Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's honestly really hard to gauge how other people are doing financially. There's their income, which you could guess at pretty easily, and their housing costs, which you can also probably guess at pretty easily.

But there are all these other factors. Student loan debt, family money, whether they are needing to support other family members in some way, what kinds of other help they get from family (like grandparents paying for private school, or funding down payments, or maxing out annual gifts), there might be health expenses you can't possibly know about. It can go one way or the other and you just have no idea.

And it's psychological, too. I have some friends who I would assume are very well off -- Big Law partner at a firm where I know what that means in terms of income. They live in a big house in a very pricy neighborhood. But they probably talk about "affording things" more than any of my other friends. They do not take a lot of vacations and the ones they take often aren't particularly extravagant. They do spend money on cars but nothing insane for what I know their income must be. I honestly don't know if maybe they have other expenses that are putting pressure on them, or potentially they are just the sort of people who stress about money a lot. Both grew up UMC but that doesn't mean they didn't grow up without money stress (UMC people can get laid off, their businesses run into rough patches, they have unanticipated medical expenses, etc.).

Meanwhile, we have other friends who might seem overextended from the outside (both of student debt, bought a house even they admitted at the time was more than they could afford, working for government or NGOs where income can never go that high) and they take two foreign vacations a year, always have new everything, and never express any money concerns. Are they just good with money, have secret sources of money we don't know about, or just chill people who don't talk about it publicly? Could be any of the above or something else I haven't thought of.

Which is why you can't compare yourself to other people on this point. You just don't know. Keep your head down and focus on your own finances. Look for advice from neutral resources, not your peers. Their situation is unlikely to be as similar to yours as you might think.

Don't assume govt workers only live off their salaries. I now plenty who work for the govt because they believe in the mission or need something to do and not necessarily for the paycheck. Also, govt employees who put in 20 plus years will receive cushy pensions, healthcare subsidies, etc....they can spend more while working, take more risks with investments aware they have a safety net.

Anonymous wrote:It's honestly really hard to gauge how other people are doing financially. There's their income, which you could guess at pretty easily, and their housing costs, which you can also probably guess at pretty easily.

But there are all these other factors. Student loan debt, family money, whether they are needing to support other family members in some way, what kinds of other help they get from family (like grandparents paying for private school, or funding down payments, or maxing out annual gifts), there might be health expenses you can't possibly know about. It can go one way or the other and you just have no idea.

And it's psychological, too. I have some friends who I would assume are very well off -- Big Law partner at a firm where I know what that means in terms of income. They live in a big house in a very pricy neighborhood. But they probably talk about "affording things" more than any of my other friends. They do not take a lot of vacations and the ones they take often aren't particularly extravagant. They do spend money on cars but nothing insane for what I know their income must be. I honestly don't know if maybe they have other expenses that are putting pressure on them, or potentially they are just the sort of people who stress about money a lot. Both grew up UMC but that doesn't mean they didn't grow up without money stress (UMC people can get laid off, their businesses run into rough patches, they have unanticipated medical expenses, etc.).

Meanwhile, we have other friends who might seem overextended from the outside (both of student debt, bought a house even they admitted at the time was more than they could afford, working for government or NGOs where income can never go that high) and they take two foreign vacations a year, always have new everything, and never express any money concerns. Are they just good with money, have secret sources of money we don't know about, or just chill people who don't talk about it publicly? Could be any of the above or something else I haven't thought of.

Which is why you can't compare yourself to other people on this point. You just don't know. Keep your head down and focus on your own finances. Look for advice from neutral resources, not your peers. Their situation is unlikely to be as similar to yours as you might think.

Anonymous wrote:I live in Arlington in a neighborhood of $1-1.5M homes. Some people drive fancier cars, take fancier vacations, or choose more expensive camps. I can only think of one family who I am 90% sure lives beyond their means - and that’s only because the husband is a cop and the wife works part time. I assume her parents paid for their house or a good portion of it.

Some people bought in 2012-2015 and paid $550k and some people bought in 2020-22 and paid $1M+. Presumably the late buyers have higher incomes that those of us in the middle. When kids start applying to college I’m sure differences will surface.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, I don’t think a good portion of people who seem to be doing well really aren’t. This is what people who don’t have a decent money like to think. From what I cans see, it’s just not true. Maybe they have a bad year and don’t go skiing in vail one year, but they still go away for a big summer and spring break trip.

I see people mention that a lot (mostly on this board) and use the term house poor but its like a comfort to assume others are in a bigger nicer home because of a bad choice that will not end well. Therefore, you are actually in the smarter position long run. I think it's a common sentiment/salve in neighborhoods with a wild mix of housing (teardowns to modern luxury). I think in established multi million neighborhoods people don't second guess wealth as much.

Eh, maybe some people feel that way, but I think it's that most people just know a few people who really are living beyond their means (usually family members or friends where you know the real situation and see how the house of cards is built) and want to caution others who ask about their finances on a forum. I'll caution people on this forum who ask about whether they can afford a house that's at their limit that they don't want to be "house poor" because I've known actual people in that situation and it sucks for them. But I don't go around thinking about other people's finances if they're not asking on a forum.

I do think though there's a certain genre of these popular personal finance gurus like Dave Ramsey whose schtick is to try to create a sense that other people are living beyond their means and by taking his advice you're one of the select few who is not. I've seen that sometimes gets echoed in advice here not realizing that a lot of his audience are people who are in circles where everyone has a lot of cc debt and not a lot of money. He --and other gurus of that type--I think do appeal to people who get comfort by thinking that others are somehow deluded and they are not. They don't realize that they are overgeneralizing when they see people who have a high income, high net worth, can afford their spending and use low interest rate debt strategically. It doesn't fit into their gurus "rules" so they assume they are one of the deluded types he rails against.

Anonymous wrote:UMC has $100,000 of credit card debt??

yikes

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's honestly really hard to gauge how other people are doing financially. There's their income, which you could guess at pretty easily, and their housing costs, which you can also probably guess at pretty easily.

But there are all these other factors. Student loan debt, family money, whether they are needing to support other family members in some way, what kinds of other help they get from family (like grandparents paying for private school, or funding down payments, or maxing out annual gifts), there might be health expenses you can't possibly know about. It can go one way or the other and you just have no idea.

And it's psychological, too. I have some friends who I would assume are very well off -- Big Law partner at a firm where I know what that means in terms of income. They live in a big house in a very pricy neighborhood. But they probably talk about "affording things" more than any of my other friends. They do not take a lot of vacations and the ones they take often aren't particularly extravagant. They do spend money on cars but nothing insane for what I know their income must be. I honestly don't know if maybe they have other expenses that are putting pressure on them, or potentially they are just the sort of people who stress about money a lot. Both grew up UMC but that doesn't mean they didn't grow up without money stress (UMC people can get laid off, their businesses run into rough patches, they have unanticipated medical expenses, etc.).

Meanwhile, we have other friends who might seem overextended from the outside (both of student debt, bought a house even they admitted at the time was more than they could afford, working for government or NGOs where income can never go that high) and they take two foreign vacations a year, always have new everything, and never express any money concerns. Are they just good with money, have secret sources of money we don't know about, or just chill people who don't talk about it publicly? Could be any of the above or something else I haven't thought of.



Which is why you can't compare yourself to other people on this point. You just don't know. Keep your head down and focus on your own finances. Look for advice from neutral resources, not your peers. Their situation is unlikely to be as similar to yours as you might think.

DP, Agreed, for context, as immigrant Asians we have a frugal mentality. Our HHI is 600K, PITI is less than 3K, mid 40's, kids in public school.. ~$3M NW but we still stress about money. I am just the type of person who just stresses about the money. Even if our HHI was a $1M, it's just a personality trait

How do you have PITI under $3k! Do you live in Loudoun County?

DP but PITI of $3.2K and HHI of $400K and $3MM net worth. We refinanced to conforming mortgage that's 2.750% and originally put down 30% many years ago.