Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So my niece can continue to play her sport in college. The issue is two-fold. Her daughter is simply good not great at her sport (which her parents refuse to accept) and the family is only middle class. They have no college savings, so debt will fuel this. Is it sports obsessed parents’ egos that refuse to let it go? They can’t admit ten years of sports efforts simply conclude in 12th grade?

Is there any way to convince them they’re about to make a terrible financial decision? The family is going to end up with a lot of debt, their daughter will likely quit the sport once she can do what she wants, and likely, the daughter hates the no-name private college where she knows nobody. Isn’t that how this usually plays out?

If you are so knowledgeable about this sport and about her ability level, then you should know that many kids play for D3 schools through great financial packages. And have great experiences at those schools. I know a few myself. Clearly, you have no idea what you are speaking of. Don't embarrass yourself by bringing up this nonsense to your SIL.

Why are you using the strange phrasing “great financial packages”? You know there are no sports scholarships at d3. And you know there is no free lunch. They dupe these student-athlete parents into attending with fake scholarship discounts and end up costing gullible middle class families a boatload of money and loans. And most kids quit the sport. And often the kids transfer out. It’s setting a middle class kid up for disaster to go to some random school solely to continue a sport. There are far more resources for such a student at a selective state university.

You really don’t know what you’re talking about. Several of DD’s friends went to D3 schools to play their sport. They received academic merit money or needs based assistance and their out of pocket expenses were significantly less than their state university costs would have been. Every one of them played their sport all 4 years, loved their school, and either got good jobs after undergrad or went directly to grad school. It’s not for everyone. But for plenty of kids it’s a great path. Hardly a disaster.

All of your daughters’ student-athlete friends shared their intimate family net worth and household income with you and you helped them fill out FAFSA and saw their “scholarship” letters? I find that hard to believe. And also, travel sports people lie to make the obscure school sound too hard to pass up. The reality is people are paying and taking out loans so their good not great athlete kid can keep playing a sport. It’s a disaster for middle class parents to get caught up in that.

I’m not the PP but I volunteer to help kids whose parents don’t have any experience with college applications get through the process. So, I see the scholarship letters and I help with the FAFSA and application. These are middle class and lower middle class kids for the most part. I’ve seen this across a wide range of kids.

The bottom line is that the D3 athlete kids often get enormous packages of merit aid, particularly if they have good grades. It’s usually competitive with in-state and often better. Many kids pick lower-ranked small colleges because it is the best financial option.

And there is another intangible: for families new to the college system, the kids feel really wanted by the school. They aren’t just numbers, they aren’t just a cog. Professors reach out after they are accepted. They get personal tours by the admissions office. They get assistance figuring out the dorms. It can be a very rewarding process for families that don’t have system experience.

Are you OP? Because you sound more truly ignorant with every single post. It is genuinely shocking how little you know.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Say nothing OP. Small no name colleges sometimes give scholarships for athletes.

If your niece wants to, she can quit the sport, lose the money, and get one year of basic classes out of the way before she transfers. Or, the school works out for her. Neither are your problem.

You’re spreading misinformation. There are no athletic scholarships at tiny private colleges.

DP and you’re half right. They offer scholarships to students who are also athletes but not athletic scholarships.

Anonymous wrote:
I don't know why everyone it excoriating you, OP. You care about your niece and are worried. I understand that.

There are two separate questions you can ask your SIL. Innocently, so she doesn't feel you're interfering.

1. College debt can be crushing, and completely derail wealth building in adulthood. I understand you're looking for significant aid from these private colleges?

2. Larla wants to be a nurse. It's so nice she can have a built-in social group thanks to her sport, but I assume all these colleges you're looking at also have a reputable nursing program?

And then you'll have said your piece and must bow out. There are many imponderables, many possible outcomes, so you can't really pitch a fit now - your niece might turn out quite happy and successful, but all they will remember is that you were unhappy with their choices. You need to be very diplomatic here.

Thank you.

Anonymous wrote:You actually don’t need any advice. Not your kid, not your finances. Stay out of it.

Op, this is the only advice you need.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So my niece can continue to play her sport in college. The issue is two-fold. Her daughter is simply good not great at her sport (which her parents refuse to accept) and the family is only middle class. They have no college savings, so debt will fuel this. Is it sports obsessed parents’ egos that refuse to let it go? They can’t admit ten years of sports efforts simply conclude in 12th grade?

Is there any way to convince them they’re about to make a terrible financial decision? The family is going to end up with a lot of debt, their daughter will likely quit the sport once she can do what she wants, and likely, the daughter hates the no-name private college where she knows nobody. Isn’t that how this usually plays out?

If you are so knowledgeable about this sport and about her ability level, then you should know that many kids play for D3 schools through great financial packages. And have great experiences at those schools. I know a few myself. Clearly, you have no idea what you are speaking of. Don't embarrass yourself by bringing up this nonsense to your SIL.

Why are you using the strange phrasing “great financial packages”? You know there are no sports scholarships at d3. And you know there is no free lunch. They dupe these student-athlete parents into attending with fake scholarship discounts and end up costing gullible middle class families a boatload of money and loans. And most kids quit the sport. And often the kids transfer out. It’s setting a middle class kid up for disaster to go to some random school solely to continue a sport. There are far more resources for such a student at a selective state university.

Are you the OP? Because you are spouting utter nonsense. Colleges aren't duping anyone, and loads of D3 schools give both merit and need based aid. Nobody said anything about sports scholarships. WTF is a fake scholarship discount? Shut up. Seriously.

Non-selective private college tuition is fake. They tease it down for everyone by showering every applicant with “scholarships” and “grants” to dupe unsophisticated parents.

If they “dupe” them down to the same price as a public school, great. A small college with a supportive athletic program for the price of State U is a trick I’d want played on my kid who isn’t getting into UVA.

Not your kid snd not your money. From here it looks more like a problematic relationship between you and your SIL

Anonymous wrote:Say nothing OP. Small no name colleges sometimes give scholarships for athletes.

If your niece wants to, she can quit the sport, lose the money, and get one year of basic classes out of the way before she transfers. Or, the school works out for her. Neither are your problem.

You’re spreading misinformation. There are no athletic scholarships at tiny private colleges.

Lordy. Nursing is very high demand there is a lot of outside money to support it. She should look and apply wherever her parents think she would be happy and they can afford. Which is clearly none of your business.

How old are your kids OP?? Do you even have any? You sound very uninformed, and nosy.

I don't know why everyone it excoriating you, OP. You care about your niece and are worried. I understand that.

There are two separate questions you can ask your SIL. Innocently, so she doesn't feel you're interfering.

1. College debt can be crushing, and completely derail wealth building in adulthood. I understand you're looking for significant aid from these private colleges?

2. Larla wants to be a nurse. It's so nice she can have a built-in social group thanks to her sport, but I assume all these colleges you're looking at also have a reputable nursing program?

And then you'll have said your piece and must bow out. There are many imponderables, many possible outcomes, so you can't really pitch a fit now - your niece might turn out quite happy and successful, but all they will remember is that you were unhappy with their choices. You need to be very diplomatic here.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So my niece can continue to play her sport in college. The issue is two-fold. Her daughter is simply good not great at her sport (which her parents refuse to accept) and the family is only middle class. They have no college savings, so debt will fuel this. Is it sports obsessed parents’ egos that refuse to let it go? They can’t admit ten years of sports efforts simply conclude in 12th grade?

Is there any way to convince them they’re about to make a terrible financial decision? The family is going to end up with a lot of debt, their daughter will likely quit the sport once she can do what she wants, and likely, the daughter hates the no-name private college where she knows nobody. Isn’t that how this usually plays out?

If you are so knowledgeable about this sport and about her ability level, then you should know that many kids play for D3 schools through great financial packages. And have great experiences at those schools. I know a few myself. Clearly, you have no idea what you are speaking of. Don't embarrass yourself by bringing up this nonsense to your SIL.

Why are you using the strange phrasing “great financial packages”? You know there are no sports scholarships at d3. And you know there is no free lunch. They dupe these student-athlete parents into attending with fake scholarship discounts and end up costing gullible middle class families a boatload of money and loans. And most kids quit the sport. And often the kids transfer out. It’s setting a middle class kid up for disaster to go to some random school solely to continue a sport. There are far more resources for such a student at a selective state university.

Are you the OP? Because you are spouting utter nonsense. Colleges aren't duping anyone, and loads of D3 schools give both merit and need based aid. Nobody said anything about sports scholarships. WTF is a fake scholarship discount? Shut up. Seriously.

Non-selective private college tuition is fake. They tease it down for everyone by showering every applicant with “scholarships” and “grants” to dupe unsophisticated parents.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You would think someone as overeducated as OP and her husband would know you don’t really know the cost/debt until you get in and get your aid package.

Applying widely is very wise to compare grant packages.

Agee. Apply widely but do also include a couple public Us as "financial safeties." For my kid who applied last year, their cheapest in-state option would have been UMW, about $17k. But OP probably would look down on their niece for going there.

If she thinks the kid is competitive for UVA then they should also be looking at highly selective D3 schools that meet need. I'm guessing that's not the case.

She is nowhere near good enough at her sport to play at an elite D3. That is what is fueling all of these tours of obscure private colleges: Playing the sport in college, any college.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So my niece can continue to play her sport in college. The issue is two-fold. Her daughter is simply good not great at her sport (which her parents refuse to accept) and the family is only middle class. They have no college savings, so debt will fuel this. Is it sports obsessed parents’ egos that refuse to let it go? They can’t admit ten years of sports efforts simply conclude in 12th grade?

Is there any way to convince them they’re about to make a terrible financial decision? The family is going to end up with a lot of debt, their daughter will likely quit the sport once she can do what she wants, and likely, the daughter hates the no-name private college where she knows nobody. Isn’t that how this usually plays out?

If you are so knowledgeable about this sport and about her ability level, then you should know that many kids play for D3 schools through great financial packages. And have great experiences at those schools. I know a few myself. Clearly, you have no idea what you are speaking of. Don't embarrass yourself by bringing up this nonsense to your SIL.

Why are you using the strange phrasing “great financial packages”? You know there are no sports scholarships at d3. And you know there is no free lunch. They dupe these student-athlete parents into attending with fake scholarship discounts and end up costing gullible middle class families a boatload of money and loans. And most kids quit the sport. And often the kids transfer out. It’s setting a middle class kid up for disaster to go to some random school solely to continue a sport. There are far more resources for such a student at a selective state university.

Are you the OP? Because you are spouting utter nonsense. Colleges aren't duping anyone, and loads of D3 schools give both merit and need based aid. Nobody said anything about sports scholarships. WTF is a fake scholarship discount? Shut up. Seriously.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You actually don’t need any advice. Not your kid, not your finances. Stay out of it.

It’s our family. And my husband and I have degrees from four universities and far more resources and even we wouldn’t do something so financially reckless. It feels like they are being swindled and are too caught up in making sure she plays a sport in college. I don’t want to see this wreck their finances, their marriage, put my niece in a mountain of debt, and make it so my niece ends up transferring colleges because she only went to the obscure private for a sport.

Since you’re so close to this family talk to your niece at your regular get together!

It’s challenging to talk to a niece or the parents when the parents’ egos seem so caught up in making sure she plays in college, any college. They’re being totally irrational. I think it’s a terrible decision to go to an obscure private college in the middle of nowhere when she could likely get into UVA. UVA will have the most recourses, the best departments, and best students. And again they have no money. Please don’t lie to me that some obscure d3 college is going to let her go there for free. Ain’t happening.

If she has the stats for UVA, then she will have plenty of options with tons of merit aid. UVA will definitely not be her cheapest option.

And she's looking at a career where the prestige of the school doesn't matter at all.

For heaven’s sake, please myob

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is ABSOLUTELY none of your business. But sure insert your opinions. I’m sure that will do wonders for the family relationship. Butt the F out.

Let me add that your idea of "no-name" means nothing. Perhaps you haven't heard of Colby? Bates? Swarthmore?

Those you rattled off are not no-name, obviously. I am referring to truly obscure regional liberal arts colleges. Colleges that may not exist in 10 years.

Are they real colleges or for-profits? Can you give us some examples?

I think what you do or say really depends on your relationship with your SIL and niece. (Where is your brother in this?!)

If you're close with them, I think you can have a conversation with one or both about your concerns. Really listen to their answers. Don't insist you are right. If you're not that close, I think you just have to stay out of it. People make decisions different from the ones we'd make all the darn time, and that's life.