Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not worth it.

--Ivy double grad

Single ivy grad here, from back in the dark ages before tuition started increasing at twice the rate of inflation. I genuinely don’t see how the education is worth the list price anymore, unless you’re swimming in money and can drop $80k a year without noticing it. If you get a pile of aid (not loans!), then great, but otherwise no, not worth it. I’d have done just as well at one of our state schools (SUNY) and maybe even better.

The fact is majority who "get into an Ivy/T25" will do "just as well at one of their state schools". Because it's the person and their drive that matters, not the school. What you do at college matters much more than where you go.

There's a kind of person who will be top of their less-lalented class but not stretch to reach their potential, who would do better at a more demanding school.

And there are people who can't handle the stress of having more-talented peers, who would do better where they are at the top or have a more equal (lower variance) peer group.

Obviously there are exceptions, but the vast majority who get admission to T25 schools are "strivers" and will excel and push themselves wherever they are. Have you seen the kids who get into these schools? So yes, there might be a few who won't stretch to reach their potential at a "lesser school" but that's maybe 1%. And for that I'd argue, it's on the kid. Your life is what you make of it. If you cannot excel in the honors program at State U, then that is on your kid. Fact is majority of top notch kids (those who get into T25) will continue excelling no matter where they go. It's their personality and inherent drive that will get them there.

I'd actually argue that there are more who cannot handle the stress of a T25 where it can be extremely competitive. Just think, your Bio 101 class is filled with everyone who is used to getting a 4.687GPA, all As, while taking 5+ AP/IB courses thru out HS. Yet someone is going to end up with Cs and Bs for the first time in their life. You are at college with the cream of the crop---eveyrone is in the Top 5% of their HS class and leaders. Yet not everyone can be a leader at college. So yes, it's actually a better environment for many to be at a "lesser" college in the honors program where you can be top dog---you can do research with the top professors, and get more experiences rather than being middle fo the pack where everyone is top notch.

People should stop replyying until OP names the school.

Waste of time here.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not for a pre-professional program. Save the money for MCAT/LSAT training and tell your kid to stand out on campus at the state U.

What if the state U is, say, one with an 80% admission rate. So ranked not highly at all? The in between option(s) was not one that DC liked (you know, like a 30-50% admit).

Why are you worried about the admission rate? You should be focused on the outcomes.

Who cares if a university has a high admission rate? What a peculiar thing to fuss about.

Agreed. My kid attended a great school (ranked in Top 100), got 35% of tuition merit award (they were at ~50percentile for stats), got an amazing education and great job after graduation. It was the perfect school for my kid---they found their group of friends who are okay with As and Bs (not strivers by any stretch, do well academically but as long as they are getting Bs they are satisfied). Acceptance rate is 85-87%. They chose between this and another similarly ranked school (both Jesuit) with similar acceptance rates.
But if you had a kid with higher stats (75%+) they would find their group as well, with many strivers/kids in the honors program/kids premed/prePA/prePT/etc.
Those kids whose goal is medical school/dental school/PT school are strivers and working their asses off to maintain a high GPA. Plenty of really smart kids there---many with excellent merit to make it almost as affordable as their state school, but with the perks of smaller classes, an amazing premed program, opportunities to work with cadavers in undergrad lab.

But pretty amazing university with a really high acceptance rate.

For med school admissions, probably he'll be better off in a premed undergrad where he is in top 10% of his cohort, not somewhere he is in bottom 10%.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not worth it.

Did this happen or is the question theoretical? Ideally, you'd not allow student to apply to unaffordable schools. When my child chose to do that, I made sure they knew it was a long shot due to low acceptance rates and then--even if they got in--the tuition was too high.

They did choose to spend their time applying, but at least they knew the chance of being able to attend was very low.

This has happened. We can use the 529 and prob contribute more but it would be a big stretch. Wasn't sure of acceptance but of course it happened.

Should've done the math before applying.

It may not matter for med school admissions but may matter if he can't get into med school.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not worth it.

--Ivy double grad

Single ivy grad here, from back in the dark ages before tuition started increasing at twice the rate of inflation. I genuinely don’t see how the education is worth the list price anymore, unless you’re swimming in money and can drop $80k a year without noticing it. If you get a pile of aid (not loans!), then great, but otherwise no, not worth it. I’d have done just as well at one of our state schools (SUNY) and maybe even better.

The fact is majority who "get into an Ivy/T25" will do "just as well at one of their state schools". Because it's the person and their drive that matters, not the school. What you do at college matters much more than where you go.

There's a kind of person who will be top of their less-lalented class but not stretch to reach their potential, who would do better at a more demanding school.

And there are people who can't handle the stress of having more-talented peers, who would do better where they are at the top or have a more equal (lower variance) peer group.

Anonymous wrote:Our 2 kids are at SLACs that are 82-84k/yr and we wouldn’t change a thing. Saved and sacrificed and funded 529s so they could have the same incredible education we had. IYKYK. If you don’t, you will surely think it’s not worth it.

But the difference is you SAVED and had it in 529s. Then yes, you let your kids use the money for wherever they want to go.
But if you can only afford $30K/year, you don't go into debt of $200K to send your kid to college. If you want the top schools, you need to save for them. Otherwise, no it is not worth the debt

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not for a pre-professional program. Save the money for MCAT/LSAT training and tell your kid to stand out on campus at the state U.

What if the state U is, say, one with an 80% admission rate. So ranked not highly at all? The in between option(s) was not one that DC liked (you know, like a 30-50% admit).

Why are you worried about the admission rate? You should be focused on the outcomes.

Who cares if a university has a high admission rate? What a peculiar thing to fuss about.

Are you new here or something? This is "fussed about" all the time on the college board. Constantly.

Anonymous wrote:I think it matters what your financial situation is. We are in our 50s with over $6M in invested assets in addition to the college fund for our oldest with $400k set aside. We want her to go somewhere she feels good about and cost isn't really the primary consideration. If cost is a consideration, then it's a conversation with your kid and partner as to how to make the decision. I don't think it's as easy as saying it's worth it or not based on the college ranking. Ultimately, we know from the studies that college is what you make of it. But if your kid is happy there, isn't that worth something?

You can afford it. You are set for retirement and have SMARTLY saved and can easily afford an $85K/year college. However, the OP cannot. If it requires more than the $27K total over 4 years of undergrad of federal loans, then it is NOT a smart thing to attend. Especially when their kid wants to attend med or law school (or something like that).

So no kid's happiness is worth going into massive debt. Their kid will be happy at other schools as well, if they decide to be.

However, if you have the money (like you do), then it is totally good to let your kid pick the best fit/what makes them happy. My own kid chose between 2 schools ranked 30-45. Very similar schools, both in locations that make them "not somewhere many want to be for 4 years"(put both schools in Boston or Chicago and they'd have single digit acceptance rates not 30%) so they are a Target for many kids with resumes for T20 schools. One gave my kid $168K over 4 years (basically 50% of the total cost freshman year of $85K, it would be less as prices go up). The other school isn't known for merit and my kid got none. We let them pick and while they liked the school with merit, it wasn't their top choice, the other school was a much better "fit"---I could see that and knew that. We told our kid to pick without worrying about money. And we are now paying $85K/year and my kid loves it. Best decision ever.
However, if we didn't have a 529 with $350K+ and a net worth higher than yours (so we can easily cash flow any extras without much impact) we would have pushed them towards the school with merit and they would have come to love that school too---I mean they did choose to apply there (and it was my kid who added it in to apply, initially they didn't want to but researched more and realized it was a good fit for them).

The most expensive college tuition is $66k/yr
This includes the overcharge for rich people subsidizing financial aid, thank you! (Full-pay families should get a tax deduction for this charitable contribution; it's not fair otherwise.)

A private high school costs $30K-$60K/yr for small classes, nice labs, etc. Getting the same at college is right priced. Public high school spends around $15K for non-SpecialEd, larger classes, cutting corners on facilities. True unsubsidized cost of community college is similar.

If you aren't getting financial aid or merit discount, and aren't happy to pay a classmate's tuition, you're probably looking at the wrong school.


The rest of the $84K is paying for your child to not live and eat at home. If you downsized your now emptier house or took in a boarder, and your child learns to cook with roommates, the net cost is much lower.

ROI is tricky. A good education improves your live, including and beyond career. Money has to be spent somewhere, and education is a social environment with direct improvement of the mind, as opposed to many other purchases that only indirectly improve our social and individual happiness.

That kind of debt isn't worth it in the slightest

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not worth it.

--Ivy double grad

Single ivy grad here, from back in the dark ages before tuition started increasing at twice the rate of inflation. I genuinely don’t see how the education is worth the list price anymore, unless you’re swimming in money and can drop $80k a year without noticing it. If you get a pile of aid (not loans!), then great, but otherwise no, not worth it. I’d have done just as well at one of our state schools (SUNY) and maybe even better.

The fact is majority who "get into an Ivy/T25" will do "just as well at one of their state schools". Because it's the person and their drive that matters, not the school. What you do at college matters much more than where you go.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not for a pre-professional program. Save the money for MCAT/LSAT training and tell your kid to stand out on campus at the state U.

What if the state U is, say, one with an 80% admission rate. So ranked not highly at all? The in between option(s) was not one that DC liked (you know, like a 30-50% admit).

Acceptance rate is just a measure of popularity. 30-50% admit rate doesn’t mean it’s a better school than one with 80% acceptance.

That's not really the comparison though, is it?

It's the 30-50% vs. the selective school as compared to 80% vs. the selective school.

Dp. I don’t understand what you're saying. Pp is correct. The acceptance rate reflects the quantity of applicants, not the quality. That’s a poor measure to use when comparing schools.

Actually, it's partly true. But most State U with a 80% acceptance rate do have a group of really smart kids (especially if it's the best State U in that state). However you will also have a significant portion of the kids who are simply on a different level. For example: this kid got into a T20ish school. So lets say 3.9+UW gpa, 1500+ SAT are likely on the resume. However most state U with an 80% acceptance rate will have a very different demographic.
Take Univ of Iowa (82% acceptance rate). For those who did NOT submit SAT?ACT 31% have a 4.0, 27% have 3.75 and 3.99. So 57% have a 3.75+ GPA.
Back in 2019 their SAT range (25-75) was 1140-1330. So yes, this kid will need to find the honors program and search for similar kids, but they will exist. Just only 20% of the school will have 1400+. However, there are 20K+ undergrads, not 5K. There will still be very driven students---it's a state school many will be there because they are smart, it's debt free for them and it's all they can afford.

You go to a private school because great public school seats are limited. More small classes with attentive teachers.

Colleges are overpriced because they have a mandatory full service hotel and country club membership attached. This include public, but you don't see it because of the subsidies. Community college is the exception, but it's hard to get a good group of people in your major in your age group unless you are in a big city.