Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Teacher here with teacher friends all over the county… it is the parents driving teachers out, not the money. Look at this entire thread. It’s disgusting. I’ll happily take a pay-cut to move to another county/state if it means never having to deal with miserable MoCo parents ever again.

Agreed. It never should have been an us vs them thing… MoCo parents didn’t care. They don’t care. They want to continue to belittle and berate teachers all while demanding everything from them. So entitled. I moved here from a different part of the country and the difference between parents from there and here is just… sad. The difference is significant. Do better, MoCo. People all over are doing a much better job… I know that’s super hard for you to hear or grasp, but it’s just true.

Who's entitled, and what are they entitled to?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Teacher here with teacher friends all over the county… it is the parents driving teachers out, not the money. Look at this entire thread. It’s disgusting. I’ll happily take a pay-cut to move to another county/state if it means never having to deal with miserable MoCo parents ever again.

Agreed. It never should have been an us vs them thing… MoCo parents didn’t care. They don’t care. They want to continue to belittle and berate teachers all while demanding everything from them. So entitled. I moved here from a different part of the country and the difference between parents from there and here is just… sad. The difference is significant. Do better, MoCo. People all over are doing a much better job… I know that’s super hard for you to hear or grasp, but it’s just true.

It's not the parents throwing a hissy fit at a Council meeting, is it? Who's entitled exactly?

Anonymous wrote:Teacher here with teacher friends all over the county… it is the parents driving teachers out, not the money. Look at this entire thread. It’s disgusting. I’ll happily take a pay-cut to move to another county/state if it means never having to deal with miserable MoCo parents ever again.

Agreed. It never should have been an us vs them thing… MoCo parents didn’t care. They don’t care. They want to continue to belittle and berate teachers all while demanding everything from them. So entitled. I moved here from a different part of the country and the difference between parents from there and here is just… sad. The difference is significant. Do better, MoCo. People all over are doing a much better job… I know that’s super hard for you to hear or grasp, but it’s just true.

Teacher here with teacher friends all over the county… it is the parents driving teachers out, not the money. Look at this entire thread. It’s disgusting. I’ll happily take a pay-cut to move to another county/state if it means never having to deal with miserable MoCo parents ever again.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Gee, if only there were a way to know what teachers wanted in order to stay in the field. Oh wait — they have democratically elected union reps to express that view. Maybe we should listen to them if we don’t want them all to quit.

the unions lie.

they are either lying now or don’t understand the process.

they don’t need the full funding to get raises.

I absolutely agree. You don’t need the full funding to pay teachers more.

Anonymous wrote:

The tax increase could go down even more and teachers could still keep their raises. The council could reduce increases for other departments to pay for schools. Alternatively, the school board could prioritize teacher salaries over bloat.

After the ridiculous display at the council yesterday, I am increasingly in favor of MOE and nothing more.

That'll show 'em!

You could say the founding fathers acted like a bunch of lunatics. Esther Wells is sooo upset about decorum and the lack of following rules. No wonder you lost, Esther. You don’t have the spirit of a real leader.

Anonymous wrote:Gee, if only there were a way to know what teachers wanted in order to stay in the field. Oh wait — they have democratically elected union reps to express that view. Maybe we should listen to them if we don’t want them all to quit.

the unions lie.

they are either lying now or don’t understand the process.

they don’t need the full funding to get raises.

Anonymous wrote:Good news: The 10% increase is in fact NOT necessary to accommodate the increased pay for teachers, according to Jennifer Martin's own mouth.

Source: https://moco360.media/2023/05/10/school-officials-send-joint-letter-to-county-council-pushing-for-more-funds/

According to the letter, anything less than an eight percent increase in budget funds would jeopardize the hard-earned fruits of salary agreements between MCPS and its employee unions and force the parties to return to the negotiation tables.

“For over five months, we have bargained night and day in good faith to determine how to fairly compensate the MCPS workforce,” the letter reads. “Thanks to this collaborative hard work, all associations have reached tentative economic agreements with MCPS; however, at least an eight percent-increment increase is needed to fund our negotiated agreements.”

It's kind of stupid to throw a hissy fit at the council demanding the full 10 percent funding, knowing you've signed a letter that says you'll take 8 percent, but we all knew MCPS was asking for more than what was essential anyway. 8 percent increase sounds more reasonable and they're much more likely to get that than the 10 percent.

The tax increase could go down even more and teachers could still keep their raises. The council could reduce increases for other departments to pay for schools. Alternatively, the school board could prioritize teacher salaries over bloat.

After the ridiculous display at the council yesterday, I am increasingly in favor of MOE and nothing more.

Just the title of OPs thread really says a lot doesn't it?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one is saying teachers are rich, or overpaid.

But when you look at the actual pay tables, and steps- and factor in very good family healthcare, and a defined benefit pension (!) it is certainly a solidly middle class job.

There are plenty of places in the country that do not pay their teachers like professionals.

Montgomery County, MD is not one of them.

NP. Great. You think the pay is fine. Why can't they find enough staff to work for it, then? Why can't they retain staff if it's all fine and dandy? What should they change and how should they fund it?

And please don't quote "central office bloat." The people squawking about that on here have no concept of what's actually bloat and what isn't. They cut special ed cluster supervisors a few years ago and it was a disaster. Special ed in general is a disaster. And I haven't heard one single productive, feasible solution from anyone.

A big problem IS central office bloat. That’s one of the reasons I left teaching. There were so many people at the district level who make either a negative impact on students or no impact at all. I grew tired of all the new initiatives, each one that cost $$$$ justifying tons of non-classroom based positions.

I’m all for education and I’m all for fully-funding schools. I’m NOT for giving money that isn’t going to directly impact students. Higher salaries for teachers? Yes. Supplies, facilities, strong curriculum (written by actual teachers)? Yes.

More office jobs and more “this will change the fact of education” initiatives? No.

Anonymous wrote:Gee, if only there were a way to know what teachers wanted in order to stay in the field. Oh wait — they have democratically elected union reps to express that view. Maybe we should listen to them if we don’t want them all to quit.

+1

Good news: The 10% increase is in fact NOT necessary to accommodate the increased pay for teachers, according to Jennifer Martin's own mouth.

Source: https://moco360.media/2023/05/10/school-officials-send-joint-letter-to-county-council-pushing-for-more-funds/

According to the letter, anything less than an eight percent increase in budget funds would jeopardize the hard-earned fruits of salary agreements between MCPS and its employee unions and force the parties to return to the negotiation tables.

“For over five months, we have bargained night and day in good faith to determine how to fairly compensate the MCPS workforce,” the letter reads. “Thanks to this collaborative hard work, all associations have reached tentative economic agreements with MCPS; however, at least an eight percent-increment increase is needed to fund our negotiated agreements.”

It's kind of stupid to throw a hissy fit at the council demanding the full 10 percent funding, knowing you've signed a letter that says you'll take 8 percent, but we all knew MCPS was asking for more than what was essential anyway. 8 percent increase sounds more reasonable and they're much more likely to get that than the 10 percent.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You are insinuating it. If they want to ask for a full budget, they can. You understand they weren’t just talking about salary. The schools are a shit show right now. Kids refusing to do work, skipping school, taking and dealing drugs, fights everyday. Dealing with Pushy “stakeholders” Or do you also deal with that in your cushy office job.

I am in favor of raising teacher salaries but I can't imagine that will solve these issues or help that much to retain teachers. At a certain point working conditions are just too bad for pay to be enough to retain people.

It won't affect teachers who are vested I don't think (10 years+). But I think we might have a revolving door of new educators for a while until they actually provide effective guidance and protocols - instead of letting things become a free-for-all. Kids need guidance - all of them. The lax policies as of late are setting everyone up for failure right now. It isn't a zero-sum game. You can still provide consequences without traumatizing individuals or populations. MCPS just needs to put actual effort in - not pass it off to a contractor (looking at whoever pushed the green light on Leader in Me -how tone deaf is our dear leadership - you don't need to look far). I don't know what their deal is, but they sure as hell aren't listening. I don't think the council should fully fund just because MCEA says so - absolutely not. BUT.... I do think MCPS needs a ton more accountability like NOW. Preferably from an outside MoCo organization. I think the school system absolutely is NOT effective in its approach toward most of the students right now. Is MCPS destined for doom? No...but it absolutely could be a lot better if there was appropriate oversight.

Anonymous wrote:I dont think anyone here said they should "shut up and be happy"

I think the point was Moco isnt Arkansas or some Red State who doesnt pay their teachers anything.

They get a professional, middle class salary, that is higher than most incomes in the county.

And it's up to the teachers to decide whether it's adequate compensation, and if it isn't adequate compensation, whether they should look for a different job (or retire).

And if enough teachers decide it isn't adequate compensation and they should look for a different job (or retire), that will be a problem for everyone.