i was like your kids and my parents didn't understand at the time, but now that I'm in my 40s they do. I like to enjoy my life, and I do my work but I don't work much harder than i have to unless it is something I'm really enthused about. I think that they really appreciate that about me now that I'm a middle aged happily married woman with a stable job I love and a happy family. They wanted me to push for an Ivy league school and instead I went to a very good (but not great) school that gave me a very good scholarship. They wanted me to marry the most accomplished, high status person I could possibly catch, and instead I married someone who was medium status but we adore each other. IMO, these choices work out really well over the long haul even if at 18 or 24 it seems like you aren't living up to your potential.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was just talking to my sister about this this weekend. She was recalling a conversation she had with my dad in high school where she explained to him that she could put in low/medium effort and do pretty well (A-/B+) or put in extraordinary effort and really excel (A/A+) - but that the first choice seemed to make a lot more sense. To this, my father replied “honey, you’ve figured out the secret to life. I’m so proud.” Thirty years later “slacker” sister is doing just as well as our sibling who put in the extra effort, and arguably, is much happier.

Not going to lie, I’m still pretty inclined to push my kids but there really is a point of diminishing returns. If they’re on track to be healthy, contributing adults I wouldn’t sweat it too much.

The thing is, our children live in a different world. Your sister didn't have to compete with the pool of extremely driven, talented immigrants like our children do. You could pretty much coast to an upper middle class life. You can't count on this anymore. Maybe it will happen, maybe not - but the odds are definitively different from what they were 30 years ago.

Um there is plenty of homegrown talent. Competition is stiffer partly bc thanks to the internet, people have heard of all the really good schools that wouldn’t have geographically been on their radar several decades ago. Can’t believe you’re yelling “IMMIGRANTS!” on a post about kids

I am an immigrant myself, I am not yelling "immigrants". The fact is that there is much more competition globally and that Harvard has more than a quarter of their college filled with international students. I was one of a handful of such students many years ago, now my own kids are facing at least 10 times as many.

And even if increasing competition were merely due to homegrown talent, the points remains that it's a different world today. You can't just phone it in to an upper middle class lifestyle.

Well look around most middle class and upper middle class people went to state schools and even 2nd tier state schools.

Your an immigrant, you haven't figured this out yet?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was just talking to my sister about this this weekend. She was recalling a conversation she had with my dad in high school where she explained to him that she could put in low/medium effort and do pretty well (A-/B+) or put in extraordinary effort and really excel (A/A+) - but that the first choice seemed to make a lot more sense. To this, my father replied “honey, you’ve figured out the secret to life. I’m so proud.” Thirty years later “slacker” sister is doing just as well as our sibling who put in the extra effort, and arguably, is much happier.

Not going to lie, I’m still pretty inclined to push my kids but there really is a point of diminishing returns. If they’re on track to be healthy, contributing adults I wouldn’t sweat it too much.

The thing is, our children live in a different world. Your sister didn't have to compete with the pool of extremely driven, talented immigrants like our children do. You could pretty much coast to an upper middle class life. You can't count on this anymore. Maybe it will happen, maybe not - but the odds are definitively different from what they were 30 years ago.

Um there is plenty of homegrown talent. Competition is stiffer partly bc thanks to the internet, people have heard of all the really good schools that wouldn’t have geographically been on their radar several decades ago. Can’t believe you’re yelling “IMMIGRANTS!” on a post about kids

I am an immigrant myself, I am not yelling "immigrants". The fact is that there is much more competition globally and that Harvard has more than a quarter of their college filled with international students. I was one of a handful of such students many years ago, now my own kids are facing at least 10 times as many.

And even if increasing competition were merely due to homegrown talent, the points remains that it's a different world today. You can't just phone it in to an upper middle class lifestyle.

+1 It's pretty tough out there. It does help quite a bit if you are attractive and have good social skills. (And wealthy parents willing to help you out in your 20s.)

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of a child who is an extremely hard worker and a kid who is not, I do not think any amount of pushing will work. The kid has to want to do it.

I have seen kids in college fail without mommy. I would rather my kid fail now than as a college student.

why? how is it better to fail in HS?

Pp here. DH and I are type A high achievers. Our oldest child is just like us but better. Our middle child is naturally gifted and puts little effort like OP’s kids. He isn’t literally failing but he will get a B because he didn’t study or has missing assignments. I want him to figure this out by himself while he is in middle school.

I would not be ok with this. It’s one thing to get a B with a reasonably high amount of effort (but I wouldn’t except my child to work themselves to the bone for an A). But to get a B because of zero studying and not turning in assignments is flat unacceptable. That is a poor work ethic and I wouldn’t condone it

The mentally unhealthy responses to this thread are terrifying.

Apathy is a big problem with many teens. Not just yours. They don’t care and would rather watch YouTube shorts all day

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of a child who is an extremely hard worker and a kid who is not, I do not think any amount of pushing will work. The kid has to want to do it.

I have seen kids in college fail without mommy. I would rather my kid fail now than as a college student.

why? how is it better to fail in HS?

Pp here. DH and I are type A high achievers. Our oldest child is just like us but better. Our middle child is naturally gifted and puts little effort like OP’s kids. He isn’t literally failing but he will get a B because he didn’t study or has missing assignments. I want him to figure this out by himself while he is in middle school.

And what if he doesn't? What if he just keeps underperforming?

I lose sleep because the kid stresses me out. Getting him to get to middle school on time is even a struggle. I accept the kid he is. I’m not going to be able to push or nag him into Harvard. I have accepted that he may go to Penn State or BU or Rutgers or some good weather school he gets into. He is very social and popular so I hope he will do ok.

You are a mess.. he might "have to go to Penn state or BU or Rutgers" ... OMG.

I would be mortified as well. I would hate to have my my kids end up at PennState or Rutgers. BU is ok.

You people are the reason our country is in shambles.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of a child who is an extremely hard worker and a kid who is not, I do not think any amount of pushing will work. The kid has to want to do it.

I have seen kids in college fail without mommy. I would rather my kid fail now than as a college student.

why? how is it better to fail in HS?

Pp here. DH and I are type A high achievers. Our oldest child is just like us but better. Our middle child is naturally gifted and puts little effort like OP’s kids. He isn’t literally failing but he will get a B because he didn’t study or has missing assignments. I want him to figure this out by himself while he is in middle school.

And what if he doesn't? What if he just keeps underperforming?

I lose sleep because the kid stresses me out. Getting him to get to middle school on time is even a struggle. I accept the kid he is. I’m not going to be able to push or nag him into Harvard. I have accepted that he may go to Penn State or BU or Rutgers or some good weather school he gets into. He is very social and popular so I hope he will do ok.

You are a mess.. he might "have to go to Penn state or BU or Rutgers" ... OMG.

I am not a mess. My very smart and talented kid puts in little to no effort. My older child takes all AP classes with straight As with zero effort from the parents. It is hard to watch one kid try so hard and one kid do nothing.

Yes, you are a mess and this child was sent to you to grow as a human don't squander the lesson here.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of a child who is an extremely hard worker and a kid who is not, I do not think any amount of pushing will work. The kid has to want to do it.

I have seen kids in college fail without mommy. I would rather my kid fail now than as a college student.

why? how is it better to fail in HS?

Pp here. DH and I are type A high achievers. Our oldest child is just like us but better. Our middle child is naturally gifted and puts little effort like OP’s kids. He isn’t literally failing but he will get a B because he didn’t study or has missing assignments. I want him to figure this out by himself while he is in middle school.

I would not be ok with this. It’s one thing to get a B with a reasonably high amount of effort (but I wouldn’t except my child to work themselves to the bone for an A). But to get a B because of zero studying and not turning in assignments is flat unacceptable. That is a poor work ethic and I wouldn’t condone it

Anonymous wrote:My kids are smart and athletic kids. Everything comes to them easily BUT they do not put forth maximum effort, ever. As a result, my dd is a decent runner only, despite having the potential to be a fantastic runner. She shows up to practice, does her thing, but doesn't push herself. She gives it 70%. It's the same thing with school: getting them to take any APs is like pulling teeth, and they so far refused the hard ones, despite doing very well in the APs they do take. They know it is going to affect college, we have pushed, explained and got nowhere. They just don't want to work hard. Do you think this is just personality or that I should push them harder even?

Relax. Take it easy on yourself and kiddos. Give your advice and then let them decide. No need to take and give stress. It seems they don't want to sign up for competition induced mental health conditions.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of a child who is an extremely hard worker and a kid who is not, I do not think any amount of pushing will work. The kid has to want to do it.

I have seen kids in college fail without mommy. I would rather my kid fail now than as a college student.

why? how is it better to fail in HS?

Pp here. DH and I are type A high achievers. Our oldest child is just like us but better. Our middle child is naturally gifted and puts little effort like OP’s kids. He isn’t literally failing but he will get a B because he didn’t study or has missing assignments. I want him to figure this out by himself while he is in middle school.

And what if he doesn't? What if he just keeps underperforming?

I lose sleep because the kid stresses me out. Getting him to get to middle school on time is even a struggle. I accept the kid he is. I’m not going to be able to push or nag him into Harvard. I have accepted that he may go to Penn State or BU or Rutgers or some good weather school he gets into. He is very social and popular so I hope he will do ok.

Is he attractive?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of a child who is an extremely hard worker and a kid who is not, I do not think any amount of pushing will work. The kid has to want to do it.

I have seen kids in college fail without mommy. I would rather my kid fail now than as a college student.

why? how is it better to fail in HS?

Pp here. DH and I are type A high achievers. Our oldest child is just like us but better. Our middle child is naturally gifted and puts little effort like OP’s kids. He isn’t literally failing but he will get a B because he didn’t study or has missing assignments. I want him to figure this out by himself while he is in middle school.

And what if he doesn't? What if he just keeps underperforming?

I lose sleep because the kid stresses me out. Getting him to get to middle school on time is even a struggle. I accept the kid he is. I’m not going to be able to push or nag him into Harvard. I have accepted that he may go to Penn State or BU or Rutgers or some good weather school he gets into. He is very social and popular so I hope he will do ok.

You are a mess.. he might "have to go to Penn state or BU or Rutgers" ... OMG.

I would be mortified as well. I would hate to have my my kids end up at PennState or Rutgers. BU is ok.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of a child who is an extremely hard worker and a kid who is not, I do not think any amount of pushing will work. The kid has to want to do it.

I have seen kids in college fail without mommy. I would rather my kid fail now than as a college student.

why? how is it better to fail in HS?

Pp here. DH and I are type A high achievers. Our oldest child is just like us but better. Our middle child is naturally gifted and puts little effort like OP’s kids. He isn’t literally failing but he will get a B because he didn’t study or has missing assignments. I want him to figure this out by himself while he is in middle school.

And what if he doesn't? What if he just keeps underperforming?

I lose sleep because the kid stresses me out. Getting him to get to middle school on time is even a struggle. I accept the kid he is. I’m not going to be able to push or nag him into Harvard. I have accepted that he may go to Penn State or BU or Rutgers or some good weather school he gets into. He is very social and popular so I hope he will do ok.

You are a mess.. he might "have to go to Penn state or BU or Rutgers" ... OMG.

I would be mortified as well. I would hate to have my my kids end up at PennState or Rutgers. BU is ok.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of a child who is an extremely hard worker and a kid who is not, I do not think any amount of pushing will work. The kid has to want to do it.

I have seen kids in college fail without mommy. I would rather my kid fail now than as a college student.

why? how is it better to fail in HS?

Pp here. DH and I are type A high achievers. Our oldest child is just like us but better. Our middle child is naturally gifted and puts little effort like OP’s kids. He isn’t literally failing but he will get a B because he didn’t study or has missing assignments. I want him to figure this out by himself while he is in middle school.

And what if he doesn't? What if he just keeps underperforming?

I lose sleep because the kid stresses me out. Getting him to get to middle school on time is even a struggle. I accept the kid he is. I’m not going to be able to push or nag him into Harvard. I have accepted that he may go to Penn State or BU or Rutgers or some good weather school he gets into. He is very social and popular so I hope he will do ok.

You are a mess.. he might "have to go to Penn state or BU or Rutgers" ... OMG.

I am not a mess. My very smart and talented kid puts in little to no effort. My older child takes all AP classes with straight As with zero effort from the parents. It is hard to watch one kid try so hard and one kid do nothing.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of a child who is an extremely hard worker and a kid who is not, I do not think any amount of pushing will work. The kid has to want to do it.

I have seen kids in college fail without mommy. I would rather my kid fail now than as a college student.

why? how is it better to fail in HS?

Pp here. DH and I are type A high achievers. Our oldest child is just like us but better. Our middle child is naturally gifted and puts little effort like OP’s kids. He isn’t literally failing but he will get a B because he didn’t study or has missing assignments. I want him to figure this out by himself while he is in middle school.

And what if he doesn't? What if he just keeps underperforming?

I lose sleep because the kid stresses me out. Getting him to get to middle school on time is even a struggle. I accept the kid he is. I’m not going to be able to push or nag him into Harvard. I have accepted that he may go to Penn State or BU or Rutgers or some good weather school he gets into. He is very social and popular so I hope he will do ok.

You are a mess.. he might "have to go to Penn state or BU or Rutgers" ... OMG.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of a child who is an extremely hard worker and a kid who is not, I do not think any amount of pushing will work. The kid has to want to do it.

I have seen kids in college fail without mommy. I would rather my kid fail now than as a college student.

why? how is it better to fail in HS?

Pp here. DH and I are type A high achievers. Our oldest child is just like us but better. Our middle child is naturally gifted and puts little effort like OP’s kids. He isn’t literally failing but he will get a B because he didn’t study or has missing assignments. I want him to figure this out by himself while he is in middle school.

And what if he doesn't? What if he just keeps underperforming?

I lose sleep because the kid stresses me out. Getting him to get to middle school on time is even a struggle. I accept the kid he is. I’m not going to be able to push or nag him into Harvard. I have accepted that he may go to Penn State or BU or Rutgers or some good weather school he gets into. He is very social and popular so I hope he will do ok.