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Anonymous wrote:Virtual middle college and middle college were designed to funnel more students into MC as community college enrollment has been declining.
The goal is to help MC stay afloat more than it is to benefit students

Hopefully you’re aware that MC is a nonprofit.

If MC provides classes that MCPS won't, or provides them cheaper, and money moves from MCPS budget to MC budget to make MC look better to the Legislature, it's a win-win that defends MC from being shut down for cost-efficiency reasons.

MC is not going to get shut down. Who even by, anyway? Good grief.

It is not about shutting down. They have declining numbers and the push by MCPS for MC courses is directly linked to boosting MC admissions.
MC professors probably make less than MCPS teachers although I’m not 100% sure of that. The adjuncts certainly make less

Of course the adjuncts make less. Adjuncts make less than everyone, everywhere. Similarly, college enrollment is down everywhere. What are the downsides, for anybody, if MCPS students have the possibility of enrolling in MC during high school? I can't think of any.

When you speak to students who are taking MC courses, they will tell you the quality varies widely. The classes seem to range from bad to ok for the most part. Some are good but I mostly hear kids say that classes are meh. Why are we creating all this upheaval for HS students just to shove them in lack lustre classes. Again, I’m not saying they are all bad. But for some reason, most of the reviews are so-so. I work at a HS and have asked 15-20 kids about their MC classes at this point

Anonymous wrote:I know kids taking health and PE at MC along with communications. How does that even make sense. The reasoning is that they are fulfilling some credits that will count towards UMD requirements but pulling kids out of their regular HS for these types of useless credits seems lame

Thank you for substantiating my point about MC trying to duplicate or replace what MCPS does or should be doing with a timely example. This is nuts!

I know kids taking health and PE at MC along with communications. How does that even make sense. The reasoning is that they are fulfilling some credits that will count towards UMD requirements but pulling kids out of their regular HS for these types of useless credits seems lame

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Anonymous wrote:Virtual middle college and middle college were designed to funnel more students into MC as community college enrollment has been declining.
The goal is to help MC stay afloat more than it is to benefit students

Hopefully you’re aware that MC is a nonprofit.

If MC provides classes that MCPS won't, or provides them cheaper, and money moves from MCPS budget to MC budget to make MC look better to the Legislature, it's a win-win that defends MC from being shut down for cost-efficiency reasons.

You nailed it. MCPS students and resources are continuously being used to prop up Montgomery College's existence. I'm not a fan, not because I don't think MC shouldn't exist. But the community college should exist on its own merits, not by leaching and replacing with MCPS should be doing.

The DE program is one of MC's merits. MCPS shouldn't be doing dual enrollment on it's own because it's not a regionally accredited university and therefore can't issue college credit for classes.

My qualm with DE is them having kids take high school classes on college campuses. If you're dual-enrolled and taking college classes on college campus, fine. But they're literally yanking kids out of high school to throw them into a college environment early, which is not developmentally healthy, IMO, because as others point out, K-12 education is also about social and emotional development.

DE either extracts them from their high school environment and puts that cohort of kids in an isolated bubble, or forces them to split that time in half with some time spent on campus and some time spent in their home high school.

Of the two methods, I think the latter model, where DE students visit the college campus but are still anchored in their high school, is better. But the former model does replace what MCPS offers, and I don't think that's healthy for kids.

There’s no “yanking.” Students and families voluntarily sign up for DE.

MCPS and MC definitely do a hard push and sell of DE. I know no one is technically forced, but a lot of kids are pushed into it without realizing what they're giving up or what it will be like.

I know this firsthand from several kids whose counselors and teachers pushed them into it, and ultimately dropped out because they felt disconnected from their friends and home school and also weren't really ready for the level of academic rigor and independence that comes with college.

Feels like teachers union busting, since underpaid MC lecturers aren’t unionized.

Interesting. Good point.

I saw the ploy more as just filling the empty seats at MC, but your theory might hold weight too.

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Anonymous wrote:Virtual middle college and middle college were designed to funnel more students into MC as community college enrollment has been declining.
The goal is to help MC stay afloat more than it is to benefit students

Hopefully you’re aware that MC is a nonprofit.

If MC provides classes that MCPS won't, or provides them cheaper, and money moves from MCPS budget to MC budget to make MC look better to the Legislature, it's a win-win that defends MC from being shut down for cost-efficiency reasons.

You nailed it. MCPS students and resources are continuously being used to prop up Montgomery College's existence. I'm not a fan, not because I don't think MC shouldn't exist. But the community college should exist on its own merits, not by leaching and replacing with MCPS should be doing.

The DE program is one of MC's merits. MCPS shouldn't be doing dual enrollment on it's own because it's not a regionally accredited university and therefore can't issue college credit for classes.

My qualm with DE is them having kids take high school classes on college campuses. If you're dual-enrolled and taking college classes on college campus, fine. But they're literally yanking kids out of high school to throw them into a college environment early, which is not developmentally healthy, IMO, because as others point out, K-12 education is also about social and emotional development.

DE either extracts them from their high school environment and puts that cohort of kids in an isolated bubble, or forces them to split that time in half with some time spent on campus and some time spent in their home high school.

Of the two methods, I think the latter model, where DE students visit the college campus but are still anchored in their high school, is better. But the former model does replace what MCPS offers, and I don't think that's healthy for kids.

They are not literally yanking kids out of high school. And you might think it's unhealthy for 16-18-year-olds to take college classes, but I don't. So there, now we have two opinions.

I didn't say it was unhealthy for 16-18 year olds to take college classes. I said it was unhealthy to pull them completely from their HS environment, which one form of DE does do.

I can see the value of having a kid take 1 or 2 college classes at MC because they're so advanced. Although I do think the number of students who would benefit from that arrangement is much smaller than the number of kids MCPS and MC shove into the program.

But that's completely different from pulling a kid from their high school completely and having them take high school and college classes at MC 100% of the time. That's what

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Virtual middle college and middle college were designed to funnel more students into MC as community college enrollment has been declining.
The goal is to help MC stay afloat more than it is to benefit students

Hopefully you’re aware that MC is a nonprofit.

If MC provides classes that MCPS won't, or provides them cheaper, and money moves from MCPS budget to MC budget to make MC look better to the Legislature, it's a win-win that defends MC from being shut down for cost-efficiency reasons.

You nailed it. MCPS students and resources are continuously being used to prop up Montgomery College's existence. I'm not a fan, not because I don't think MC shouldn't exist. But the community college should exist on its own merits, not by leaching and replacing with MCPS should be doing.

The DE program is one of MC's merits. MCPS shouldn't be doing dual enrollment on it's own because it's not a regionally accredited university and therefore can't issue college credit for classes.

My qualm with DE is them having kids take high school classes on college campuses. If you're dual-enrolled and taking college classes on college campus, fine. But they're literally yanking kids out of high school to throw them into a college environment early, which is not developmentally healthy, IMO, because as others point out, K-12 education is also about social and emotional development.

DE either extracts them from their high school environment and puts that cohort of kids in an isolated bubble, or forces them to split that time in half with some time spent on campus and some time spent in their home high school.

Of the two methods, I think the latter model, where DE students visit the college campus but are still anchored in their high school, is better. But the former model does replace what MCPS offers, and I don't think that's healthy for kids.

They are not literally yanking kids out of high school. And you might think it's unhealthy for 16-18-year-olds to take college classes, but I don't. So there, now we have two opinions.

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Virtual middle college and middle college were designed to funnel more students into MC as community college enrollment has been declining.
The goal is to help MC stay afloat more than it is to benefit students

Hopefully you’re aware that MC is a nonprofit.

If MC provides classes that MCPS won't, or provides them cheaper, and money moves from MCPS budget to MC budget to make MC look better to the Legislature, it's a win-win that defends MC from being shut down for cost-efficiency reasons.

You nailed it. MCPS students and resources are continuously being used to prop up Montgomery College's existence. I'm not a fan, not because I don't think MC shouldn't exist. But the community college should exist on its own merits, not by leaching and replacing with MCPS should be doing.

The DE program is one of MC's merits. MCPS shouldn't be doing dual enrollment on it's own because it's not a regionally accredited university and therefore can't issue college credit for classes.

My qualm with DE is them having kids take high school classes on college campuses. If you're dual-enrolled and taking college classes on college campus, fine. But they're literally yanking kids out of high school to throw them into a college environment early, which is not developmentally healthy, IMO, because as others point out, K-12 education is also about social and emotional development.

DE either extracts them from their high school environment and puts that cohort of kids in an isolated bubble, or forces them to split that time in half with some time spent on campus and some time spent in their home high school.

Of the two methods, I think the latter model, where DE students visit the college campus but are still anchored in their high school, is better. But the former model does replace what MCPS offers, and I don't think that's healthy for kids.

There’s no “yanking.” Students and families voluntarily sign up for DE.

MCPS and MC definitely do a hard push and sell of DE. I know no one is technically forced, but a lot of kids are pushed into it without realizing what they're giving up or what it will be like.

I know this firsthand from several kids whose counselors and teachers pushed them into it, and ultimately dropped out because they felt disconnected from their friends and home school and also weren't really ready for the level of academic rigor and independence that comes with college.

Feels like teachers union busting, since underpaid MC lecturers aren’t unionized.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Virtual middle college and middle college were designed to funnel more students into MC as community college enrollment has been declining.
The goal is to help MC stay afloat more than it is to benefit students

Hopefully you’re aware that MC is a nonprofit.

If MC provides classes that MCPS won't, or provides them cheaper, and money moves from MCPS budget to MC budget to make MC look better to the Legislature, it's a win-win that defends MC from being shut down for cost-efficiency reasons.

You nailed it. MCPS students and resources are continuously being used to prop up Montgomery College's existence. I'm not a fan, not because I don't think MC shouldn't exist. But the community college should exist on its own merits, not by leaching and replacing with MCPS should be doing.

The DE program is one of MC's merits. MCPS shouldn't be doing dual enrollment on it's own because it's not a regionally accredited university and therefore can't issue college credit for classes.

My qualm with DE is them having kids take high school classes on college campuses. If you're dual-enrolled and taking college classes on college campus, fine. But they're literally yanking kids out of high school to throw them into a college environment early, which is not developmentally healthy, IMO, because as others point out, K-12 education is also about social and emotional development.

DE either extracts them from their high school environment and puts that cohort of kids in an isolated bubble, or forces them to split that time in half with some time spent on campus and some time spent in their home high school.

Of the two methods, I think the latter model, where DE students visit the college campus but are still anchored in their high school, is better. But the former model does replace what MCPS offers, and I don't think that's healthy for kids.

There’s no “yanking.” Students and families voluntarily sign up for DE.

MCPS and MC definitely do a hard push and sell of DE. I know no one is technically forced, but a lot of kids are pushed into it without realizing what they're giving up or what it will be like.

I know this firsthand from several kids whose counselors and teachers pushed them into it, and ultimately dropped out because they felt disconnected from their friends and home school and also weren't really ready for the level of academic rigor and independence that comes with college.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Virtual middle college and middle college were designed to funnel more students into MC as community college enrollment has been declining.
The goal is to help MC stay afloat more than it is to benefit students

Hopefully you’re aware that MC is a nonprofit.

If MC provides classes that MCPS won't, or provides them cheaper, and money moves from MCPS budget to MC budget to make MC look better to the Legislature, it's a win-win that defends MC from being shut down for cost-efficiency reasons.

You nailed it. MCPS students and resources are continuously being used to prop up Montgomery College's existence. I'm not a fan, not because I don't think MC shouldn't exist. But the community college should exist on its own merits, not by leaching and replacing with MCPS should be doing.

The DE program is one of MC's merits. MCPS shouldn't be doing dual enrollment on it's own because it's not a regionally accredited university and therefore can't issue college credit for classes.

My qualm with DE is them having kids take high school classes on college campuses. If you're dual-enrolled and taking college classes on college campus, fine. But they're literally yanking kids out of high school to throw them into a college environment early, which is not developmentally healthy, IMO, because as others point out, K-12 education is also about social and emotional development.

DE either extracts them from their high school environment and puts that cohort of kids in an isolated bubble, or forces them to split that time in half with some time spent on campus and some time spent in their home high school.

Of the two methods, I think the latter model, where DE students visit the college campus but are still anchored in their high school, is better. But the former model does replace what MCPS offers, and I don't think that's healthy for kids.

There’s no “yanking.” Students and families voluntarily sign up for DE.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Virtual middle college and middle college were designed to funnel more students into MC as community college enrollment has been declining.
The goal is to help MC stay afloat more than it is to benefit students

Hopefully you’re aware that MC is a nonprofit.

If MC provides classes that MCPS won't, or provides them cheaper, and money moves from MCPS budget to MC budget to make MC look better to the Legislature, it's a win-win that defends MC from being shut down for cost-efficiency reasons.

You nailed it. MCPS students and resources are continuously being used to prop up Montgomery College's existence. I'm not a fan, not because I don't think MC shouldn't exist. But the community college should exist on its own merits, not by leaching and replacing with MCPS should be doing.

The DE program is one of MC's merits. MCPS shouldn't be doing dual enrollment on it's own because it's not a regionally accredited university and therefore can't issue college credit for classes.

My qualm with DE is them having kids take high school classes on college campuses. If you're dual-enrolled and taking college classes on college campus, fine. But they're literally yanking kids out of high school to throw them into a college environment early, which is not developmentally healthy, IMO, because as others point out, K-12 education is also about social and emotional development.

DE either extracts them from their high school environment and puts that cohort of kids in an isolated bubble, or forces them to split that time in half with some time spent on campus and some time spent in their home high school.

Of the two methods, I think the latter model, where DE students visit the college campus but are still anchored in their high school, is better. But the former model does replace what MCPS offers, and I don't think that's healthy for kids.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Virtual middle college and middle college were designed to funnel more students into MC as community college enrollment has been declining.
The goal is to help MC stay afloat more than it is to benefit students

Hopefully you’re aware that MC is a nonprofit.

If MC provides classes that MCPS won't, or provides them cheaper, and money moves from MCPS budget to MC budget to make MC look better to the Legislature, it's a win-win that defends MC from being shut down for cost-efficiency reasons.

MC is not going to get shut down. Who even by, anyway? Good grief.

It is not about shutting down. They have declining numbers and the push by MCPS for MC courses is directly linked to boosting MC admissions.
MC professors probably make less than MCPS teachers although I’m not 100% sure of that. The adjuncts certainly make less

Of course the adjuncts make less. Adjuncts make less than everyone, everywhere. Similarly, college enrollment is down everywhere. What are the downsides, for anybody, if MCPS students have the possibility of enrolling in MC during high school? I can't think of any.

Ask a college prof how they like teaching 16 year olds sometime.

They prefer the dedicated dual enrollment students to campus party animals.

LOL Campus party animals? At MC? You do know all of those kids live at home with their parents, right? There are no campus parties to be had at MC....

+1

And many are adults, as in 38 year olds

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Virtual middle college and middle college were designed to funnel more students into MC as community college enrollment has been declining.
The goal is to help MC stay afloat more than it is to benefit students

Hopefully you’re aware that MC is a nonprofit.

If MC provides classes that MCPS won't, or provides them cheaper, and money moves from MCPS budget to MC budget to make MC look better to the Legislature, it's a win-win that defends MC from being shut down for cost-efficiency reasons.

You nailed it. MCPS students and resources are continuously being used to prop up Montgomery College's existence. I'm not a fan, not because I don't think MC shouldn't exist. But the community college should exist on its own merits, not by leaching and replacing with MCPS should be doing.

The DE program is one of MC's merits. MCPS shouldn't be doing dual enrollment on it's own because it's not a regionally accredited university and therefore can't issue college credit for classes.

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Anonymous wrote:Thank you for sharing!
DS is interested in fully remote Early College program that starts in 9th. Finishing 8th now so lets see how it goes next year.

Fully remote for a high school age student sounds like a terrible idea.
Kids need in person interaction with their teachers and other students

DCUM maxim: what works for my kid works for everyone's kid! And you're wrong for thinking otherwise!
And its corollary: what doesn't work for my kid doesn't work for anyone's kid! And you're wrong for thinking otherwise!

I’m a HS teacher who wrote what you are responding to. Full virtual school is helpful in certain situations - persistent bullying, prolonged mental and physical illness, etc. But I stand by what I said - most kids need and benefit from an in-person educational environment. School is not just about learning subject content. It is also about learning how to collaborate and build relationships with your peers and mentors. Picking up skills to learn how to successfully navigate complex social situations is an important part of growing up. And teachers can be valuable mentors and trusted allies for students. Much as I would enjoy a partially remote job, there is no substitute for face to face interaction especially for K-12 education and post secondary as well.

I am the PP that brought up virtual MC. It is a new program for next year and is designed to allow kids take MC classes online while still enrolled and attending in person classes in their own high school (electives mostly). I actually completely agree with the teacher above on the in person interaction part. DS thrived in remote education and remembers the COVID year fondly in terms of school (go figure), he has plenty of friends and long established friendships, so I am not worried there. We will see how this new program goes. We can always withdraw and re-enroll into regular classes.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Virtual middle college and middle college were designed to funnel more students into MC as community college enrollment has been declining.
The goal is to help MC stay afloat more than it is to benefit students

Hopefully you’re aware that MC is a nonprofit.

If MC provides classes that MCPS won't, or provides them cheaper, and money moves from MCPS budget to MC budget to make MC look better to the Legislature, it's a win-win that defends MC from being shut down for cost-efficiency reasons.

MC is not going to get shut down. Who even by, anyway? Good grief.

It is not about shutting down. They have declining numbers and the push by MCPS for MC courses is directly linked to boosting MC admissions.
MC professors probably make less than MCPS teachers although I’m not 100% sure of that. The adjuncts certainly make less

Of course the adjuncts make less. Adjuncts make less than everyone, everywhere. Similarly, college enrollment is down everywhere. What are the downsides, for anybody, if MCPS students have the possibility of enrolling in MC during high school? I can't think of any.

Ask a college prof how they like teaching 16 year olds sometime.

They prefer the dedicated dual enrollment students to campus party animals.

LOL Campus party animals? At MC? You do know all of those kids live at home with their parents, right? There are no campus parties to be had at MC....

DP. There might be party animals on campus, though.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Virtual middle college and middle college were designed to funnel more students into MC as community college enrollment has been declining.
The goal is to help MC stay afloat more than it is to benefit students

Hopefully you’re aware that MC is a nonprofit.

If MC provides classes that MCPS won't, or provides them cheaper, and money moves from MCPS budget to MC budget to make MC look better to the Legislature, it's a win-win that defends MC from being shut down for cost-efficiency reasons.

MC is not going to get shut down. Who even by, anyway? Good grief.

It is not about shutting down. They have declining numbers and the push by MCPS for MC courses is directly linked to boosting MC admissions.
MC professors probably make less than MCPS teachers although I’m not 100% sure of that. The adjuncts certainly make less

Of course the adjuncts make less. Adjuncts make less than everyone, everywhere. Similarly, college enrollment is down everywhere. What are the downsides, for anybody, if MCPS students have the possibility of enrolling in MC during high school? I can't think of any.

Ask a college prof how they like teaching 16 year olds sometime.

They prefer the dedicated dual enrollment students to campus party animals.

LOL Campus party animals? At MC? You do know all of those kids live at home with their parents, right? There are no campus parties to be had at MC....