Anonymous wrote:Thank the boomers for destroying the USA standard of living

+1

Anonymous wrote:^^ yes but also they don't drive, don't have sex, talk/text with mommy all day long, and are much more infantile than we were. It is a weird time for adolescents, for sure.

I actually think they are more mature because they are able to choose when they are ready to have sex, when to drive without peer pressure to get the license 20 seconds after turning 16, and don't mind talking to parents. Since when is the rebellious and reckless child more mature that the kid who makes good decisions for themselves?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ll help you OP. It’s a freaking arms race of affluent parents making sure their kids are getting the BEST enrichments, tutoring, mentoring, internships, etc. I occasionally interview for my alma mater and times have CHANGED!

I participated in an engineering program at a local college for girls interested in STEM where we built balsa bridges and went on a tour of the water treatment plant. I have interviewed kids who placed at the Westinghouse science competition or have patents. Patents!
I worked at k-mart and Subway. I babysat. These kids intern at companies in the field they are pursuing.
I was president of the French club and 1st chair trumpet in concert band. These kids are establishing their own charity or leading the advocacy for some pet issue with their city/county/state government.

I was smart and hard working. I was the Tracy Flick of my HS - all the APs, all As, all the sports and clubs. Kids “these days” are accomplishing things at 15-17 that upperclassmen at my selective university were not doing when I was there. If kindergarten is the new 1st grade, I’d wager that 16 is the new 21. I always come away from interviews wondering - how the heck did I ever get in, how the heck will my kids ever have a chance.

DH is a physician currently doing interviews for residency. Every year he says how these applicants are amazing and how he wouldn’t even get an interview now. There are so many students with perfect everything. Perfect test scores. Perfect extracurriculars. Perfect research.

Suspect if some of us were in school now we would be doing just as well as our kids are doing. So I think the bar has risen....for all kids, including the high achieving kids. But the high achievers back in the 80s were the high achievers of that day.....

I think what's changed is there is greater expectation for more kids to take more rigorous classes. Back in the day, yes, there was a high achieving cohort but lots of kids who were fine students and expected to go to a good college didn't take APs. Their parents were fine with them just doing high school, even affluent/professional parents.

I went to an affluent LA suburb high school in the 80s. The school had a bunch of AP classes but in a school of about 2k students, 500 per grade, there were only about 30-40 kids in the honors and then AP classes (including me). There was only one section of each class so I took nearly all my classes with this one group of students, most of us the stereotypical nerds. The popular/party kids did not take honors/AP. I was talking about this with my DD who is a senior and tired of her crazy stressful HS where at least half of the school takes a lot of AP and that includes the popular/party crowd. She says she's realized this year just how many of them are coping with the stress by drinking or doing weed all weekend.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ll help you OP. It’s a freaking arms race of affluent parents making sure their kids are getting the BEST enrichments, tutoring, mentoring, internships, etc. I occasionally interview for my alma mater and times have CHANGED!

I participated in an engineering program at a local college for girls interested in STEM where we built balsa bridges and went on a tour of the water treatment plant. I have interviewed kids who placed at the Westinghouse science competition or have patents. Patents!
I worked at k-mart and Subway. I babysat. These kids intern at companies in the field they are pursuing.
I was president of the French club and 1st chair trumpet in concert band. These kids are establishing their own charity or leading the advocacy for some pet issue with their city/county/state government.

I was smart and hard working. I was the Tracy Flick of my HS - all the APs, all As, all the sports and clubs. Kids “these days” are accomplishing things at 15-17 that upperclassmen at my selective university were not doing when I was there. If kindergarten is the new 1st grade, I’d wager that 16 is the new 21. I always come away from interviews wondering - how the heck did I ever get in, how the heck will my kids ever have a chance.

DH is a physician currently doing interviews for residency. Every year he says how these applicants are amazing and how he wouldn’t even get an interview now. There are so many students with perfect everything. Perfect test scores. Perfect extracurriculars. Perfect research.

Suspect if some of us were in school now we would be doing just as well as our kids are doing. So I think the bar has risen....for all kids, including the high achieving kids. But the high achievers back in the 80s were the high achievers of that day.....

Anonymous wrote:Bigger pool of applicants?

Both domestic and foreign...

I just talked to a 90s Yale grad whose child just graduated from Yale (kid is a asian, female, very high achieving but no spectacular standout stuff, no big money or connections).

Anonymous wrote:It's that more poorer kids shoot their shot now. It's not just the playground for the elites anymore.

Look, when you have all the colleges racing to say how many more URMs and First Gens they can get---up to 70% designated as URMs accepted--its not just that they are shooting their shot--it's that the net is wide open and has a magnet while closed for others.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ll help you OP. It’s a freaking arms race of affluent parents making sure their kids are getting the BEST enrichments, tutoring, mentoring, internships, etc. I occasionally interview for my alma mater and times have CHANGED!

I participated in an engineering program at a local college for girls interested in STEM where we built balsa bridges and went on a tour of the water treatment plant. I have interviewed kids who placed at the Westinghouse science competition or have patents. Patents!
I worked at k-mart and Subway. I babysat. These kids intern at companies in the field they are pursuing.
I was president of the French club and 1st chair trumpet in concert band. These kids are establishing their own charity or leading the advocacy for some pet issue with their city/county/state government.

I was smart and hard working. I was the Tracy Flick of my HS - all the APs, all As, all the sports and clubs. Kids “these days” are accomplishing things at 15-17 that upperclassmen at my selective university were not doing when I was there. If kindergarten is the new 1st grade, I’d wager that 16 is the new 21. I always come away from interviews wondering - how the heck did I ever get in, how the heck will my kids ever have a chance.

DH is a physician currently doing interviews for residency. Every year he says how these applicants are amazing and how he wouldn’t even get an interview now. There are so many students with perfect everything. Perfect test scores. Perfect extracurriculars. Perfect research.

I have a niece that finished her residency at Hopkins Med and has been working there for a few years. I constantly hear from her and other doctors I know that the batch of students coming out of med school these days are ridiculously unqualified. They are not the brightest. I have heard the same thing form professors. Kids in the last 5 years may have more stuff on their college apps and resumes that seem to look impressive, but the meat isn't there.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ll help you OP. It’s a freaking arms race of affluent parents making sure their kids are getting the BEST enrichments, tutoring, mentoring, internships, etc. I occasionally interview for my alma mater and times have CHANGED!

I participated in an engineering program at a local college for girls interested in STEM where we built balsa bridges and went on a tour of the water treatment plant. I have interviewed kids who placed at the Westinghouse science competition or have patents. Patents!
I worked at k-mart and Subway. I babysat. These kids intern at companies in the field they are pursuing.
I was president of the French club and 1st chair trumpet in concert band. These kids are establishing their own charity or leading the advocacy for some pet issue with their city/county/state government.

I was smart and hard working. I was the Tracy Flick of my HS - all the APs, all As, all the sports and clubs. Kids “these days” are accomplishing things at 15-17 that upperclassmen at my selective university were not doing when I was there. If kindergarten is the new 1st grade, I’d wager that 16 is the new 21. I always come away from interviews wondering - how the heck did I ever get in, how the heck will my kids ever have a chance.

+1

This is so true. I think many parents today, not knowing what it took (then moreso than now) are entitled. That is how the Varsity Blues, and the like, came about. Those who have millions, donate millions - even if their kid is mediocre, in most ways.

I do not think that grade inflation is as much of an issue as DCUM PP's like to think it is. But there are many good students who know what it takes to do well. This, coming from a DCUM-approved school pyramid.

Most colleges want "diversity" - so many traditional students are getting bumped out of potential spots. That, and as other PP stated, international students from other countries are usually full pay, and that adds to both "diversity" and the bottom line, for colleges, which have become a business.

In short, there are simply too many applicants, OP.

Parents are also desperate because the standard of living they reasonably expected to attain based on the economic circumstances of our own childhoods is far more difficult for our children to attain given wage stagnation.

Exactly. All this supposedly high level academic attainment is just the high school version of the 2nd grade science project. The adults determine the project & how it will be presented (kid agrees & follows directions). The flashier the better, the more connected the parent, the better. Those HS science winners are not genius outliers, they are participating in well oiled competitions, carefully laid out & mentored by the district, put up to it by competitive parents & peer pressure.

It's that more poorer kids shoot their shot now. It's not just the playground for the elites anymore.

Anonymous wrote:I’ll help you OP. It’s a freaking arms race of affluent parents making sure their kids are getting the BEST enrichments, tutoring, mentoring, internships, etc. I occasionally interview for my alma mater and times have CHANGED!

I participated in an engineering program at a local college for girls interested in STEM where we built balsa bridges and went on a tour of the water treatment plant. I have interviewed kids who placed at the Westinghouse science competition or have patents. Patents!
I worked at k-mart and Subway. I babysat. These kids intern at companies in the field they are pursuing.
I was president of the French club and 1st chair trumpet in concert band. These kids are establishing their own charity or leading the advocacy for some pet issue with their city/county/state government.

I was smart and hard working. I was the Tracy Flick of my HS - all the APs, all As, all the sports and clubs. Kids “these days” are accomplishing things at 15-17 that upperclassmen at my selective university were not doing when I was there. If kindergarten is the new 1st grade, I’d wager that 16 is the new 21. I always come away from interviews wondering - how the heck did I ever get in, how the heck will my kids ever have a chance.

This post unfortunately highlights many of the "tricks" that kids (for the most part wealthy) can employ to amp their application.

Honestly, getting a patent is easier than you might think...especially if you are getting a business process patent or other patent that takes no real discovery. The hardest part is just knowing to do it in the first place and having the money to smooth the process for you.

The "fake" charity is another great trick. The kid barely does anything as the adults set up the charity for them, and no surprise...the charity disappears once the kid goes to college. Not sure if AO's see through these things or not.

For the record...you are dating yourself. The Westinghouse competition has gone through 3 different hands and is now known as the Regeneron contest. A relatively small number of kids enter Regeneron (I think only like 2,000) each year, with the numbers drastically skewed towards the STEM magnet HSs. As an example, TJ probably has 20 kids enter each year (and Blair has large numbers as well). My kid looked into it and Regeneron actually imposes a number of administrative burdens to enter which makes it difficult to enter if your HS is not willing to assist in creating the various school committees they require. The Magnet schools have the entire institutional framework established, and connections with mentors. This definitely makes it easier.

Other kids set up their own companies (you can do that in less than 10 minutes) and the internships are usually through personal connections. The list goes on.

Anonymous wrote:I’ll help you OP. It’s a freaking arms race of affluent parents making sure their kids are getting the BEST enrichments, tutoring, mentoring, internships, etc. I occasionally interview for my alma mater and times have CHANGED!

I participated in an engineering program at a local college for girls interested in STEM where we built balsa bridges and went on a tour of the water treatment plant. I have interviewed kids who placed at the Westinghouse science competition or have patents. Patents!
I worked at k-mart and Subway. I babysat. These kids intern at companies in the field they are pursuing.
I was president of the French club and 1st chair trumpet in concert band. These kids are establishing their own charity or leading the advocacy for some pet issue with their city/county/state government.

I was smart and hard working. I was the Tracy Flick of my HS - all the APs, all As, all the sports and clubs. Kids “these days” are accomplishing things at 15-17 that upperclassmen at my selective university were not doing when I was there. If kindergarten is the new 1st grade, I’d wager that 16 is the new 21. I always come away from interviews wondering - how the heck did I ever get in, how the heck will my kids ever have a chance.

+1

This is so true. I think many parents today, not knowing what it took (then moreso than now) are entitled. That is how the Varsity Blues, and the like, came about. Those who have millions, donate millions - even if their kid is mediocre, in most ways.

I do not think that grade inflation is as much of an issue as DCUM PP's like to think it is. But there are many good students who know what it takes to do well. This, coming from a DCUM-approved school pyramid.

Most colleges want "diversity" - so many traditional students are getting bumped out of potential spots. That, and as other PP stated, international students from other countries are usually full pay, and that adds to both "diversity" and the bottom line, for colleges, which have become a business.

In short, there are simply too many applicants, OP.

^^ yes but also they don't drive, don't have sex, talk/text with mommy all day long, and are much more infantile than we were. It is a weird time for adolescents, for sure.

Anonymous wrote:I’ll help you OP. It’s a freaking arms race of affluent parents making sure their kids are getting the BEST enrichments, tutoring, mentoring, internships, etc. I occasionally interview for my alma mater and times have CHANGED!

I participated in an engineering program at a local college for girls interested in STEM where we built balsa bridges and went on a tour of the water treatment plant. I have interviewed kids who placed at the Westinghouse science competition or have patents. Patents!
I worked at k-mart and Subway. I babysat. These kids intern at companies in the field they are pursuing.
I was president of the French club and 1st chair trumpet in concert band. These kids are establishing their own charity or leading the advocacy for some pet issue with their city/county/state government.

I was smart and hard working. I was the Tracy Flick of my HS - all the APs, all As, all the sports and clubs. Kids “these days” are accomplishing things at 15-17 that upperclassmen at my selective university were not doing when I was there. If kindergarten is the new 1st grade, I’d wager that 16 is the new 21. I always come away from interviews wondering - how the heck did I ever get in, how the heck will my kids ever have a chance.

DH is a physician currently doing interviews for residency. Every year he says how these applicants are amazing and how he wouldn’t even get an interview now. There are so many students with perfect everything. Perfect test scores. Perfect extracurriculars. Perfect research.