Anonymous
04/11/2023 13:50
Subject: Re:What is the taboo in 2023 about an unmarried, couple in a committed relationship having kids
Anonymous wrote:Women = marriage to getting his money and if you are not getting his money you are a fool.
Women think men who sign a document that gives you his money = commitment.
I am not so sure that survived the 1970s. The woman is likely to earn more in 2023.
Anonymous
04/11/2023 13:48
Subject: Re:What is the taboo in 2023 about an unmarried, couple in a committed relationship having kids
Women = marriage to getting his money and if you are not getting his money you are a fool.
Women think men who sign a document that gives you his money = commitment.
Women think men who sign a document that gives you his money = commitment.
Anonymous
04/11/2023 13:47
Subject: What is the taboo in 2023 about an unmarried, couple in a committed relationship having kids
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:It’s a class issue at this point. UMC and UC do not have children without getting married. A married couple invests their assets in their children (education, activities, healthcare).
Marriage is the driving force on inequity between classes. This is written about all the time. Smart, wealthy people know this and capitalize on it.
Interesting. I have younger cousins from my childhood in the Midwest now marrying at 19-24. If the average DCUMer met these people, they’d regard them as poor country bumpkins. Some of them are in or finished college, and some have opted out attending entirely, but they are far from alone among their social circles in marrying at that age. I’m 32 and many of my friends & coworkers aren’t married.
I personally think it has more to do with religiosity & political orientation than class.
Maybe this does not work for your cousins but there is certainly a trend that I have seen of UC children marrying either right out of college or by 24/25. I see this with Biglaw partners kids a lot now. I get invited to lots more weddings where the biglaw kid is young. Not sure why. Maybe because they can. Often both kids are from an elite college and both have elite jobs. Probably no student loans and cars and down payments from parents?
Anonymous
04/11/2023 13:47
Subject: What is the taboo in 2023 about an unmarried, couple in a committed relationship having kids
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Depends on your social circles, OP.
Why? In other countries there is Z E R O taboo to being unmarried & parenting even for rich & UMC people.
Everyone has explained this to you.
Anonymous
04/11/2023 13:46
Subject: What is the taboo in 2023 about an unmarried, couple in a committed relationship having kids
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:It’s a class issue at this point. UMC and UC do not have children without getting married. A married couple invests their assets in their children (education, activities, healthcare).
Marriage is the driving force on inequity between classes. This is written about all the time. Smart, wealthy people know this and capitalize on it.
Interesting. I have younger cousins from my childhood in the Midwest now marrying at 19-24. If the average DCUMer met these people, they’d regard them as poor country bumpkins. Some of them are in or finished college, and some have opted out attending entirely, but they are far from alone among their social circles in marrying at that age. I’m 32 and many of my friends & coworkers aren’t married.
I personally think it has more to do with religiosity & political orientation than class.
Both can be true. Country bumpkins also have wealth aspirations and religious or cultural imperatives.
Anonymous
04/11/2023 13:46
Subject: What is the taboo in 2023 about an unmarried, couple in a committed relationship having kids
Anonymous wrote:Depends on your social circles, OP.
Why? In other countries there is Z E R O taboo to being unmarried & parenting even for rich & UMC people.
Anonymous
04/11/2023 13:45
Subject: What is the taboo in 2023 about an unmarried, couple in a committed relationship having kids
Depends on your social circles, OP.
Anonymous
04/11/2023 13:36
Subject: What is the taboo in 2023 about an unmarried, couple in a committed relationship having kids
Anonymous wrote:It’s a class issue at this point. UMC and UC do not have children without getting married. A married couple invests their assets in their children (education, activities, healthcare).
Marriage is the driving force on inequity between classes. This is written about all the time. Smart, wealthy people know this and capitalize on it.
Interesting. I have younger cousins from my childhood in the Midwest now marrying at 19-24. If the average DCUMer met these people, they’d regard them as poor country bumpkins. Some of them are in or finished college, and some have opted out attending entirely, but they are far from alone among their social circles in marrying at that age. I’m 32 and many of my friends & coworkers aren’t married.
I personally think it has more to do with religiosity & political orientation than class.
Anonymous
04/11/2023 13:35
Subject: What is the taboo in 2023 about an unmarried, couple in a committed relationship having kids
Anonymous wrote:It’s a class issue at this point. UMC and UC do not have children without getting married. A married couple invests their assets in their children (education, activities, healthcare).
Marriage is the driving force on inequity between classes. This is written about all the time. Smart, wealthy people know this and capitalize on it.
I agree with PPs. You can do what you want and I do not think people judge or judge too harshly. For those that it works for --- great. You do have more rights if married and there is a breakup --- even in the few states that recognize common law marriage.
But PPs point above is worth pausing on. UMC and UC are not doing this -- why? Because it does not make long term financial sense. UMC and UC also get divorced at a much much lower rate than others. Again, why -- because marriage while hopefully filled with love, sex, and kids is a long term business transaction.
Anonymous
04/11/2023 13:19
Subject: Re:What is the taboo in 2023 about an unmarried, couple in a committed relationship having kids
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Go for it if you want. The reason this is extraordinary uncommon among women who are college-educated isn't that it's stigmatized, it's that you're likely to be stuck in the same position most women are - doing most of the domestic labor, harming your earning potential - but with more likelihood the guy will leave and fewer protections if he does. It's just not a great deal for the woman unless she's not going to need his economic support, which isn't most couples. In a different cultural and legal context, obviously this plays out differently.
Is this all we are summed up to be? Our earning potential?
What are you talking about? If you want to be able to focus on taking care of your kids and not solely maximizing your earnings so that you could be self sufficient if your partner left tomorrow, marriage gives you protections that living together does not.
Anonymous
04/11/2023 12:51
Subject: What is the taboo in 2023 about an unmarried, couple in a committed relationship having kids
Anonymous wrote:Think a couple that lives together & probably has for an awhile. This arrangement is very common in several European countries. So why the taboo?[/quote]
Did you time travel back from the 50's? Because nobody cares in 2023!
Anonymous
04/11/2023 12:49
Subject: What is the taboo in 2023 about an unmarried, couple in a committed relationship having kids
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I suggested to my wife we not get married due to the tax penalty (we ended up paying $20k more per year!) and she was hearing none of that. She was like well then we're paying it. Luckily, god bless President Trump, he eliminated that penalty for pretty much everyone - probably the single biggest pro-family political action ever taken
I thought the tax code incentivized marriage?
Generally only if one spouse doesn't work.
Yup. When DH and I were both in biglaw we were paying many tens of thousands of marriage penalty. I think the first year was $50k and it went up from there.
+1. This is why my partner and I are not married . We've been together 36 yrs and have 4 kids. We started dating in HS. By the time we were around marrying age we were focused on our careers. It just wasn't something that ever mattered to either one of us so no one was pushing for it. Each year I still run the numbers for both of us filing single vs filing as a married couple. I can't remember that the last time that filing married made sense financially. When I look at the holistic family financial picture paying more in taxes just doesn't make sense. Since both of us work we each have our own health insurance and we both will get social security. We have POA, adv directives, and we are the beneficiaries on our retirement accounts.
We've talked about getting married when we retire if it makes sense financially or if there is a medical need for us to marry--like having the ability to make decisions for the other. But on the other hand, I know people who are divorcing in their 80s as one person enters a nursing home so that the person that is still able to function on their own doesn't end up with no money by the time they need assistance.
Most people don't know we're not legally married. If anyone is talking about it behind my back, I'm not aware of it.
Yes I've heard of this too. It's usually women who are left without funds after their accounts were drained for their husband's care. Gray divorce for financial reasons is a real thing.
Anonymous
04/11/2023 12:43
Subject: What is the taboo in 2023 about an unmarried, couple in a committed relationship having kids
If you're doing this and one partner dies, the household gets half the social security benefit it would have gotten had the parents been married. For some people, esp while raising kids, that is a big deal.
Anonymous
04/11/2023 12:39
Subject: Re:What is the taboo in 2023 about an unmarried, couple in a committed relationship having kids
This is us. Together 20+ years, UMC, parents. It’s fine.
Anonymous
04/11/2023 12:33
Subject: What is the taboo in 2023 about an unmarried, couple in a committed relationship having kids
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I suggested to my wife we not get married due to the tax penalty (we ended up paying $20k more per year!) and she was hearing none of that. She was like well then we're paying it. Luckily, god bless President Trump, he eliminated that penalty for pretty much everyone - probably the single biggest pro-family political action ever taken
I thought the tax code incentivized marriage?
Generally only if one spouse doesn't work.
Yup. When DH and I were both in biglaw we were paying many tens of thousands of marriage penalty. I think the first year was $50k and it went up from there.
+1. This is why my partner and I are not married . We've been together 36 yrs and have 4 kids. We started dating in HS. By the time we were around marrying age we were focused on our careers. It just wasn't something that ever mattered to either one of us so no one was pushing for it. Each year I still run the numbers for both of us filing single vs filing as a married couple. I can't remember that the last time that filing married made sense financially. When I look at the holistic family financial picture paying more in taxes just doesn't make sense. Since both of us work we each have our own health insurance and we both will get social security. We have POA, adv directives, and we are the beneficiaries on our retirement accounts.
We've talked about getting married when we retire if it makes sense financially or if there is a medical need for us to marry--like having the ability to make decisions for the other. But on the other hand, I know people who are divorcing in their 80s as one person enters a nursing home so that the person that is still able to function on their own doesn't end up with no money by the time they need assistance.
Most people don't know we're not legally married. If anyone is talking about it behind my back, I'm not aware of it.
Wow. This is utterly fascinating to me. Whatever works for you!