Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At what point will people finally admit college is overpriced and stop paying?

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ivy-league-tuition-90000-per-year-prices-just-keep-going-up/

And before you try to claim that that is just sticker price and no one actually pays that amount, many families actually do have to pay gargantuan college costs because they make slightly too much to qualify for the bulk of financial aid, yet aren't rich enough to afford it in cash. The ROI is dwindling every single year when much of this knowledge can be learned at community colleges, online for free or for a fraction of the cost, and you can checkout books for free from a local library. The median HHI the US is $71k, yet college fees are now exceeding the entire yearly HHI. Patently absurd. But at least the kids get country club level amenities and tons of admins make 6 figure salaries. Interest rates have been rising due to the central bank, so students taking out loans to pay for this disaster will be kneecapped for even longer. Such a terrible ROI.

It stops when people stop having the government pay a lot of the bill.

For publics, the government “pays a lot of the bill,” I’m assuming you mean in the form of student loans, because states have stopped properly funding their universities. So, loans it is for a lot of people. Either way, the government is footing the bill.

Almost all the privates??

Anonymous wrote:At what point will people finally admit college is overpriced and stop paying?

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ivy-league-tuition-90000-per-year-prices-just-keep-going-up/

And before you try to claim that that is just sticker price and no one actually pays that amount, many families actually do have to pay gargantuan college costs because they make slightly too much to qualify for the bulk of financial aid, yet aren't rich enough to afford it in cash. The ROI is dwindling every single year when much of this knowledge can be learned at community colleges, online for free or for a fraction of the cost, and you can checkout books for free from a local library. The median HHI the US is $71k, yet college fees are now exceeding the entire yearly HHI. Patently absurd. But at least the kids get country club level amenities and tons of admins make 6 figure salaries. Interest rates have been rising due to the central bank, so students taking out loans to pay for this disaster will be kneecapped for even longer. Such a terrible ROI.

It stops when people stop having the government pay a lot of the bill.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's compare Big10 Conference schools Cost of Attendance, Salary upon graduation etc.

https://www.collegetuitioncompare.com/best-schools/big-ten-conference/#:~:text=The%20average%20undergraduate%20tuition%20%26%20fees,the%20academic%20year%202022%2D2023.

PP here: a further look at room and board should be considered with each of these.

+1
I just did the abbreviated NPC for UIUC this week and for an in-state kid, Grainger Engineering, the full cost was $40k, no financial aid for a middle class family of 3.

So if you have not been able to save enough, there is NIU that has engineering/CS and tuition is almost 10K less. It's up to your family to decide which is better. There are options that are more affordable.

Which is dramatically less prestigious than UIUC. Nothing meritocratic about that paradigm whatsoever, but the facade of it is funny.

obviously UIUC is "more prestigious". If you deem that prestige worth the extra $10K (in loans or out of your pocket so that you are not saving that for retirement during the college years), then you are free to pay it. That is your choice. But you are making it seem like there are not affordable options for kids, and that is incorrect. They exist, you just want a "luxury" product that you cannot afford. Which is a bit silly, since for CS/Engineering, it does not really matter where you go for undergrad. If you maintain a good GPA and finish the degree, your kid will find a good job.
So you can decide if spending that extra $10K per year is worth it or not. If it is, you can sign for parental loans and put your kid thru UIUC.

The reality is that it is embarrassing for families to send their kids to Northern Illinois University or similar. I am NOT saying that feeling is valid, but it exists. It’s hard to show up for college t-shirt day on 5/1 wearing a shirt of a college that “dumb” kids go to. Again I’m just stating what my students have told me over the years. I’m not really sure how to change these perceptions.

NYU freshmen mostly live in triples.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"But at least the kids get country club level amenities and tons of admins make 6 figure salaries. Interest rates have been rising due to the central bank, so students taking out loans to pay for this disaster will be kneecapped for even longer. Such a terrible ROI."

The most expensive elite schools/most selective schools do not offer country club amenities. I went to HSYP and lived in an actual mobile home village they set up on campus. My frosh dorm was made of cinderblocks and had those windows that swing out as the only source of fresh air. No AC. Very simple cafeteria food.

In the 1600's??

Old schools old buildings.
No, there is no central air conditioning at the Columbia dorms. The new-ish Barnard dorm does feature it.
The old McKim Mead White buildings are beautiful outside but poky to live in.
There are a few dorms on campus with painted cinderblock interior built pre-1990.

The clerical unions at these colleges are strong, and the number of admins is ridiculous.
Yale has more administrative staff and faculty than students.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's compare Big10 Conference schools Cost of Attendance, Salary upon graduation etc.

https://www.collegetuitioncompare.com/best-schools/big-ten-conference/#:~:text=The%20average%20undergraduate%20tuition%20%26%20fees,the%20academic%20year%202022%2D2023.

PP here: a further look at room and board should be considered with each of these.

+1
I just did the abbreviated NPC for UIUC this week and for an in-state kid, Grainger Engineering, the full cost was $40k, no financial aid for a middle class family of 3.

So if you have not been able to save enough, there is NIU that has engineering/CS and tuition is almost 10K less. It's up to your family to decide which is better. There are options that are more affordable.

Which is dramatically less prestigious than UIUC. Nothing meritocratic about that paradigm whatsoever, but the facade of it is funny.

obviously UIUC is "more prestigious". If you deem that prestige worth the extra $10K (in loans or out of your pocket so that you are not saving that for retirement during the college years), then you are free to pay it. That is your choice. But you are making it seem like there are not affordable options for kids, and that is incorrect. They exist, you just want a "luxury" product that you cannot afford. Which is a bit silly, since for CS/Engineering, it does not really matter where you go for undergrad. If you maintain a good GPA and finish the degree, your kid will find a good job.
So you can decide if spending that extra $10K per year is worth it or not. If it is, you can sign for parental loans and put your kid thru UIUC.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's compare Big10 Conference schools Cost of Attendance, Salary upon graduation etc.

https://www.collegetuitioncompare.com/best-schools/big-ten-conference/#:~:text=The%20average%20undergraduate%20tuition%20%26%20fees,the%20academic%20year%202022%2D2023.

PP here: a further look at room and board should be considered with each of these.

+1
I just did the abbreviated NPC for UIUC this week and for an in-state kid, Grainger Engineering, the full cost was $40k, no financial aid for a middle class family of 3.

So if you have not been able to save enough, there is NIU that has engineering/CS and tuition is almost 10K less. It's up to your family to decide which is better. There are options that are more affordable.

Which is dramatically less prestigious than UIUC. Nothing meritocratic about that paradigm whatsoever, but the facade of it is funny.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's compare Big10 Conference schools Cost of Attendance, Salary upon graduation etc.

https://www.collegetuitioncompare.com/best-schools/big-ten-conference/#:~:text=The%20average%20undergraduate%20tuition%20%26%20fees,the%20academic%20year%202022%2D2023.

PP here: a further look at room and board should be considered with each of these.

+1
I just did the abbreviated NPC for UIUC this week and for an in-state kid, Grainger Engineering, the full cost was $40k, no financial aid for a middle class family of 3.

So if you have not been able to save enough, there is NIU that has engineering/CS and tuition is almost 10K less. It's up to your family to decide which is better. There are options that are more affordable.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's compare Big10 Conference schools Cost of Attendance, Salary upon graduation etc.

https://www.collegetuitioncompare.com/best-schools/big-ten-conference/#:~:text=The%20average%20undergraduate%20tuition%20%26%20fees,the%20academic%20year%202022%2D2023.

PP here: a further look at room and board should be considered with each of these.

+1
I just did the abbreviated NPC for UIUC this week and for an in-state kid, Grainger Engineering, the full cost was $40k, no financial aid for a middle class family of 3.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don’t go to a college that costs $90k/year. Or $50k/year.

Lack of empathy.

I’m not shedding any tears for a family making $300k/year. They can easily afford any public university.

Not about parents, kids don't have control over their finances, they just get penalized for parental finances.

This. It's not about the parents. It's the kids.
Though your assumption that people making combined $300K have much, if any, ability to save for $90K/year tuition is laughable. But, your lack of empathy is ignorant and rude.

At that income we could easily do it. However the expectation is to save starting at birth. We saved enough for a state school and graduate school. We live in a tiny fixer upper in a lower cost area. We trarely vacation, shop clearance, etc.

yes at that income, most are able to save if they truly feel the need to send their kids to an "elite" school. You start saving at birth. It's not a lack of empathy--it's a lack of understanding on your part that you somehow seem "entitled" to a luxury good if you haven't made the effort to save. Your kid can still get an excellent education, and it would be smartest if they attend somewhere you can afford (ie don't go into major debt). If you have saved even for $40-50K/year, with a 300K income, you could cash flow while they are in college if it's that important to you. IMO, I wouldn't recommend that, I'd find somewhere that is only 40-50K and spend wisely. If you can't afford something, you don't do it. But making 300K puts you in the top 2-4% of the country.

We began saving for our kids education when we only made $125K and we prepared before having kids so we had paid off our own student loans and had 20% for a mortgage and bought a house we could actually afford (ie. still continue to save $$$ for retirement, vacations, future college, cars, etc). Our kids were 5-8 before we made more than $200K, yet we were well on track for "elite" colleges should we choose to do that.

Anonymous wrote:No.

It is the high price that makes it worthwhile.

As you say, knowledge is free. Between the internet and the library you can access pretty much everything for zero cost. That is not what college is about.

It is a) a signal to employers that you had a good enough combination of intelligence, money and background to be admitted, and b) it is about the contacts you make there.

The contacts you make in place that charges $100 k a year are going to be far wealthier, and therefore far likelier to succeed, because they have every advantage already, than the contacts you will make in a place that charges $10k a year.

It is simply a way for the elites to perpetuate themselves. Nothing to do with education.

And let's not pretend we don't love it for that very reason. I don't know how my kids would fare if they were born into a working class family in West Virginia or Detroit. And, thanks to the US plutocratic system, I am never going to have to find out.

Facts.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"But at least the kids get country club level amenities and tons of admins make 6 figure salaries. Interest rates have been rising due to the central bank, so students taking out loans to pay for this disaster will be kneecapped for even longer. Such a terrible ROI."

The most expensive elite schools/most selective schools do not offer country club amenities. I went to HSYP and lived in an actual mobile home village they set up on campus. My frosh dorm was made of cinderblocks and had those windows that swing out as the only source of fresh air. No AC. Very simple cafeteria food.

In the 1600's??

None of the Ivys have AC. Columbia had 8 rooms with it in 2018. That was the most.

https://medium.com/@sammyhthomas/ivy-league-schools-are-worth-billions-but-often-dont-have-ac-with-global-warming-that-s-an-8873321da4dd

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don’t go to a college that costs $90k/year. Or $50k/year.

Lack of empathy.

I’m not shedding any tears for a family making $300k/year. They can easily afford any public university.

Not about parents, kids don't have control over their finances, they just get penalized for parental finances.

This. It's not about the parents. It's the kids.
Though your assumption that people making combined $300K have much, if any, ability to save for $90K/year tuition is laughable. But, your lack of empathy is ignorant and rude.

At that income we could easily do it. However the expectation is to save starting at birth. We saved enough for a state school and graduate school. We live in a tiny fixer upper in a lower cost area. We trarely vacation, shop clearance, etc.

That’s why our kids will go to a state school we can afford. Simple.