Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Take her to a psychologist.

Did you not read the post? She doesn't cooperate.

I think OP should just send her to her dad's. Everyone seems to want to diagnose drug addiction or punishments to solve this but taking away her phone isn't anything near as severe as "weekend boot camp" that she's already done. She doesn't want to be with her mom and she shouldn't have to be.

Sending her to live with a hoarder may not be seen as proper "care" by OP. Since dad is a mentally ill hoarder, it's likely well beyond not "want[ing]" to be with mom.

Still, mom needs to provide a room free of bugs and rotting food for the child. She needs to contain it. She has the parental duty of care. DD does not. OP frames it as though the child is in charge, that has moved things beyond just the room, it is very dysfunctional. Talking at CPS about how the mentally ill child runs the house is not a useful tact. OP, you need to manage the state of the room, despite DD. Get most things out and keep on top of it.

You need coaching yourself. Maybe you have transferred passivity re: ex's situation to DD? Regardless, YOU are in charge of the condition of the home.

What might the substance of "other" reports been about?

OP, you need to take her to a psychiatrist. Not a therapist not a psychologist. She may need medication.

i would remove all but necessary things from the room and require it be kept up if child is to have any privileges.

hard to trash your room if you don't have anything to trash it with.

no food outside of the kitchen.

return things as child earns the right.

and take her to therapy she will participate in.

Last week I had a social worker ask to look around. She saw my daughters room and told me it was a hazard to her health and it needs to be cleaned. Basically they'll continue checking in to make sure it's suitable. I tried explaining my daughters behaviour but all she said was it is my "duty of care".

Sending her to live with a hoarder may not close the case against you and could, in fact, heighten the investigation of YOUR parenting. Is it more suitable? Sounds similar.

Is ex-DH in the same jurisdiction?

Stop trying to "explain" things to them, OP. Anything you say can be used against you. Re: DD or other kids.

The point that you are missing is that YOU have a duty of care to not have a room filled with bugs and rotting food for your kid to sleep in. Under your roof or where you send her. See why dad's may not fix the problem? Take everything out but the bed and a nightstand and give her an outfit a day. Do not allow food in the bedrooms. Lock the door when you are not there if you need to unless she starts to trash the rest of the home. Stay on top of it daily.

YOU have a duty, not DD. You offering to clean it with her, etc., is not sufficient. She does not have the duty, you do.

You could potentially lose the other kids. You need to manage the situation and home, you are putting a kid in the power position to blow up your family or cost you your job. Can you see that? To outsiders it looks extremely dysfunctional, that is why they are coming back. You are oddly passive. Trying to get CPS to "agree" that your KID is in charge and bad is not going to help re: the other kids' welfare, can you see that?

Take her to a psychiatrist and bring photos of the room, find one that works with hoarders if you can.

Is there a family member who is not a hoarder who could take her?

I’ve heard of other situations where CPS will actually give the family some supports to deal with this kind of issue—like maybe approve a cleaner coming in for one big clean, or providing counseling to mom and child re hygiene etc. it may be worth asking your caseworker if there are any supports they can provide especially with respect to teaching teen about hygiene.

I’m sympathetic because I have a teen that is a borderline hoarder and she flips out when I go into her room. I go in once a week or so when she’s out and grab all the trash I can see, any dishes, and do a load f laundry for her if she hasn’t done it. I’m hoping she’ll be able to rein it in a little in college when she has more limited stuff in the room and peer pressure about a baseline level of cleanliness.

If you can afford it, a session with a room organizer type person might be helpful too — just making sure she has easy places to put things and an enormous trash can might be helpful. I might even put a milk crate outside her room that she can dump plates it, if you really can’t get her to stop eating in her room. (I’ve been fighting that battle with my teens forever.).

I'm assuming there may have been other reports.

About the same child? What might the substance of those have been? Has CPS raised anything besides the room?

This is about way more than hoarding if OP is sending her to boot camps.

I'd consult a lawyer, OP. You are currently being investigated for not providing an appropriate living environment. If you send her to the house of a hoarder that could still come back at YOU.

Anonymous wrote:Take her to a psychologist.

Did you not read the post? She doesn't cooperate.

I think OP should just send her to her dad's. Everyone seems to want to diagnose drug addiction or punishments to solve this but taking away her phone isn't anything near as severe as "weekend boot camp" that she's already done. She doesn't want to be with her mom and she shouldn't have to be.

Take her to a psychologist.

OP, can you expand on the bolded parts of your post, pls.? Also, is DD on any meds? Has she seen a psychiatrist? I'd show photos of the room and get a therapist who focuses on hoarding behavior.

I go in monthly and scrub it down. I struggle to do it more than that.

Unfortunately she also isn't embarrassed and invited a friend over who in turn told her parents who then reported it to CPS. I'm assuming there may have been other reports.

Do you have ADD or other issues that make her disorganization more of a "struggle" to contain?

What did they say was the focus of "other reports?"

OP, I'd ask Jeff to move this to the SN forum. You are likely to get more helpful responses and this is more likely to be mental illness type issue.

I'd record on your phone when the worker is there.

OP, what is her conduct like in school?

Has she ever had a psych eval? This seems to go well beyond talk therapy, which is not helping on its own anyway from your description.

Does ex or anyone in his family have diagnoses?

Bugs and trash and immediately recreating the extreme conditions is beyond "messy" or not putting away clothes.

Anonymous wrote:My idea: she's locked out of her room for 90% of the day. She has lost privileges to having a room. She can only sleep in there and nothing else.

This plus getting rid of most of what is in the room is next best to her going to her dad's. OP, I'd consult a lawyer.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It may be a helpful reframe for you to accept that it’s not that she is not fix this - she can’t. She is not capable. It’s sad and awful and likely true.

She may not be able to fix it, but she can prevent her mother from changing the status quo. That is within her power. It doesn't make her a bad kid -- there are a lot of reasons this might pan out that way -- but she can block her mother from changing what is happening, and that can really limit the possible outcomes.

OP could lose her job and custody of 3 other kids. OP you have to triage.

I'm unclear -- are you quoting me because you think you are disagreeing with me?

No, I agree with you.

It is most likely that DD will continue to derail attempts to change the status quo for the foreseeable future. Past is prologue, especially when there is likely mental illness or addiction in play. Now that the family is "in the system" OP needs to take that power back and protect the other kids. DD has a father, she wants to go live with the father, seems best at least in the short term if he agrees.

Anonymous wrote:Why would you only go in once a month if there was rotting food? If you are at work and she is taking food in her room when you aren't there why aren't you picking up her room every night?

I would buy disposable plates, cups, and utensils for her to use and every night go in with a trash bag and throw away any food, drinks, trash. Dirty clothes go into a hamper in the laundry room.

Buy two of these storage systems from IKEA
https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/trofast-storage-combination-with-boxes-white-white-s69228473/
Label each one with a sharpie. One drawer is underwear, one bras, one socks, one T-shirts, one pants, one shorts/jeans or whatever she wears most.

Next system is for shoes on the bottom tubs, any school papers and books go in the top three.

If she has more junk then buy another storage system that gets labeled.

The key is not to have anything on the floor besides bed, nightstand, storage system, and trashcan.

Remove any other furniture including any chest or drawers that is probably a mess of stuff.

You need to do the sweep literally every night for weeks and weeks throwing away trash putting everything into the assigned tubs until she understands how a clean and organized person lives. Don't get into an argument and try and make her do it every night. She isn't going to but after you doing it for weeks it really will start to sink in.

If she can't go to her dad's or a relatives, this is the best advice, OP. And I'd not buy packaged food that she can take in the room. Make a food only in kitchen or at dining table rule and don't have things that are tempting to sneak elsewhere. Anything that does not fit in the tubs, put in storage in basement or attic in tubs. Get an exterminator if you need to.