Anonymous
Post 08/26/2024 12:14     Subject: Your undergraduate degree isn't part of your legal education
Anonymous wrote:It's often said it takes "it takes 7 years of schooling be a lawyer" because people often count the required 4 year degree to enter law school. But substantially, law is basically an undergraduate degree, the first degree in the subject (there are higher degrees that follow the JD, the LLM and the Doctor of Juridical Science).

The only reason JDs require that much university is because the US law profession gatekeeps (for no reason), not because you're getting 7 years of legal training or a more rigorous education than in other countries where law is a first undergraduate degree.

JDs are ultimately introductory courses, grounding prospective lawyers in the subject prior to taking whichever Bar course they need to qualify in their chosen jurisdiction(s).

The proof of this is the New York Bar Exam. Since there are global firms with offices in both NYC and London, there are several people who seek qualifications in both jurisdictions.

English LLBs can write the New York Bar Exam and are not required to get another qualification. They view the English LLB as "substantially and durationally equivalent" to the American JD, because both the American JD and the English LLB have three years of academic training and both the US and England are common law jurisdictions. The 4 years of college isn't part of the legal education.


Yes, but the profession is still gatekept in the UK. Many many students graduate with an undergrad LLB, but only some will go on to qualify as a lawyer (solicitor or barrister).

LLB grads must get a "training contract" with a firm, serve as a trainee for two years, and then they qualify as a full solicitor. But it is very competitive to get a contract. Many do not, and many try for years after completing an LLB or PGDL (one year conversion course to law). If you don't get a training contract, bust.
Anonymous
Post 08/26/2024 10:02     Subject: Your undergraduate degree isn't part of your legal education
Anonymous wrote:It's often said it takes "it takes 7 years of schooling be a lawyer" because people often count the required 4 year degree to enter law school. But substantially, law is basically an undergraduate degree, the first degree in the subject (there are higher degrees that follow the JD, the LLM and the Doctor of Juridical Science).

The only reason JDs require that much university is because the US law profession gatekeeps (for no reason), not because you're getting 7 years of legal training or a more rigorous education than in other countries where law is a first undergraduate degree.

JDs are ultimately introductory courses, grounding prospective lawyers in the subject prior to taking whichever Bar course they need to qualify in their chosen jurisdiction(s).

The proof of this is the New York Bar Exam. Since there are global firms with offices in both NYC and London, there are several people who seek qualifications in both jurisdictions.

English LLBs can write the New York Bar Exam and are not required to get another qualification. They view the English LLB as "substantially and durationally equivalent" to the American JD, because both the American JD and the English LLB have three years of academic training and both the US and England are common law jurisdictions. The 4 years of college isn't part of the legal education.


British lawyers serve an apprenticeship period after they graduate. The apprenticeship period is usually 2-3 years.
None of the big firms hire a British lawyer straight out of undergrad just because they passed the bar.
They generally require you to get qualified in the jurisdiction in which you studied.
Anonymous
Post 08/25/2024 11:02     Subject: Your undergraduate degree isn't part of your legal education
I have a colleague who failed the bar on her first try. She's an excellent attorney, she just got psyched out the first time (I sat the same session, we had a weird tax/trust account question (unlike anything in prior bar exams we'd studied) that you just got lucky and studied an obscure area or didn't, I'd just happened to flip through that section the night before). I passed the bar on my first try but there's a ton of stuff I learned for the bar and then never used again.
Anonymous
Post 08/25/2024 10:58     Subject: Your undergraduate degree isn't part of your legal education
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I believe California doesn’t require undergrad or a law school degree to sit for the bar. Ask Kim Kardashian how that is working for her.


She passed the California state bar exam on her 3rd attempt. Most view the California state bar exam as the hardest in the nation.


Because they allow u accredited law schools and correspondence school grads to sit for the CA bar exam which lowers the passage rate.
Anonymous
Post 08/25/2024 10:56     Subject: Your undergraduate degree isn't part of your legal education
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I believe California doesn’t require undergrad or a law school degree to sit for the bar. Ask Kim Kardashian how that is working for her.


She passed the California state bar exam on her 3rd attempt. Most view the California state bar exam as the hardest in the nation.


The baby bar. Not the bar exam. If she couldn’t pass the baby bar, the bar exam is going to be a huge lift.


And it was her 4th time.

I don’t care if she took it 10 times. There is no way I’m voting for the orange clown who took it a grand total of zero times.


Why would you be voting for Kim Kardashian?
Anonymous
Post 08/25/2024 10:56     Subject: Your undergraduate degree isn't part of your legal education
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I believe California doesn’t require undergrad or a law school degree to sit for the bar. Ask Kim Kardashian how that is working for her.


She passed the California state bar exam on her 3rd attempt. Most view the California state bar exam as the hardest in the nation.



False.she passed only the Baby Bar after three tries. She has NOT even attenpted the real cal bar.

So what? It didnt stop her from becoming attorney general of CA.


Kim Kardashiah has never been the attorney general of CA
Anonymous
Post 08/25/2024 10:55     Subject: Your undergraduate degree isn't part of your legal education
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Seriously, law school is mostly about networking and internships, its not necessary like medical school.


Clearly this is a person who never sat for the bar. It is so tiresome how many people play lawyer on DCUM, spreading nonsense.


I'm neither a lawyer or claiming to be one but law school isn't as necessary to practice law as med school to practice medicine and some states seems to agree.


Residency is super important to the practice of medicine. Law school and med school are about equal in their usefulness to their respective practices.
Anonymous
Post 08/25/2024 10:46     Subject: Your undergraduate degree isn't part of your legal education
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Kamala failed the CA bar on her first attempt and she went to law school.


So? Lots of people fail the CA bar. Many of them "went to law school."


It’s concerning in someone running for President.


Why? The President is not an attorney.

She's the VP under Biden, why arent you concerned right now?

She probably didnt study. Very intelligent, busy prople often think they can pass with a cursory review. Passing the bar doesnt mean you are smart. Not even a little bit. But you have to study. If you fail, you didnt study, dont speak English or had some kind of mental/drug/etc issue. She was elected top lawyer in San Franciso and then California. Now that's hard


Yes, I’m concerned. There is a reason she isn’t doing interviews. She can’t put words together coherently unless she is reading them off a teleprompter.


Well, that’s extremely rich considering who she is running against. I guess you aren’t voting this year.
Anonymous
Post 08/25/2024 10:35     Subject: Your undergraduate degree isn't part of your legal education
PSA - the 3/4 time taker being referenced in this thread is Kim Kardashian.

Kamala Harris passed on her second attempt. There are many very smart attorneys that did not pass the first time for a variety of reasons.

Harris’s prosecutorial skills are quite impressive and on full display. I look forward to seeing more.
Anonymous
Post 08/25/2024 10:09     Subject: Your undergraduate degree isn't part of your legal education
Anonymous wrote:Kamala failed the CA bar on her first attempt and she went to law school.


Hilary Clinton failed the Wash DC bar.
Anonymous
Post 08/25/2024 08:25     Subject: Your undergraduate degree isn't part of your legal education
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Kamala failed the CA bar on her first attempt and she went to law school.


So? Lots of people fail the CA bar. Many of them "went to law school."


It’s concerning in someone running for President.


Why? The President is not an attorney.

She's the VP under Biden, why arent you concerned right now?

She probably didnt study. Very intelligent, busy prople often think they can pass with a cursory review. Passing the bar doesnt mean you are smart. Not even a little bit. But you have to study. If you fail, you didnt study, dont speak English or had some kind of mental/drug/etc issue. She was elected top lawyer in San Franciso and then California. Now that's hard


Yes, I’m concerned. There is a reason she isn’t doing interviews. She can’t put words together coherently unless she is reading them off a teleprompter.
Anonymous
Post 08/25/2024 01:52     Subject: Your undergraduate degree isn't part of your legal education
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Kamala failed the CA bar on her first attempt and she went to law school.


So? Lots of people fail the CA bar. Many of them "went to law school."


It’s concerning in someone running for President.


Why? The President is not an attorney.

She's the VP under Biden, why arent you concerned right now?

She probably didnt study. Very intelligent, busy prople often think they can pass with a cursory review. Passing the bar doesnt mean you are smart. Not even a little bit. But you have to study. If you fail, you didnt study, dont speak English or had some kind of mental/drug/etc issue. She was elected top lawyer in San Franciso and then California. Now that's hard
Anonymous
Post 08/25/2024 01:39     Subject: Your undergraduate degree isn't part of your legal education
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Ma’am, this is a Wendy’s


TITCR


Ha!!! havent seen that in awhile, the good ole days.
Anonymous
Post 08/25/2024 01:38     Subject: Your undergraduate degree isn't part of your legal education
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I believe California doesn’t require undergrad or a law school degree to sit for the bar. Ask Kim Kardashian how that is working for her.


She passed the California state bar exam on her 3rd attempt. Most view the California state bar exam as the hardest in the nation.


(I wrote the above post.)

However, California & Vermont have low bar pass rates because law school is not a requirement in order to sit for either state's bar exam. Virginia & Washington states also do not require a law school degree in order to sit for the state bar examination.


thats not why. its harder
Anonymous
Post 08/25/2024 01:30     Subject: Your undergraduate degree isn't part of your legal education
Anonymous wrote:Ma’am, this is a Wendy’s


TITCR