Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pp. To be accurate, the teacher says you SHOULDN'T (not that you can't) sign up for BC unless you have an A in precalc. I know that AP Precalc in this school is not equivalent to a true AP Precalc curriculum. The real AP version does not cover as much.

The question I have is whether acing the true AP precalc curriculum is a good indicator of readiness/success in BC. If not, why does College Board think it is or why do they set it up to be the gateway course. The PP said it wasn't enough...so I would like more info on that.

Acing AP Precalc would just mean student is ready to take AB, not BC. AP Precalc exam doesnt even cover the entire AP Precalc course syllabus. Unit 4 is not assessed on the exam.

This is not true. Mastering AP Precalc units 1-3 provides enough foundation for students to go to BC. If student is not strong on those foundational Precalc topics they are likely to struggle with the pace of BC. But it is not additional topics they need, just better understanding and efficiency with those same units 1-3.

Not only just go to BC, but teach BC.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pp. To be accurate, the teacher says you SHOULDN'T (not that you can't) sign up for BC unless you have an A in precalc. I know that AP Precalc in this school is not equivalent to a true AP Precalc curriculum. The real AP version does not cover as much.

The question I have is whether acing the true AP precalc curriculum is a good indicator of readiness/success in BC. If not, why does College Board think it is or why do they set it up to be the gateway course. The PP said it wasn't enough...so I would like more info on that.

Acing AP Precalc would just mean student is ready to take AB, not BC. AP Precalc exam doesnt even cover the entire AP Precalc course syllabus. Unit 4 is not assessed on the exam.

This is not true. Mastering AP Precalc units 1-3 provides enough foundation for students to go to BC. If student is not strong on those foundational Precalc topics they are likely to struggle with the pace of BC. But it is not additional topics they need, just better understanding and efficiency with those same units 1-3.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Calc BC is "just" more topics that most people (anyone not a math major) will never need, at a faster pace. There is no magical totem of preparation. You may benefit from going slow and repetitive through AB first, and you might be fine going directly to BC.

Your class might have tougher problems and a harsher grader than the College Board test. It probably won't be lighter, since AP exams are calibrated to the lowest tier college class.

not true!
Physics C requires Calc BC, Machine Learning not only requires calc bc but also Multi Variable & Linear, and many more

Nope. You don't need BC to do multi variable and Linear Algebra for Machine Learning, nor Physics C.
Machines Learning (which is an extremely broad field, much of which doesn't need calculus at all, but includes some core theoretical areas where calculus helps), for only needs the core polynomial and exponential calculus in 1 or more variables, for the core theoretical areas.

Saying you need BC is like saying you need to know the geometry of circles and triangles for machine learning, just because geometry happens to be in the standard math sequence before calculus.

BC Calculus (and college calculus) has some extension topics that these pathways simply don't need.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Calc BC is "just" more topics that most people (anyone not a math major) will never need, at a faster pace. There is no magical totem of preparation. You may benefit from going slow and repetitive through AB first, and you might be fine going directly to BC.

Your class might have tougher problems and a harsher grader than the College Board test. It probably won't be lighter, since AP exams are calibrated to the lowest tier college class.

not true!
Physics C requires Calc BC, Machine Learning not only requires calc bc but also Multi Variable & Linear, and many more

Not true.

Physics C requires Calc AB or Calc BC.

requires Calc AB to pass, Calc BC to get an A

100% absolute nonsense. Calc BC has 0 relation to C Mechanics, and the tiniest stretch of a connection to C E&M.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pp. To be accurate, the teacher says you SHOULDN'T (not that you can't) sign up for BC unless you have an A in precalc. I know that AP Precalc in this school is not equivalent to a true AP Precalc curriculum. The real AP version does not cover as much.

The question I have is whether acing the true AP precalc curriculum is a good indicator of readiness/success in BC. If not, why does College Board think it is or why do they set it up to be the gateway course. The PP said it wasn't enough...so I would like more info on that.

Acing AP Precalc would just mean student is ready to take AB, not BC. AP Precalc exam doesnt even cover the entire AP Precalc course syllabus. Unit 4 is not assessed on the exam.

I understand that Unit 4 is not tested. But, those topics will be taught in this version of AP Precalc. And actually, many schools teach all four Units of CB's AP Precalc. So, the fact that it isn't on the exam doesn't really mean anything. If the student can master all three of CB's AP Precalc units that ARE taught, and the fourth unit is taught (although not tested) -- why isn't that sufficient to show that the student is ready for AP Calc BC? We're not talking about someone who gets 70% of the tested questions right. We're talking about someone who basically gets them all right (or 97%). If a student has shown that they ace the PSAT, and they are acing what College Board says is the pre-req class for AP Calc ___ -- then shouldn't THAT student be encouraged to take Calc BC? Seems like the kid who is getting a 3 or 4 on the AP Precalc exam (50-75% of the questions right) should be encouraged to take AP Calc AB.

Taking your statement as truth -- that acing AP Precalc only means that the student is ready for AB, and not BC --- then WHAT is the objective measure people across the country are using to determine readiness/success for BC? Some of those who ace AP Precalc ARE in the group that is ready for BC.

School systems across the country vary in their math offerings and tracking. My son’s school offers Math Analysis Honors with Calc A for 10th and 11th graders. An “A” or “B” grade would allow you to take Calc BC. Students who are one track lower would take the new AP Pre Calc and then take Calc AB the following year. There are other math track offerings below that.

It sounds like your son is a good candidate for BC; maybe you can appeal?

Anonymous wrote:If all four units are taught in AP Precalc (per CB's curriculum), why is that not enough to be prepared for AP Calc BC?

The former honors precalc/trig course went beyond the four units of AP Precalc; it also included limits and introductory calculus. Since BC has 50% more content than AB, you need to start introductory calculus in the latter half of precalc to position students to do well in BC. An earlier poster noted that their district follows this approach. AP Precalc (even with four units) does not do this. It just covers precalc content, no introductory calculus. The College Board says that AP Precalc is sufficient to prepare students for AB or BC. However, this claim flies in the face of the longstanding practice of starting introductory calculus in precalculus for BC-bound students. AP Precalc provides the barest minimum preparation for BC Calc; the former honors precalc/trig (which included introductory calculus) provided optimal preparation for BC.

Going from AP Precalc to BC will be tougher than it was going from the former honors precalc/trig. To compensate, you might want to find a summer offering that covers the part of honors precalc/trig that AP Precalc does not cover.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Calc BC is "just" more topics that most people (anyone not a math major) will never need, at a faster pace. There is no magical totem of preparation. You may benefit from going slow and repetitive through AB first, and you might be fine going directly to BC.

Your class might have tougher problems and a harsher grader than the College Board test. It probably won't be lighter, since AP exams are calibrated to the lowest tier college class.

not true!
Physics C requires Calc BC, Machine Learning not only requires calc bc but also Multi Variable & Linear, and many more

Not true.

Physics C requires Calc AB or Calc BC.

requires Calc AB to pass, Calc BC to get an A

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Calc BC is "just" more topics that most people (anyone not a math major) will never need, at a faster pace. There is no magical totem of preparation. You may benefit from going slow and repetitive through AB first, and you might be fine going directly to BC.

Your class might have tougher problems and a harsher grader than the College Board test. It probably won't be lighter, since AP exams are calibrated to the lowest tier college class.

not true!
Physics C requires Calc BC, Machine Learning not only requires calc bc but also Multi Variable & Linear, and many more

Not true.

Physics C requires Calc AB or Calc BC.

Anonymous wrote:Calc BC is "just" more topics that most people (anyone not a math major) will never need, at a faster pace. There is no magical totem of preparation. You may benefit from going slow and repetitive through AB first, and you might be fine going directly to BC.

Your class might have tougher problems and a harsher grader than the College Board test. It probably won't be lighter, since AP exams are calibrated to the lowest tier college class.

not true!
Physics C requires Calc BC, Machine Learning not only requires calc bc but also Multi Variable & Linear, and many more

Calc BC is "just" more topics that most people (anyone not a math major) will never need, at a faster pace. There is no magical totem of preparation. You may benefit from going slow and repetitive through AB first, and you might be fine going directly to BC.

Your class might have tougher problems and a harsher grader than the College Board test. It probably won't be lighter, since AP exams are calibrated to the lowest tier college class.

Anonymous wrote:If all four units are taught in AP Precalc (per CB's curriculum), why is that not enough to be prepared for AP Calc BC?

It is "enough" to get introduced to the topics. Just as in previous years of math, just introduction in a public school classroom is not sufficient. Introduction of concepts needs to be followed by solid practice (khan academy, textbook problems, workbooks, enrichment packets, etc) to develop proficiency. If you push your child to the reach for Calc BC, with just the introduction of precalculus concepts and skip necessary practice, your child may become frustrated, watching whom you are bound to feel miserable. Consider having them gain solid practice in Precalculus topics, then follow it up with a year AP Calc AB, and with that foundation, have them confidently approach AP Calc BC .

If all four units are taught in AP Precalc (per CB's curriculum), why is that not enough to be prepared for AP Calc BC?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pp. To be accurate, the teacher says you SHOULDN'T (not that you can't) sign up for BC unless you have an A in precalc. I know that AP Precalc in this school is not equivalent to a true AP Precalc curriculum. The real AP version does not cover as much.

The question I have is whether acing the true AP precalc curriculum is a good indicator of readiness/success in BC. If not, why does College Board think it is or why do they set it up to be the gateway course. The PP said it wasn't enough...so I would like more info on that.

Acing AP Precalc would just mean student is ready to take AB, not BC. AP Precalc exam doesnt even cover the entire AP Precalc course syllabus. Unit 4 is not assessed on the exam.

I understand that Unit 4 is not tested. But, those topics will be taught in this version of AP Precalc. And actually, many schools teach all four Units of CB's AP Precalc. So, the fact that it isn't on the exam doesn't really mean anything. If the student can master all three of CB's AP Precalc units that ARE taught, and the fourth unit is taught (although not tested) -- why isn't that sufficient to show that the student is ready for AP Calc BC? We're not talking about someone who gets 70% of the tested questions right. We're talking about someone who basically gets them all right (or 97%). If a student has shown that they ace the PSAT, and they are acing what College Board says is the pre-req class for AP Calc ___ -- then shouldn't THAT student be encouraged to take Calc BC? Seems like the kid who is getting a 3 or 4 on the AP Precalc exam (50-75% of the questions right) should be encouraged to take AP Calc AB.

Taking your statement as truth -- that acing AP Precalc only means that the student is ready for AB, and not BC --- then WHAT is the objective measure people across the country are using to determine readiness/success for BC? Some of those who ace AP Precalc ARE in the group that is ready for BC.

You are mixing up two issue here. First, you kid has a problem in the current class and is getting a C. The only person that matters here is the teacher that's giving that C. Find out why, and help your child overcome that deficiency. Your personal assessment, using PSAT, or your preferred third party evaluations don't matter. Teacher's say matters, as they possess the ultimate and exclusive power over your kid's grade. So listen to the teacher.

Second, AP Precalc is college board's watered down creation for addressing Equity in AP Math. Historically AP Calc AB being the first level AP math, has acted as a equity barrier that has kept large sections of student body from gaining any sort of a AP level math credential on their high school transcript. So a lower capstone (meaning this is the final math level for certain high school students) was created and that's called AP PreCalculus. As per College Board, " Furthermore, as AP Precalculus may be the last mathematics course of a student's secondary education, the course is structured to provide a coherent capstone experience and is not exclusively focused on preparation for future courses." ( https://apcentral.collegeboard.org/media/pdf/ap-precalculus-course-overview.pdf )
That said, there is temptation among HS teachers to treat AP precalc course like any other AP course and teach it with AP rigor and format, but it will take time to learn that it's meant for just giving away easy grades and put an AP credential on the transcript for those intimidated by math.

Given that background, your kid should be acing this lowered rigor AP Precalc if they are truly capable for taking on Calc BC material. AP Precalc in its current form focusses on applying concepts and interpretation. It is likely your kid is good with computation which is what can be learnt by doing a ton of enrichment worksheets, but may be lacking in application and interpretation and hence getting a C. But the teacher is in the best position to make this assessment.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pp. To be accurate, the teacher says you SHOULDN'T (not that you can't) sign up for BC unless you have an A in precalc. I know that AP Precalc in this school is not equivalent to a true AP Precalc curriculum. The real AP version does not cover as much.

The question I have is whether acing the true AP precalc curriculum is a good indicator of readiness/success in BC. If not, why does College Board think it is or why do they set it up to be the gateway course. The PP said it wasn't enough...so I would like more info on that.

Acing AP Precalc would just mean student is ready to take AB, not BC. AP Precalc exam doesnt even cover the entire AP Precalc course syllabus. Unit 4 is not assessed on the exam.

I understand that Unit 4 is not tested. But, those topics will be taught in this version of AP Precalc. And actually, many schools teach all four Units of CB's AP Precalc. So, the fact that it isn't on the exam doesn't really mean anything. If the student can master all three of CB's AP Precalc units that ARE taught, and the fourth unit is taught (although not tested) -- why isn't that sufficient to show that the student is ready for AP Calc BC? We're not talking about someone who gets 70% of the tested questions right. We're talking about someone who basically gets them all right (or 97%). If a student has shown that they ace the PSAT, and they are acing what College Board says is the pre-req class for AP Calc ___ -- then shouldn't THAT student be encouraged to take Calc BC? Seems like the kid who is getting a 3 or 4 on the AP Precalc exam (50-75% of the questions right) should be encouraged to take AP Calc AB.

Taking your statement as truth -- that acing AP Precalc only means that the student is ready for AB, and not BC --- then WHAT is the objective measure people across the country are using to determine readiness/success for BC? Some of those who ace AP Precalc ARE in the group that is ready for BC.

Anonymous wrote:Pp. To be accurate, the teacher says you SHOULDN'T (not that you can't) sign up for BC unless you have an A in precalc. I know that AP Precalc in this school is not equivalent to a true AP Precalc curriculum. The real AP version does not cover as much.

The question I have is whether acing the true AP precalc curriculum is a good indicator of readiness/success in BC. If not, why does College Board think it is or why do they set it up to be the gateway course. The PP said it wasn't enough...so I would like more info on that.

Acing AP Precalc would just mean student is ready to take AB, not BC. AP Precalc exam doesnt even cover the entire AP Precalc course syllabus. Unit 4 is not assessed on the exam.