MIL expected op to break down and apologize; hence, MIL would be justified in her "victimhood." But op stood by her and did not allow this bully to make her feel small. Bravo, op.
The other who can't see this for what it is are just narcs, no doubt about it.

Anonymous wrote:I mean your 'honesty' was well you are horrible and I am a saint. You didn't take any accountability either. Honestly isn't really when you just blame everyone else but act like you are righteous. And given your disdain and disgust for them I am sure there are many things you have said and done that weren't perfect either.

Agree. It takes two to tango. It sounds like she was trying to connect, even if in a painfully awkward way. You come across as smug. And no, I’m not a MIL.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP I thought it was great. I have spent my whole life being a people pleaser and thinking I am taking the high road every time I am polite to someone who is obnoxious. Now in middle age with so many stressors at once, I am polite at first, but if you F around, you will find out.

Her question was neither polite nor respectful in the words she chose. She was trying to put you on the defense. You answered the question. It doesn't matter that OP isn't perfect. She doesn't ask abrasive questions. If MIL said "I want you to feel more comfortable around me. Is there something I do that offends you?" Regardless, MIL asked a question and OP gave her honest answer.

Well done OP. She needs to learn if she is going to chose an abrasive way of communicating you will not cower and kiss as$.

OP here. Thank you. This resonates with me so much. I am people pleaser, but as you say, life gets harder with my oldest in middle school, recent deaths in my family, recent death of a friend, and busy time at work. I have the capacity to manage myself and help my husband and kids, and my village when I can.

We go out of our way to attend this trip, and it’s a long drive and I make a lot of food and DH does tons of clean-up. It’s a busy time for both our works and school and frankly it’s much easier for all the retirees.

I'm glad this resonated. These types of people can dish it, but they cannot take it. You stuck to facts-she badmouths people. You don't call her names, and you answered the question. Her ego is too fragile to handle too much truth, so this may shut her down for a while or it may take another rude question and direct response to shut it down for a while. Then she will find herself a new source of drama.

Anonymous wrote:YIKES - You are awful. You seem so proud of hurting another person. I can think of 10,000 different ways this could have been handled. This is so very hateful. I'm sad you are like you.

Omg. You are so funny.

Anonymous wrote:If your MIL can't keep close friendships with anyone, the problem originates with her, not anyone else.

I admire the way you responded. You said everything there was to say, and you said it well.

Her response demonstrates how much difficulty she has with social skills. Perhaps she is on the autism spectrum, like my husband and son. This is not an excuse for bad behavior, of course! But it could explain certain things. Autism in females presents differently than in males, and is harder to diagnose.

I agree with you except the unacceptable need to play doctor here. Stop with the "ooo she must be autistic bs".

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why do you confuse this with a place where it is appropriate to “vent?” Nobody here care about your toxic relationship with your in-laws.

Are you new here? If no one posted about their toxic in-laws it would be tumbleweeds at DCUM.

Right so people make up stories about how saintly they are yet get nothing for Christmas from the evil MIL. But it’s all fake. There isn’t much real drama so it gets invented.

The evil MIL and saintly DIL gets played a lot here but the threads get traction as so many like to talk down about their MILs.

There's a reason for it. Many parents with adult children do not understand that they do not get to control their lives and decisions. That is the crux of many of these problems. Control over others. No one will make me have holidays the way they want. No one will force me to take my family on vacations just because they insist. I won't tolerate jealous reactions to events I attend with my family or others. I don't tolerate manipulation or inappropriate behavior that gets to a certain level.

Anonymous wrote:Neither of you have self awareness so you are likely to be at each other for much of the time.

Both think the other is the problem and that they themselves are doing nothing wrong.

Impossible to resolve a conflict when neither side has self awareness or takes responsibility. It will just go in circles of finger pointing.

Just let your husband go with the kids and you can stay home. Both of you will enjoy the time more without being around each other.

What a load of crap. My mil is a lot like this and my problem was being a people pleaser and putting up with it. I know if dh and I had shut it down earlier she would have moved on to one of the other dils like she eventually did.

It's disgusting when people keep trying to force women to be doormats and accept abuse from others.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You did a bad job at gray rocking her and now you have to start from scratch. Sorry.

This. Pushy, gossipy jerks looove drama. She will rewrite whatever was said in her head. She’s love bombing you now. When your guard goes down her claws will come back out.

Gossips do love drama. The far side of that spectrum is stiff and full of niceties and decorum. I fall into the stiff part and I'm not saying it's better, just more comfortable to me. People on either end really stand out and unnerve each other. Op sounds like she might be on another wave length from her MIL and that alone creates character clashes.

Except OP was content to live and let live until MIL effed around and found out that OP is not a pushover. Good for you, OP. She sounds like a bitter woman and you can’t fix her.

Eh, I think OP did fine. MIL asked a question, OP answered. What other alternatives did the OP have? MIL starts on her tirade and OP says, “ You are right Marion, I am cold and distant for no reason.” I lay bets that MIL will come up with some of her own complaints very soon and will be either texting you or your DH with her grievances.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You did a bad job at gray rocking her and now you have to start from scratch. Sorry.

This. Pushy, gossipy jerks looove drama. She will rewrite whatever was said in her head. She’s love bombing you now. When your guard goes down her claws will come back out.

Gossips do love drama. The far side of that spectrum is stiff and full of niceties and decorum. I fall into the stiff part and I'm not saying it's better, just more comfortable to me. People on either end really stand out and unnerve each other. Op sounds like she might be on another wave length from her MIL and that alone creates character clashes.

I don’t know your life and I don’t know the dynamics except for how you presented them here.

You were honest, you responded to her criticism and confrontation with examples and I think there’s nothing wrong with that. I think had she given you examples on how cold and distant you were etc. I hope you would have had a chance to reflect and apologize for that too. But someone goes around gossiping and talking badly behind your back gets to be kept at an arms length. I do the same!

Have you talked to your husband about this?

YIKES - You are awful. You seem so proud of hurting another person. I can think of 10,000 different ways this could have been handled. This is so very hateful. I'm sad you are like you.

What does the whole "late because kid in school" PARAGRAPH have to do with this?

Good, op. She clearly has narc traits and was playing the victim. I am proud of you. You gave it as it is.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP I thought it was great. I have spent my whole life being a people pleaser and thinking I am taking the high road every time I am polite to someone who is obnoxious. Now in middle age with so many stressors at once, I am polite at first, but if you F around, you will find out.

Her question was neither polite nor respectful in the words she chose. She was trying to put you on the defense. You answered the question. It doesn't matter that OP isn't perfect. She doesn't ask abrasive questions. If MIL said "I want you to feel more comfortable around me. Is there something I do that offends you?" Regardless, MIL asked a question and OP gave her honest answer.

Well done OP. She needs to learn if she is going to chose an abrasive way of communicating you will not cower and kiss as$.

OP here. Thank you. This resonates with me so much. I am people pleaser, but as you say, life gets harder with my oldest in middle school, recent deaths in my family, recent death of a friend, and busy time at work. I have the capacity to manage myself and help my husband and kids, and my village when I can.

We go out of our way to attend this trip, and it’s a long drive and I make a lot of food and DH does tons of clean-up. It’s a busy time for both our works and school and frankly it’s much easier for all the retirees.

I feel the same. The fact that you're even participating in this given her poor treatment of you is something she should appreciate. You might want to make less food and order more. For me, when I go out of my way to work hard to help people who treat me poorly it makes me resentful. You sound like you might be similar, so try and reduce your resentfulness by reducing how much you do.

NP and I think your response was great too. I’m also a recovering people pleaser and played into my mil’s need for things to be a specific way (but in my case without actually asking for it but directing, and also overlooking or acknowledging peoples efforts ever for doing things the ways she wants).

Anyway, I’ve had versions of this conversation with my mil over the years as I came into being more direct. Ive taken a slightly softer approach with more I statements and acknowledging my set backs. She has never participated in the conversation likewise. Instead placing blame on me for hurting her feelings. It is really hard. I just think that generation wasn’t modeled or taught how to have tough conversations without placing blame. Whereas personal accountability is the first place I was taught to look when having an issue with someone.

I do something resembling safe, friendly sharing with a little directness (when she is gossipy and says outright mean things like mocking extended family I will say “that was a mean thing to say”), with grey rock when she says thing I don’t agree with but it’s not my place to unpack things with her as she is not asking my opinion.