadership/immersion) program" or "fully funded position" IF it provides evidence of the major.

DC listed their selective, fully funded MIT program on all of their apps. Hope it doesn't hurt their chances

This is fine and shouldn’t hurt at all. A fully funded program is quite different than 6k+ two week program at Yale.

Anonymous wrote:The how pay to play doesnt necessarily mean bad quality.

My son is at Princeton now and he spent 2.5 weeks at Sciences Po summer program. It was an amazing program and experience for him.
High Quality: check
Recognized by top schools: check
100% Merit Based? Not quite. Sure there is an application process, but I’m not sure it is very selective. The only 4 kids I know that went there were accepted.

Agreed. I don't think there are many competitive summer programs that impress AOs by themselves--e.g., "Wow, this applicant was admitted to and participated in X summer program." But participation in a summer program can help an applicant by demonstrating/corroborating interest in particular subject and developing skills. And, apart from admissions, they can be really helpful for the student-participants in figuring out what they are looking for in colleges.

My DC did a month-long studio art program at an university. While there was a selection process requiring a portfolio and essay, I don't think it was particularly competitive. But the program itself was great, and DC learned a lot and improved their portfolio. It also shaped what DC looked for in colleges during the application phase. While I doubt the summer program meaningfully moved the needle on DC's applications, DC got into a number of T20 schools, so it certainly didn't hurt. Anyhow, I'm not promoting summer programs over other options (e.g., working a summer job), but they have their place.

Anonymous wrote:Most college counselors will tell you NOT to list the college program on your activities list or resume for other colleges (meaning, include ND Leaders for ND; YYGS for Yale; Wake for Wake; MIT for MIT etc).

The exceptions are for "fully funded" programs where the application process is selective AND there is no (zero) fee to attend. In this case, the activity description should include the following: "fully funded (academic/leadership/immersion) program" or "fully funded position" IF it provides evidence of the major.

DC listed their selective, fully funded MIT program on all of their apps. Hope it doesn't hurt their chances

Anonymous wrote:My DD did a National Student Leadership summer program at Georgetown last summer. I won't say that it isn't pay to play, but it was a very valuable experience for her. She expressed interest in a particular major out of the blue junior year. I wanted her to dip her toes in the major before building her college list. It solidified her interest, which was what I wanted to see. It was a well-run program and she had a great time.

I have heard great things about Georgetown’s summer program. It is definitely pay to play but still a great experience for a high school student.

I don’t necessarily think this type of program will get you into college. I don’t think everything has to be for college.

UChicago, not cheap but some great ones

Most college counselors will tell you NOT to list the college program on your activities list or resume for other colleges (meaning, include ND Leaders for ND; YYGS for Yale; Wake for Wake; MIT for MIT etc).

The exceptions are for "fully funded" programs where the application process is selective AND there is no (zero) fee to attend. In this case, the activity description should include the following: "fully funded (academic/leadership/immersion) program" or "fully funded position" IF it provides evidence of the major.

sciences po is 6000 euro for two weeks, doesn't include expenses, you have to be 18.

I dont think that (or the Oxford etc ones) are very prestigious, and that your kid got into college for other reasons

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Notre Dame

typical pay-to-play again, isn't it?

You say this as if it’s bad, but if you can afford them, these programs can be great experience that broaden kids’ perspectives, introduce them to new ideas and directions, confirm interest on a particular career or major, or immerse them in a language or new setting. It’s true that attending one doesn’t get you into college, but neither does it keep you out. Most kids I know at very selective schools attended one.

I agree that these programs may not specifically help for admissions based on their name alone, but I think they can make a kid more focused and confident in wanting to pursue a specific field or specific type of program/university and that alone can improve an application. It's hard for kids to really understand what a university or advanced studies in a particular field is like without experiencing it, so it's great that there are programs that provide a window into what's coming next.

+1 both my kids did short pay-to-play programs and that's what they got out of it. It wasn't about admissions advantage but about learning a bit about college and what they thought they wanted to major in. Both did these the summer before junior year and I think it helped during the slog that is junior year to have a clearer picture of what they were working towards. Sure, getting into a competitive admit program would be great but there's value in these too.

^took a class on comparative EU government in college.