Anonymous
02/08/2024 15:48
Subject: Re:The helicopter parents won - a look back
Anonymous
02/08/2024 15:47
Subject: The helicopter parents won - a look back
Anonymous wrote:It’s a marathon op. I know Harvard grads who became associate professors. I know Yale students who dropped out 20 years ago and never went back. I know state schools students who founded tech companies. I know Ivy League grads who never married or had kids.
Sure, but going to Harvard or Yale is a huge leg up. Let's not kid ourselves.
Anonymous
02/08/2024 15:32
Subject: The helicopter parents won - a look back
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:The thing is, OP, a lot of this is child-driven. If a child is going to thrive in high-level sports or math or music or whatever, they have to want it. And the parents have to want it too-- but really talented kids will strongly advocate for being allowed to do the activities. It's not happening because the parents are helicoptering and make the kids do it. It's happening because the kid has the talent and the willingness to work hard, and the parents are willing to do their part. A kid like this will be really, really sad and upset if they don't get to do their thing. Absolutely crushed and disappointed, and will complain constantly and stick out in low-level substitute activities like a sore thumb, and it will not be a good feeling for anyone involved. If your kids weren't advocating for themselves, you have your answer.
The parents do have to do research and have a little foresight to tee up opportunities that their kid isn't aware of. Choosing a school, understanding math sequences, options for supplementing, whatever it may be. But I think "helicopter parent" means you're constantly hovering and micromanaging and controlling the kid. That's really not what this is.
This is not true. There are so many kids who are performing at a top level out of fear of failure and their need for the love and approval of their parents. Parents who made them feel that their love and approval was contingent on their child’s academic performance and/or their ability to excel at whatever extracurricular activity that the parents chose to prioritize.
I just don't think that usually works well enough for truly top-level performance. If the kid doesn't have it (particularly in sports if they need a certain body type), pushing will only get you so far. It works sometimes but other times the kid just doesn't succeed and the parent eventually realizes it's not gonna happen and switches to some other activity.
But the point is, OP, if your kids were going to be high-level at something, they'd probably be pressuring you to enroll them in it. And since they weren't showing that motivation, they probably wouldn't have made it to a high level anyway.
Anonymous
02/08/2024 15:15
Subject: The helicopter parents won - a look back
Anonymous wrote:OP, you are defining college admission as the "end game." Check back when your kid and their peers are 30 - or 40. It really is a marathon and the end is nowhere near age 18.
This!! You are judging in the middle. Life is long. Your kids' lives are their own.
Anonymous
02/08/2024 15:14
Subject: The helicopter parents won - a look back
Anonymous wrote:The thing is, OP, a lot of this is child-driven. If a child is going to thrive in high-level sports or math or music or whatever, they have to want it. And the parents have to want it too-- but really talented kids will strongly advocate for being allowed to do the activities. It's not happening because the parents are helicoptering and make the kids do it. It's happening because the kid has the talent and the willingness to work hard, and the parents are willing to do their part. A kid like this will be really, really sad and upset if they don't get to do their thing. Absolutely crushed and disappointed, and will complain constantly and stick out in low-level substitute activities like a sore thumb, and it will not be a good feeling for anyone involved. If your kids weren't advocating for themselves, you have your answer.
The parents do have to do research and have a little foresight to tee up opportunities that their kid isn't aware of. Choosing a school, understanding math sequences, options for supplementing, whatever it may be. But I think "helicopter parent" means you're constantly hovering and micromanaging and controlling the kid. That's really not what this is.
This is not true. There are so many kids who are performing at a top level out of fear of failure and their need for the love and approval of their parents. Parents who made them feel that their love and approval was contingent on their child’s academic performance and/or their ability to excel at whatever extracurricular activity that the parents chose to prioritize.
Anonymous
02/08/2024 15:12
Subject: The helicopter parents won - a look back
Anonymous wrote:Indians have it down to a science
Lol no....we struggle as much as rest of the parents, I have regrets that mine are not very athletic, I wish they were. Now true to the stereotype, yes, my kids have had math tutors since 4th grade and they excel in math but there are other challenges that they experience. However, I do believe that a good amount of parental involvement can take a kid from average to above average, we don't believe that a child will only achieve what he/she can based on their abilities, we believe that by providing lots of external support we can easily take them up a level or two and that's why we continue to push.
For example, my daughter was an average student in math until 3rd grade, she started feeling that that's all she can achieve in math. Since grade 4, she has had a private tutor and tons of practice + hard work, in middle school now she is in algebra. Was she one of those kids who are math wizards? Not at all. By guiding, tutoring and putting in the time she is where she is currently. Will this make a difference in her life or college admissions? I don't know, we can only work hard and put in the effort everyday and let the chips fall where they may.
Although, the best thing I have learnt from american parenting culture is to aim for a balance, so I push them so that they develop good work habits, so that they can learn to work hard but not only in the pursuit of grades.
Anonymous
02/08/2024 15:08
Subject: The helicopter parents won - a look back
Parents who pushed kids into premed, almost all of them eventually got into MD/DO schools. If you want that route, use cheapest college options so if they need to take gap years to redo MCAT, post baccalaureate or masters or research or clinical gigs to strengthen their resume, you can support them.
Anonymous
02/08/2024 15:03
Subject: The helicopter parents won - a look back
Anonymous wrote:The thing is, OP, a lot of this is child-driven. If a child is going to thrive in high-level sports or math or music or whatever, they have to want it. And the parents have to want it too-- but really talented kids will strongly advocate for being allowed to do the activities. It's not happening because the parents are helicoptering and make the kids do it. It's happening because the kid has the talent and the willingness to work hard, and the parents are willing to do their part. A kid like this will be really, really sad and upset if they don't get to do their thing. Absolutely crushed and disappointed, and will complain constantly and stick out in low-level substitute activities like a sore thumb, and it will not be a good feeling for anyone involved. If your kids weren't advocating for themselves, you have your answer.
The parents do have to do research and have a little foresight to tee up opportunities that their kid isn't aware of. Choosing a school, understanding math sequences, options for supplementing, whatever it may be. But I think "helicopter parent" means you're constantly hovering and micromanaging and controlling the kid. That's really not what this is.
PP here. This is a very important point. I'm the poster who gloated about getting it right with our now-college junior (sometimes pushing, more often not) and if I'm being honest, a lot of his success is internally driven. I did, however, have the wisdom to anticipate what he needed to soar and worked like hell to make those opportunities happen.
I realize the outcomes can be different for other parents who largely let their kids lead. Often the kids lead themselves right into a life of nonstop video games, snapchat and tapping out of math with B in pre-calc.
Anonymous
02/08/2024 15:03
Subject: The helicopter parents won - a look back
Anonymous wrote:I’m sending my youngest to college next year. He got into a good school early addmission and all of my kids did well. But as I look back on this parenting experience it occurs to me that the kids with the fanaticaly involved parents did the best - academically and athletically.
When the kids were in early elementary school, I remember shaking my head as my fellow parents talked about advanced math tutoring for their kindergartener or plotting to get their second grader on the most competitive travel team. At the time it seemed so silly to chart out the life of a kid who still needed naps. However, looking at those kids now - those are the kids who are going on to play sports at top colleges.
My takeaway is that even if you are a committed free range parent - your kid is in a competitive environment competing for scarce opportunities to go to top schools and play for competitive school teams.
I’m not unhappy about how my kids turned out or their experience in high School. But I don’t think I realized the the decision not to push advanced math in grade school meant a diminished opportunity to go to Tech or UMD. I definitely didn’t realize that only doing town baseball (and not travel) meant that they wouldn’t make the highschool team.
It not like my kids were slouches. They played on at least one rec team every season. Swim team in the summer and got good grades and scores on standardized tests.
But I can’t shake the feeling that I’ve pushed harder our results would’ve been much better.
We were very involved but not helicopter level involved or pushy and ours did as well as their kids or better.
Anonymous
02/08/2024 14:59
Subject: The helicopter parents won - a look back
Well, as a double HYPS grad, I disagree with OP, as would many of my classmates who were pushed and pushed and pushed all the way through law school or med school and just want to jump off the treadmill now but feel caught in golden handcuffs.
You're still early in the "race" of outcomes.
You're still early in the "race" of outcomes.
Anonymous
02/08/2024 14:58
Subject: The helicopter parents won - a look back
If helicopter parenting worked for producing extraordinary kids, we would have a huge swath of them performing at the highest levels, higher than ever before. I don't think the evidence bears that out. There is a bell curve, most kids fall within the curve and then there are the outliers.
I myself have three kids with varying degrees of success and the input for all three was basically the same. This is just another tool to make parents feel not good enough. I believe that most kids are like trees, you can prune and shape them to some extent, you need to water and fertilize, but they are going to grow into the type of tree they are.
I know that is kinda corny but it helps me to understand and accept the uniqueness of each of my kids.
I myself have three kids with varying degrees of success and the input for all three was basically the same. This is just another tool to make parents feel not good enough. I believe that most kids are like trees, you can prune and shape them to some extent, you need to water and fertilize, but they are going to grow into the type of tree they are.
I know that is kinda corny but it helps me to understand and accept the uniqueness of each of my kids.
Anonymous
02/08/2024 14:52
Subject: The helicopter parents won - a look back
Anonymous wrote:Why are ppl so obsessed with activities now days?
Well we can't leave kids alone, they'll run amok. So we sign them up for activities when they're little, and then make them stick with it because of sunk costs.
And then since every kid is doing an activity as if they mean to make it their career, then it becomes competitive. Etc.
Anonymous
02/08/2024 14:49
Subject: The helicopter parents won - a look back
Anonymous wrote:Were they happy? Did they have the opportunity to explore interests and passions? Did they learn how to try hard and fail? Did they learn how to support others?
Your definition of success is very narrow.
This.
Anonymous
02/08/2024 14:47
Subject: The helicopter parents won - a look back
Anonymous wrote:Why are ppl so obsessed with activities now days?
It's apparently relatively difficult now to even get into a 50-100 rank school.
Anonymous
02/08/2024 14:45
Subject: The helicopter parents won - a look back
Why are ppl so obsessed with activities now days?