The #1 sign of a toxic workplace is that people work there.

Incompetent, flighty, clueless people rewarded with big jobs and needing to be staffed. No promotion potential. Insider relationships. Territorial colleagues

Lack of transparency wrt to leave and benefits, inconsistent expectations for team members at the same level. Titles not matching up with duties. Over reliance on written communication, reluctance to engage in discussion.

Anonymous wrote:If the majority of staff has been there no more than 1-2 years (sign of high turnover), or 15+ years (sign of lots of folks being stuck in their ways, "that's the way we've always done it.")

This one.

Anonymous wrote:DOE Office of the Chief Information Officer. All things mentioned here and then some
Back channel meetings during the meetings for the "WTF" conversations. High turnover. Backstabbing and undermining by leadership. Contractors wagging the tail of the fed dog. In office, doors closed most of the time when on premises. Ethics nightmares abound. Leadership cares more about airliine and hotel status/points than the actual mission. Literally killing good workers while promoting incompetence.

What do you mean about contractors wagging the tail of fed dog and can you give an example?

Anonymous wrote:We're family here...
I've applied to 3 families this week.

Lol

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Relevant malefactors are referred to only in pronouns. ie group of staff will be discussing a possible action and someone will say "She's not going to like this" or "We have to get her to approve this" or "Who is going to send it to her for approval?"--without any name being mentioned, everyone knows it is the toxic boss being discussed.

CYA maneuvers are prominent

Groups and processes that theoretically exist to discuss/perform/allocate certain tasks are token entities; real decisions about those tasks are made elsewhere.

Yesss

Gonna say this. Some form of informal parallel hierarchy that doesn't resemble that actual org chart that exists on paper. In our toxic workplace, the admin was allowed by the section head to task all of the employees in the section -- and a lot of the taskings involved her assigning her own work that she didn't like or didn't know how to do to us. she was also really sexist and believed that all women should do secretarial work, so if you were a woman in the section, watch out. You are now in charge of collecting RSVP's for events. The weirdest part was that the admin didn't understand most modern technology, so she would do things like include an email address and ask people to email her ot rsvp for events, even though we had events software that automatically collected the info and put it in a spreadsheet. No, she wanted us to spend our days collecting emails and putting the info into a spreadsheet. Bizarre.

I had a boss that insist on me taking data from snowflake, plop into excel, make pretty charts and copy paste into PPT, all this while we ALREADY have a power BI set up to pull data and plot.
It’s the weirdest power move.

Anonymous wrote:It often takes only one person if in a more senior position.

Lying and triangulating. Senior person painting themselves as the hero and savior with casual lies and misinformation. So-and-so doesn't like you but I stuck up for you. Stop going to so-and-so they are sick of you and don't want to hear from you anymore. Just let me know what's going on. None of it true. That type of thing.

Angry outbursts and temper tantrums. Staff walking around eggshells around the person and afraid to speak up or confront as the person is known to be petty and vindictive and casually cruel.

A person who manages up and laterally very well and ignores direct reports.

A person who can't accept any responsibility or accountability. Everything is always someone else's fault. They are charming and funny and after mistreating people just moves on as if nothing has happened.

And yes, I work with this person currently. Basically when an organization has a narcissist in the senior ranks, run for the hills.

This is happening to me now. 😫😫

Anonymous wrote:Paranoia. Worked at a place where after the big meetings people had a secret chat group on gmail on their phones where people asked all their WTF questions. So if there are established back channels or people speak in code that’s bad.

This. In WFH when you are constantly getting pinged from 'friends' when there is a meeting with toxic boss.

Also, in/out crowd behaviors. Bosses that speak the corporate line, but behave differently and are not held accountable for this - usually they are rewarded for bad behaviors.

It often takes only one person if in a more senior position.

Lying and triangulating. Senior person painting themselves as the hero and savior with casual lies and misinformation. So-and-so doesn't like you but I stuck up for you. Stop going to so-and-so they are sick of you and don't want to hear from you anymore. Just let me know what's going on. None of it true. That type of thing.

Angry outbursts and temper tantrums. Staff walking around eggshells around the person and afraid to speak up or confront as the person is known to be petty and vindictive and casually cruel.

A person who manages up and laterally very well and ignores direct reports.

A person who can't accept any responsibility or accountability. Everything is always someone else's fault. They are charming and funny and after mistreating people just moves on as if nothing has happened.

And yes, I work with this person currently. Basically when an organization has a narcissist in the senior ranks, run for the hills.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Relevant malefactors are referred to only in pronouns. ie group of staff will be discussing a possible action and someone will say "She's not going to like this" or "We have to get her to approve this" or "Who is going to send it to her for approval?"--without any name being mentioned, everyone knows it is the toxic boss being discussed.

CYA maneuvers are prominent

Groups and processes that theoretically exist to discuss/perform/allocate certain tasks are token entities; real decisions about those tasks are made elsewhere.

Yesss

Gonna say this. Some form of informal parallel hierarchy that doesn't resemble that actual org chart that exists on paper. In our toxic workplace, the admin was allowed by the section head to task all of the employees in the section -- and a lot of the taskings involved her assigning her own work that she didn't like or didn't know how to do to us. she was also really sexist and believed that all women should do secretarial work, so if you were a woman in the section, watch out. You are now in charge of collecting RSVP's for events. The weirdest part was that the admin didn't understand most modern technology, so she would do things like include an email address and ask people to email her ot rsvp for events, even though we had events software that automatically collected the info and put it in a spreadsheet. No, she wanted us to spend our days collecting emails and putting the info into a spreadsheet. Bizarre.

This happened to me. When I first started my fed job 6 months ago, a particular low level admin insisted that despite the supervisor and deputy supervisor titles, SHE actually ran the office. I thought this was ludicrous and meant she kept everyone on track with their time entries, ordering supplies, etc. Oh no, this employee “reviews” our files and tries to give us directives.

Most annoying, she is the main office gossip. You can actually HEAR her down the hall talking about you! For example, last week I heard her “double checking” with another coworker (who is on my level) about whether I was correctly applying a dense and lengthy policy she had never even read and even if she had, wasn’t qualified to give an opinion.

And management is close to retirement so doesn’t care and lets this admin run the office.

Mgmt doesn't know how to allocate resources/team - so let's dump on the most competent employee until they burn out
Artificial deadlines - cause mgmt needs an extra week before SLA to review ???
Cliques - morning coffee/lunch runs for mgmt that doesn't include entire team
Nit-picky/micro manage - cause that's all the value mgmt brings to the table, nothing substantial

Anonymous wrote:If you drive to an interview and see people crying alone in their car in the company parking lot, it’s probably not a good sign. Or if you stop by the restroom on your way to an interview and you hear quiet sobbing, that might be a sign. Not a definite sign, but something to notice.

Umm did this actually happen to you?

Anonymous wrote:If the majority of staff has been there no more than 1-2 years (sign of high turnover), or 15+ years (sign of lots of folks being stuck in their ways, "that's the way we've always done it.")

This. Healthy orgs have people move on to better things ... but not immediately or all at once.

Also I've learned it's a sign when nobody in the office has young kids, especially none of the women. NOT because being child free is a problem but because there's something about the job that makes people with after-work responsibilities avoid it.

And of course, anybody blaming or being jealous of credit. Good bosses know that successful employees make bosses look good. Good coworkers have their own accolades and don't need yours.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Relevant malefactors are referred to only in pronouns. ie group of staff will be discussing a possible action and someone will say "She's not going to like this" or "We have to get her to approve this" or "Who is going to send it to her for approval?"--without any name being mentioned, everyone knows it is the toxic boss being discussed.

CYA maneuvers are prominent

Groups and processes that theoretically exist to discuss/perform/allocate certain tasks are token entities; real decisions about those tasks are made elsewhere.

Yesss

Gonna say this. Some form of informal parallel hierarchy that doesn't resemble that actual org chart that exists on paper. In our toxic workplace, the admin was allowed by the section head to task all of the employees in the section -- and a lot of the taskings involved her assigning her own work that she didn't like or didn't know how to do to us. she was also really sexist and believed that all women should do secretarial work, so if you were a woman in the section, watch out. You are now in charge of collecting RSVP's for events. The weirdest part was that the admin didn't understand most modern technology, so she would do things like include an email address and ask people to email her ot rsvp for events, even though we had events software that automatically collected the info and put it in a spreadsheet. No, she wanted us to spend our days collecting emails and putting the info into a spreadsheet. Bizarre.