I think it's depressing that someone can just outright dismiss the pursuit of knowledge, or intellectual curiosity in the same breath that they're using to talk about colleges being "prestigious." How does this happen? Is this a person who didn't go to college themselves? Who has no idea how things work?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m not a snob when it comes to CTCL schools, but I’m not going to glorify them or view them as somehow unique, different, and - most of all - better than any of the other hundreds of no-name second tier private schools that are out there. Forced to discount their tuitions to attract mediocre students who wouldn’t have a chance at top schools, low graduation rates, etc. How on earth are they “changing lives” any more than second tier state schools or, for that matter, community colleges? THOSE are the school changing lives - they’re educating the masses, immigrants, students of color, etc. CTCL schools are just refuge for wealthy underachieving students whose parents don’t want them mixing with kids at the schools they really ARE making a difference.

Well, for one thing, they roll out the red carpet for first-generarion students who know enough to apply. They offer supports, sometimes travel aid, some even pay for visits. And they're more willing to pay for those students than your state school. I think that metric is one reason they're on the list.

I wish more students did know to apply.

For another, you're a fool if you can look at that UMD mess of a thread with a straight face and tell me the parents complaining there aren't entitled.

Private schools bringing their tuition in line with public schools is more of a necessary cost correction to bring education costs a little closer in line with reality. The end of cheap credit made that a necessity. It's less a discount and more like a course correction.

Interesting that the post you’re responding to was deleted. Somebody has quite the trigger finger.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like CTCL always brings out the snobs.

I know kids who have gone to Ursinus and McDaniel. McD actively promotes their programs for kids with learning differences, and the kids I know who have gone there seemed very happy. I have a harder time characterizing Ursinus, but I do hear good things.

It's funny how few East Coast schools are on the list.

Maybe those who you label as snobs just have different standards and goals.

Several of the CTCL are on the brink of financial disaster.

Job placement and recruiting is not good at most of these small colleges.

Retention rates and 6 year graduation rates at many of the CTCL schools are not good.

Students can get a good education at most schools if motivated and disciplined, but the more important issue is job placement & internship opportunities.

I do not understand the focus on PhD placement for small college students as most humanities PhD struggle to find decent jobs.

CTCL is little more than a marketing organization for small relatively unknown schools most of which face significant financial hurdles.

What makes you think that all these students are pursuing humanities PhDs? Kalamazoo and Wooster are known for STEM grad placements.

A huge percentage of these schools major in humanities and go on to PhDs. Those circles must overlap. Even STEM PhDs aren't that much to brag about though? Like if you can get a good job with your bachelor's alone, isn't that the best case?

Do you... not understand how things are invented? How we got sheep cloned? Rna vaccines? Quantum computing?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like CTCL always brings out the snobs.

I know kids who have gone to Ursinus and McDaniel. McD actively promotes their programs for kids with learning differences, and the kids I know who have gone there seemed very happy. I have a harder time characterizing Ursinus, but I do hear good things.

It's funny how few East Coast schools are on the list.

Maybe those who you label as snobs just have different standards and goals.

Several of the CTCL are on the brink of financial disaster.

Job placement and recruiting is not good at most of these small colleges.

Retention rates and 6 year graduation rates at many of the CTCL schools are not good.

Students can get a good education at most schools if motivated and disciplined, but the more important issue is job placement & internship opportunities.

I do not understand the focus on PhD placement for small college students as most humanities PhD struggle to find decent jobs.

CTCL is little more than a marketing organization for small relatively unknown schools most of which face significant financial hurdles.

My DC, a Denison grad, is doing a STEM PhD as we speak. With an endowment stated to over $1 billion in 2023, the Denison endowment per student is over $400,000.

Why do you assume that students pursuing PhD are doing so in humanities fields?

Because that poster thinks big state schools are the best, only likes Computer Science and Engineering for majors, and doesn't understand the "research" part of research university.

Northeastern U., which gets so much love and devotion on this board, has a per-student endowment of $47,861 - a fraction of Denison's.

But sure Jan, tell us about how the CTCL schools are just a scam.

That's because Northeastern seems to be spending the endowment much more effectively and efficiently to produce results.
Retention rate, graduation rate, salary outcome, etc. all are way above Denison.
That's why also smarts kids come.

You don't know much about endowments, do you?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like CTCL always brings out the snobs.

I know kids who have gone to Ursinus and McDaniel. McD actively promotes their programs for kids with learning differences, and the kids I know who have gone there seemed very happy. I have a harder time characterizing Ursinus, but I do hear good things.

It's funny how few East Coast schools are on the list.

Maybe those who you label as snobs just have different standards and goals.

Several of the CTCL are on the brink of financial disaster.

Job placement and recruiting is not good at most of these small colleges.

Retention rates and 6 year graduation rates at many of the CTCL schools are not good.

Students can get a good education at most schools if motivated and disciplined, but the more important issue is job placement & internship opportunities.

I do not understand the focus on PhD placement for small college students as most humanities PhD struggle to find decent jobs.

CTCL is little more than a marketing organization for small relatively unknown schools most of which face significant financial hurdles.

What makes you think that all these students are pursuing humanities PhDs? Kalamazoo and Wooster are known for STEM grad placements.

A huge percentage of these schools major in humanities and go on to PhDs. Those circles must overlap. Even STEM PhDs aren't that much to brag about though? Like if you can get a good job with your bachelor's alone, isn't that the best case?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like CTCL always brings out the snobs.

I know kids who have gone to Ursinus and McDaniel. McD actively promotes their programs for kids with learning differences, and the kids I know who have gone there seemed very happy. I have a harder time characterizing Ursinus, but I do hear good things.

It's funny how few East Coast schools are on the list.

Maybe those who you label as snobs just have different standards and goals.

Several of the CTCL are on the brink of financial disaster.

Job placement and recruiting is not good at most of these small colleges.

Retention rates and 6 year graduation rates at many of the CTCL schools are not good.

Students can get a good education at most schools if motivated and disciplined, but the more important issue is job placement & internship opportunities.

I do not understand the focus on PhD placement for small college students as most humanities PhD struggle to find decent jobs.

CTCL is little more than a marketing organization for small relatively unknown schools most of which face significant financial hurdles.

My DC, a Denison grad, is doing a STEM PhD as we speak. With an endowment stated to over $1 billion in 2023, the Denison endowment per student is over $400,000.

Why do you assume that students pursuing PhD are doing so in humanities fields?

Because that poster thinks big state schools are the best, only likes Computer Science and Engineering for majors, and doesn't understand the "research" part of research university.

Northeastern U., which gets so much love and devotion on this board, has a per-student endowment of $47,861 - a fraction of Denison's.

But sure Jan, tell us about how the CTCL schools are just a scam.

That's because Northeastern seems to be spending the endowment much more effectively and efficiently to produce results.
Retention rate, graduation rate, salary outcome, etc. all are way above Denison.
That's why also smarts kids come.

Add
middle of nowhere vs Boston

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here's a list of the schools in question. Which ones do you like? Hate? Have never heard of?

https://ctcl.org/category/college-profiles/

I heard of Cornell... did they move location?

Emory, too

Anonymous wrote:Here's a list of the schools in question. Which ones do you like? Hate? Have never heard of?

https://ctcl.org/category/college-profiles/

I heard of Cornell... did they move location?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like CTCL always brings out the snobs.

I know kids who have gone to Ursinus and McDaniel. McD actively promotes their programs for kids with learning differences, and the kids I know who have gone there seemed very happy. I have a harder time characterizing Ursinus, but I do hear good things.

It's funny how few East Coast schools are on the list.

Maybe those who you label as snobs just have different standards and goals.

Several of the CTCL are on the brink of financial disaster.

Job placement and recruiting is not good at most of these small colleges.

Retention rates and 6 year graduation rates at many of the CTCL schools are not good.

Students can get a good education at most schools if motivated and disciplined, but the more important issue is job placement & internship opportunities.

I do not understand the focus on PhD placement for small college students as most humanities PhD struggle to find decent jobs.

CTCL is little more than a marketing organization for small relatively unknown schools most of which face significant financial hurdles.

My DC, a Denison grad, is doing a STEM PhD as we speak. With an endowment stated to over $1 billion in 2023, the Denison endowment per student is over $400,000.

Why do you assume that students pursuing PhD are doing so in humanities fields?

Because that poster thinks big state schools are the best, only likes Computer Science and Engineering for majors, and doesn't understand the "research" part of research university.

Northeastern U., which gets so much love and devotion on this board, has a per-student endowment of $47,861 - a fraction of Denison's.

But sure Jan, tell us about how the CTCL schools are just a scam.

That's because Northeastern seems to be spending the endowment much more effectively and efficiently to produce results.
Retention rate, graduation rate, salary outcome, etc. all are way above Denison.
That's why also smarts kids come.

Anonymous wrote:I’m not a snob when it comes to CTCL schools, but I’m not going to glorify them or view them as somehow unique, different, and - most of all - better than any of the other hundreds of no-name second tier private schools that are out there. Forced to discount their tuitions to attract mediocre students who wouldn’t have a chance at top schools, low graduation rates, etc. How on earth are they “changing lives” any more than second tier state schools or, for that matter, community colleges? THOSE are the school changing lives - they’re educating the masses, immigrants, students of color, etc. CTCL schools are just refuge for wealthy underachieving students whose parents don’t want them mixing with kids at the schools they really ARE making a difference.

Why so angry at CTCLs? Don't you have anything better to do than spend your time following a topic that apparently has no relevance to your life, as you've made it abundantly clear you would never send you kids to one? Go away, please.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like CTCL always brings out the snobs.

I know kids who have gone to Ursinus and McDaniel. McD actively promotes their programs for kids with learning differences, and the kids I know who have gone there seemed very happy. I have a harder time characterizing Ursinus, but I do hear good things.

It's funny how few East Coast schools are on the list.

Maybe those who you label as snobs just have different standards and goals.

Several of the CTCL are on the brink of financial disaster.

Job placement and recruiting is not good at most of these small colleges.

Retention rates and 6 year graduation rates at many of the CTCL schools are not good.

Students can get a good education at most schools if motivated and disciplined, but the more important issue is job placement & internship opportunities.

I do not understand the focus on PhD placement for small college students as most humanities PhD struggle to find decent jobs.

CTCL is little more than a marketing organization for small relatively unknown schools most of which face significant financial hurdles.

What makes you think that all these students are pursuing humanities PhDs? Kalamazoo and Wooster are known for STEM grad placements.

But also, if you're interested in a big school, or if your kid is, this list isn't for you. Some of us have smart kids, some with ND, or some who want something different than football games and a mascot. Some of our smart kids bombed half of their test scores, or got a C or two, or just don't know what they want to be when they grow up and want a safe place to learn things and figure that out. Some of us are more concerned with our kids social development than we are with their prospects to make 200k the second they graduate.

That doesn't mean we're rich, that just means we know life isn't a race. It doesn't have to be a contest. Also, as someone who made the equivalent of 200k in 90s money my first real job out of college? It was the worst thing that ever happened to me. It took me years to recalibrate.

So why invest your time in putting it down?

St. Olaf and Wooster were our “sleeper schools”. We only visited because we were looking at other college in the area (Macalaster and Carlton for St. Olaf and Kenyon and Oberlin for Wooster. Very impressed with both and they ended up being my kid’s safeties. And St. Olaf ended up being my kids second choice (even after acceptances at WM, Kenyon, Oberlin, Macalaster (did not apply to Carleton) and Grinnell. It it is great for interested in music/interested in STEM.

I know a couple kids at Wooster. They seem to happy and doing well.

Anonymous wrote:I’m not a snob when it comes to CTCL schools, but I’m not going to glorify them or view them as somehow unique, different, and - most of all - better than any of the other hundreds of no-name second tier private schools that are out there. Forced to discount their tuitions to attract mediocre students who wouldn’t have a chance at top schools, low graduation rates, etc. How on earth are they “changing lives” any more than second tier state schools or, for that matter, community colleges? THOSE are the school changing lives - they’re educating the masses, immigrants, students of color, etc. CTCL schools are just refuge for wealthy underachieving students whose parents don’t want them mixing with kids at the schools they really ARE making a difference.

Well, for one thing, they roll out the red carpet for first-generarion students who know enough to apply. They offer supports, sometimes travel aid, some even pay for visits. And they're more willing to pay for those students than your state school. I think that metric is one reason they're on the list.

I wish more students did know to apply.

For another, you're a fool if you can look at that UMD mess of a thread with a straight face and tell me the parents complaining there aren't entitled.

Private schools bringing their tuition in line with public schools is more of a necessary cost correction to bring education costs a little closer in line with reality. The end of cheap credit made that a necessity. It's less a discount and more like a course correction.

I went to The University of Oregon. Reed is full of freaks. Like, chock full of freaks.