Anonymous
11/19/2023 18:47
Subject: Anyone marry a failure to launch husband?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Adhd doesn’t always mean they’ll be failure to launch. My Dh has bad adhd but he has been incredibly independent.
I think a lot of it is having chores and responsibilities as a kid. I’m scared for the next generation. None of my kids friends have ever had any chores.
I never had any and I am definitely not failure to launch.
It's not required to raise a responsible human being.
It can help but doing chores as a kid can't make or break anyone.
Also unless its a forced child marriage of minors, if someone is mature and responsible themselves, its not difficult to have a good idea of core of the person they are marrying.
Anonymous
11/19/2023 17:54
Subject: Anyone marry a failure to launch husband?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:When I read these kinds of threads, I always wonder about the time when you first started dating. Were these guys living in their parent’s basement or on their own? If on their own, was their apartment relatively clean and were their bills paid? Once married, did you make their life too easy and now they are in lazy mode? How did your situation start?
I’m confused by your confusion. They mask. All crappy partners “mask.” Alcoholics, addicts, rage-aholics, sex addicts, and perennial losers. They keep it together for as long as they need to and once they feel comfortable, the real them comes out.
No one can “mask” being a loser. That would require high sociopathic intelligence and willful deception. If he’s a failure to launch bum, he is almost certainly not that smart or sophisticated.
The whole thing about failure to launch is it is immediately visible, ie. still living in mom’s basement, holding down menial jobs etc. (NOT being a GS 14, wth?)
All the failure to launch types I know failed to launch because they never had to. Either extremely wealthy or enabled by parents who could support them. They are smart, well-read, well-traveled, well-educated, own homes and usually work at something in a casual way that doesn't bring in much money.
I should know, since I'm one of them.
Good for you.
All the FTL 20-50 yos we know have unmanaged adhd or aspergers. Many of their parents do as well so they can’t figure it out.
Right now one was gifted a bunch of rental properties because he can’t hold down a job without messing up or saying/doing someone foolish.
Anonymous
11/19/2023 07:07
Subject: Anyone marry a failure to launch husband?
Anonymous wrote:I am a woman, but I too would say that I have gone backwards and reversed matured as well. I used to have it all together but it has all unraveled. I also have ADHD and then developed an autoimmune disorder and the combination was unraveling.
It is a weird position to be in. I am currently single so I am not dragging anyways backwards with me but it is still strange to unmature.
In what ways are you unmaturing?
Anonymous
11/17/2023 22:35
Subject: Anyone marry a failure to launch husband?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:When I read these kinds of threads, I always wonder about the time when you first started dating. Were these guys living in their parent’s basement or on their own? If on their own, was their apartment relatively clean and were their bills paid? Once married, did you make their life too easy and now they are in lazy mode? How did your situation start?
I’m confused by your confusion. They mask. All crappy partners “mask.” Alcoholics, addicts, rage-aholics, sex addicts, and perennial losers. They keep it together for as long as they need to and once they feel comfortable, the real them comes out.
No one can “mask” being a loser. That would require high sociopathic intelligence and willful deception. If he’s a failure to launch bum, he is almost certainly not that smart or sophisticated.
The whole thing about failure to launch is it is immediately visible, ie. still living in mom’s basement, holding down menial jobs etc. (NOT being a GS 14, wth?)
Simplistic POV.
They don’t look like losers, that’s the point. This happens because their situation appears temporary — and it takes a long time in *any relationship* to see what is situational/circumstantial and what is a PATTERN.
My friend married a failure to launch. He went to Davidson. He works for his mom. He likes to spend the summer in Europe. The apartment was clean, the bills paid. All sounds fine, right?
And it is! … and it took her 5 years to realize while genuinely bright, he was totally propped up by family money and connections. Mom is actually the one who owned the apartment - which also can be explained and isnt a red flag until more context is added. He can’t hold down a job other than “working” for his mom. And he wouldn’t even want one - real jobs don’t let you take half the year off. He likes to spend the summers in Europe to just hang - and who wouldn’t - but not actually because it’s a break from his otherwise ambitious, intense life.
My friend became his mom of sorts: Told him when to buy a house, told him when to have kids, told him in his 40s that his financial habits were resulting in credit card debt, looks for jobs for him. Asked *me* to help find him a job. Again, a bright guy. And genuinely nice. But lacks the skills of a true independent adult. He’s now 50 and talking about becoming a history teacher - with no background in either area. Started a master’s degree, stopped. And this would be OK … if, again, it wasn’t for the pattern that took years to see. He suggests an unrelated random “new” career every few years and doesn’t do the work of achieving any of them.
But if you married a guy like this only two years in to dating - you can’t necessarily see how deep the issue is yet and that it will never change.
But sounds like he can learn.
The mental disorder Failures to Launch it’s just in one ear out the other.
Anonymous
11/17/2023 22:06
Subject: Re:Anyone marry a failure to launch husband?
Some of these anecdotes are about people who have enough money to not have ever needed an ordinary career. It depends on whether or not you see that as a "failure to launch". Are we talking about marrying someone who, at 35, lives in his mom's basement, has only a high school education and and works at Taco Bell with no greater ambition? Or someone who has three useless degrees from Harvard, lives in a house he owns (that maybe he didn't pay for), does "consulting" for family and friends and talks vaguely about starting his own business, and is expected to inherit millions of dollars? Either one might be a poor choice, depending on what you want in a partner. That latter might seem fine at first but he might be an unbearable man-child.
I have a friend who married an independently wealthy man. She doesn't need to work but likes her job. He does a lot of volunteer work and is very involved in their community and has tons of time to spend with their kids. He's alert and mature and they're happy. I dated a guy who lives in a paid off house that he bought himself but due to personality issues can't keep a job. He lives off of his savings, and lives quite well. But he's idle and boring, spending most of his time playing video games. I didn't want to marry him.
I have a friend who married an independently wealthy man. She doesn't need to work but likes her job. He does a lot of volunteer work and is very involved in their community and has tons of time to spend with their kids. He's alert and mature and they're happy. I dated a guy who lives in a paid off house that he bought himself but due to personality issues can't keep a job. He lives off of his savings, and lives quite well. But he's idle and boring, spending most of his time playing video games. I didn't want to marry him.
Anonymous
11/17/2023 21:46
Subject: Anyone marry a failure to launch husband?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:When I read these kinds of threads, I always wonder about the time when you first started dating. Were these guys living in their parent’s basement or on their own? If on their own, was their apartment relatively clean and were their bills paid? Once married, did you make their life too easy and now they are in lazy mode? How did your situation start?
I’m confused by your confusion. They mask. All crappy partners “mask.” Alcoholics, addicts, rage-aholics, sex addicts, and perennial losers. They keep it together for as long as they need to and once they feel comfortable, the real them comes out.
No one can “mask” being a loser. That would require high sociopathic intelligence and willful deception. If he’s a failure to launch bum, he is almost certainly not that smart or sophisticated.
The whole thing about failure to launch is it is immediately visible, ie. still living in mom’s basement, holding down menial jobs etc. (NOT being a GS 14, wth?)
Simplistic POV.
They don’t look like losers, that’s the point. This happens because their situation appears temporary — and it takes a long time in *any relationship* to see what is situational/circumstantial and what is a PATTERN.
My friend married a failure to launch. He went to Davidson. He works for his mom. He likes to spend the summer in Europe. The apartment was clean, the bills paid. All sounds fine, right?
And it is! … and it took her 5 years to realize while genuinely bright, he was totally propped up by family money and connections. Mom is actually the one who owned the apartment - which also can be explained and isnt a red flag until more context is added. He can’t hold down a job other than “working” for his mom. And he wouldn’t even want one - real jobs don’t let you take half the year off. He likes to spend the summers in Europe to just hang - and who wouldn’t - but not actually because it’s a break from his otherwise ambitious, intense life.
My friend became his mom of sorts: Told him when to buy a house, told him when to have kids, told him in his 40s that his financial habits were resulting in credit card debt, looks for jobs for him. Asked *me* to help find him a job. Again, a bright guy. And genuinely nice. But lacks the skills of a true independent adult. He’s now 50 and talking about becoming a history teacher - with no background in either area. Started a master’s degree, stopped. And this would be OK … if, again, it wasn’t for the pattern that took years to see. He suggests an unrelated random “new” career every few years and doesn’t do the work of achieving any of them.
But if you married a guy like this only two years in to dating - you can’t necessarily see how deep the issue is yet and that it will never change.
You wrote that wall of text about a guy who never held a real job except for holding on to mommy’s teats…and it took FIVE years of MARRIAGE and two years of dating to figure that out. Give me a freaking break.
The signs were always there, and there was no mask except your friend was so simple-minded that she thought a nepo baby who flew to Europe once a year (with no job!!! hello!!) to bum around (and be unemployed!) was somehow a man of ambition and success.
+1
The signs are always there. This "they mask" stuff is nonsense; true failure to launch losers are pretty apparently failure to launch losers. If you don't see it, that is some willfull blindness.
Anonymous
11/17/2023 21:30
Subject: Anyone marry a failure to launch husband?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:When I read these kinds of threads, I always wonder about the time when you first started dating. Were these guys living in their parent’s basement or on their own? If on their own, was their apartment relatively clean and were their bills paid? Once married, did you make their life too easy and now they are in lazy mode? How did your situation start?
I’m confused by your confusion. They mask. All crappy partners “mask.” Alcoholics, addicts, rage-aholics, sex addicts, and perennial losers. They keep it together for as long as they need to and once they feel comfortable, the real them comes out.
No one can “mask” being a loser. That would require high sociopathic intelligence and willful deception. If he’s a failure to launch bum, he is almost certainly not that smart or sophisticated.
The whole thing about failure to launch is it is immediately visible, ie. still living in mom’s basement, holding down menial jobs etc. (NOT being a GS 14, wth?)
Simplistic POV.
They don’t look like losers, that’s the point. This happens because their situation appears temporary — and it takes a long time in *any relationship* to see what is situational/circumstantial and what is a PATTERN.
My friend married a failure to launch. He went to Davidson. He works for his mom. He likes to spend the summer in Europe. The apartment was clean, the bills paid. All sounds fine, right?
And it is! … and it took her 5 years to realize while genuinely bright, he was totally propped up by family money and connections. Mom is actually the one who owned the apartment - which also can be explained and isnt a red flag until more context is added. He can’t hold down a job other than “working” for his mom. And he wouldn’t even want one - real jobs don’t let you take half the year off. He likes to spend the summers in Europe to just hang - and who wouldn’t - but not actually because it’s a break from his otherwise ambitious, intense life.
My friend became his mom of sorts: Told him when to buy a house, told him when to have kids, told him in his 40s that his financial habits were resulting in credit card debt, looks for jobs for him. Asked *me* to help find him a job. Again, a bright guy. And genuinely nice. But lacks the skills of a true independent adult. He’s now 50 and talking about becoming a history teacher - with no background in either area. Started a master’s degree, stopped. And this would be OK … if, again, it wasn’t for the pattern that took years to see. He suggests an unrelated random “new” career every few years and doesn’t do the work of achieving any of them.
But if you married a guy like this only two years in to dating - you can’t necessarily see how deep the issue is yet and that it will never change.
You wrote that wall of text about a guy who never held a real job except for holding on to mommy’s teats…and it took FIVE years of MARRIAGE and two years of dating to figure that out. Give me a freaking break.
The signs were always there, and there was no mask except your friend was so simple-minded that she thought a nepo baby who flew to Europe once a year (with no job!!! hello!!) to bum around (and be unemployed!) was somehow a man of ambition and success.
Anonymous
11/17/2023 20:52
Subject: Anyone marry a failure to launch husband?
Anonymous wrote:I was stupid enough too. I thought we are young and he will mature as we age. Nope!
Complete downward spiral. He developed alcoholism, has untreated adhd, no executive functioning skills and no life skills in general. Emotionally he acts like he’s 22. We are pushing 40.
What a disaster.
Op, I’m sorry.
Your family might have know and tried to warn you. But do NOT feel and about it. Just appreciate them now. When our families do that to us it’s either justified or petty. We always always assume petty. But occasionally it is warranted.
I’m curious if you look back and see friends or family trying to say something when you were getting engaged or talking about it.
Anonymous
11/17/2023 20:23
Subject: Anyone marry a failure to launch husband?
Anonymous wrote:I am a woman, but I too would say that I have gone backwards and reversed matured as well. I used to have it all together but it has all unraveled. I also have ADHD and then developed an autoimmune disorder and the combination was unraveling.
It is a weird position to be in. I am currently single so I am not dragging anyways backwards with me but it is still strange to unmature.
I would not say you have "unmatured"; honestly, it just sounds like you are struggling, and that happens to everyone at some point. Hang in there.
Anonymous
11/17/2023 20:19
Subject: Anyone marry a failure to launch husband?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:When I read these kinds of threads, I always wonder about the time when you first started dating. Were these guys living in their parent’s basement or on their own? If on their own, was their apartment relatively clean and were their bills paid? Once married, did you make their life too easy and now they are in lazy mode? How did your situation start?
I’m confused by your confusion. They mask. All crappy partners “mask.” Alcoholics, addicts, rage-aholics, sex addicts, and perennial losers. They keep it together for as long as they need to and once they feel comfortable, the real them comes out.
No one can “mask” being a loser. That would require high sociopathic intelligence and willful deception. If he’s a failure to launch bum, he is almost certainly not that smart or sophisticated.
The whole thing about failure to launch is it is immediately visible, ie. still living in mom’s basement, holding down menial jobs etc. (NOT being a GS 14, wth?)
Simplistic POV.
They don’t look like losers, that’s the point. This happens because their situation appears temporary — and it takes a long time in *any relationship* to see what is situational/circumstantial and what is a PATTERN.
My friend married a failure to launch. He went to Davidson. He works for his mom. He likes to spend the summer in Europe. The apartment was clean, the bills paid. All sounds fine, right?
And it is! … and it took her 5 years to realize while genuinely bright, he was totally propped up by family money and connections. Mom is actually the one who owned the apartment - which also can be explained and isnt a red flag until more context is added. He can’t hold down a job other than “working” for his mom. And he wouldn’t even want one - real jobs don’t let you take half the year off. He likes to spend the summers in Europe to just hang - and who wouldn’t - but not actually because it’s a break from his otherwise ambitious, intense life.
My friend became his mom of sorts: Told him when to buy a house, told him when to have kids, told him in his 40s that his financial habits were resulting in credit card debt, looks for jobs for him. Asked *me* to help find him a job. Again, a bright guy. And genuinely nice. But lacks the skills of a true independent adult. He’s now 50 and talking about becoming a history teacher - with no background in either area. Started a master’s degree, stopped. And this would be OK … if, again, it wasn’t for the pattern that took years to see. He suggests an unrelated random “new” career every few years and doesn’t do the work of achieving any of them.
But if you married a guy like this only two years in to dating - you can’t necessarily see how deep the issue is yet and that it will never change.
DP. I agree that family money hides/buffers the FTL types. I know a FTL woman from a wealthy family. Her siblings all went to med school or had PhDs by 30. When she was 30 with no grad school, career, or marriage on the horizon, her dad bought her a house and a bakery. On the surface she appeared successful for awhile, but she ran the business into the ground due to lack of experience. She hasn't attempted any work since her bakery shuttered and has moved back in with her dad.
Anonymous
11/17/2023 19:43
Subject: Anyone marry a failure to launch husband?
Unfortunately it’s actually pretty easy to hide laziness for quite awhile. This is true regardless of family wealth in my opinion. They’re good storytellers and they believe their own story.
Anonymous
11/17/2023 19:38
Subject: Anyone marry a failure to launch husband?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:When I read these kinds of threads, I always wonder about the time when you first started dating. Were these guys living in their parent’s basement or on their own? If on their own, was their apartment relatively clean and were their bills paid? Once married, did you make their life too easy and now they are in lazy mode? How did your situation start?
I’m confused by your confusion. They mask. All crappy partners “mask.” Alcoholics, addicts, rage-aholics, sex addicts, and perennial losers. They keep it together for as long as they need to and once they feel comfortable, the real them comes out.
+1, they mask.
They may even sound ambitious and look like they are hard at work on big plans. And then after several years you realize they just go in circles and were all talk.
Anonymous
11/17/2023 19:35
Subject: Anyone marry a failure to launch husband?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:When I read these kinds of threads, I always wonder about the time when you first started dating. Were these guys living in their parent’s basement or on their own? If on their own, was their apartment relatively clean and were their bills paid? Once married, did you make their life too easy and now they are in lazy mode? How did your situation start?
I’m confused by your confusion. They mask. All crappy partners “mask.” Alcoholics, addicts, rage-aholics, sex addicts, and perennial losers. They keep it together for as long as they need to and once they feel comfortable, the real them comes out.
No one can “mask” being a loser. That would require high sociopathic intelligence and willful deception. If he’s a failure to launch bum, he is almost certainly not that smart or sophisticated.
The whole thing about failure to launch is it is immediately visible, ie. still living in mom’s basement, holding down menial jobs etc. (NOT being a GS 14, wth?)
Simplistic POV.
They don’t look like losers, that’s the point. This happens because their situation appears temporary — and it takes a long time in *any relationship* to see what is situational/circumstantial and what is a PATTERN.
My friend married a failure to launch. He went to Davidson. He works for his mom. He likes to spend the summer in Europe. The apartment was clean, the bills paid. All sounds fine, right?
And it is! … and it took her 5 years to realize while genuinely bright, he was totally propped up by family money and connections. Mom is actually the one who owned the apartment - which also can be explained and isnt a red flag until more context is added. He can’t hold down a job other than “working” for his mom. And he wouldn’t even want one - real jobs don’t let you take half the year off. He likes to spend the summers in Europe to just hang - and who wouldn’t - but not actually because it’s a break from his otherwise ambitious, intense life.
My friend became his mom of sorts: Told him when to buy a house, told him when to have kids, told him in his 40s that his financial habits were resulting in credit card debt, looks for jobs for him. Asked *me* to help find him a job. Again, a bright guy. And genuinely nice. But lacks the skills of a true independent adult. He’s now 50 and talking about becoming a history teacher - with no background in either area. Started a master’s degree, stopped. And this would be OK … if, again, it wasn’t for the pattern that took years to see. He suggests an unrelated random “new” career every few years and doesn’t do the work of achieving any of them.
But if you married a guy like this only two years in to dating - you can’t necessarily see how deep the issue is yet and that it will never change.
Anonymous
11/17/2023 19:10
Subject: Anyone marry a failure to launch husband?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Adhd doesn’t always mean they’ll be failure to launch. My Dh has bad adhd but he has been incredibly independent.
I think a lot of it is having chores and responsibilities as a kid. I’m scared for the next generation. None of my kids friends have ever had any chores.
I never had any and I am definitely not failure to launch.
It's not required to raise a responsibile human being.
Anonymous
11/17/2023 19:08
Subject: Anyone marry a failure to launch husband?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:When I read these kinds of threads, I always wonder about the time when you first started dating. Were these guys living in their parent’s basement or on their own? If on their own, was their apartment relatively clean and were their bills paid? Once married, did you make their life too easy and now they are in lazy mode? How did your situation start?
I’m confused by your confusion. They mask. All crappy partners “mask.” Alcoholics, addicts, rage-aholics, sex addicts, and perennial losers. They keep it together for as long as they need to and once they feel comfortable, the real them comes out.
No one can “mask” being a loser. That would require high sociopathic intelligence and willful deception. If he’s a failure to launch bum, he is almost certainly not that smart or sophisticated.
The whole thing about failure to launch is it is immediately visible, ie. still living in mom’s basement, holding down menial jobs etc. (NOT being a GS 14, wth?)
All the failure to launch types I know failed to launch because they never had to. Either extremely wealthy or enabled by parents who could support them. They are smart, well-read, well-traveled, well-educated, own homes and usually work at something in a casual way that doesn't bring in much money.
I should know, since I'm one of them.