Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Undergrad prestige does NOT matter. At all. It’s been empirically proven. Smart kids do well anywhere, whether they’re at UMD or Stanford.

Dale and Kruger. Dale and Kruger. Dale and Kruger!!!

It does matter a lot. I know the research and simply do not buy it. The difference between UMD and Stanford is massive. Frankly the difference between UVA and UMD is massive and I am not a UVA fan. Simply put where you go (and how you do there) matters in terms of opening many pathways. Does that mean that if you go to UMD you have no chance? Of course not but there are less pathways to take you there. A smart kid will do well anywhere but may not have the same options depending on where you go.

What do you mean the difference between UVA and UMD is massive? For what? UMD's STEM programs are universally ranked higher than UVA and very well respected. And for the record, I attended neither school so have no dog in this fight.

I think PP is a UVA hater and tryng to mock UVA.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Undergrad prestige does NOT matter. At all. It’s been empirically proven. Smart kids do well anywhere, whether they’re at UMD or Stanford.

Dale and Kruger. Dale and Kruger. Dale and Kruger!!!

It does matter a lot. I know the research and simply do not buy it. The difference between UMD and Stanford is massive. Frankly the difference between UVA and UMD is massive and I am not a UVA fan. Simply put where you go (and how you do there) matters in terms of opening many pathways. Does that mean that if you go to UMD you have no chance? Of course not but there are less pathways to take you there. A smart kid will do well anywhere but may not have the same options depending on where you go.

What do you mean the difference between UVA and UMD is massive? For what? UMD's STEM programs are universally ranked higher than UVA and very well respected. And for the record, I attended neither school so have no dog in this fight.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think people who can't handle real majors are more obsessed with school name prestige

This is an important point that recognizes the changing needs of employers. Math, science, technology and other STEM majors are now the basis for securing many--maybe most--of the best post-college positions.

The best funded engineering & tech research schools are found at large universities.

Trend is toward specific majors.

This. Only people majoring in soft, useless fluff like History or Philosophy worry about HYP. The smart, competent kids major in CS and are fine going to state schools.

My very smart and competent DC knows that, due to a lack of interest, he would personally be miserable as a CS major or working as an engineer/technician. He is also wise enough to choose a major and profession that likely won't pay as well, but that affords a decent lifestyle AND provide personal enjoyment and fulfillment. I was in a profession that paid VERY well (big law), but was very unhappy. I took a huge pay cut to change careers and couldn't be happier with what I'm doing now - absolutely no regrets.

Yes your kid can not handle real majors

No, my kid is wise enough not to prioritize salary over happiness. He will be fine and very content never owning a luxury brand car. I feel sorry for people whose priority goal is securing the highest paying jon possible no matter what their real interests are.

Smart motivated competent kids major in challenging real majors and minor in something else interests them.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think people who can't handle real majors are more obsessed with school name prestige

This is an important point that recognizes the changing needs of employers. Math, science, technology and other STEM majors are now the basis for securing many--maybe most--of the best post-college positions.

The best funded engineering & tech research schools are found at large universities.

Trend is toward specific majors.

This. Only people majoring in soft, useless fluff like History or Philosophy worry about HYP. The smart, competent kids major in CS and are fine going to state schools.

My very smart and competent DC knows that, due to a lack of interest, he would personally be miserable as a CS major or working as an engineer/technician. He is also wise enough to choose a major and profession that likely won't pay as well, but that affords a decent lifestyle AND provide personal enjoyment and fulfillment. I was in a profession that paid VERY well (big law), but was very unhappy. I took a huge pay cut to change careers and couldn't be happier with what I'm doing now - absolutely no regrets.

Yes your kid can not handle real majors

No, my kid is wise enough not to prioritize salary over happiness. He will be fine and very content never owning a luxury brand car. I feel sorry for people whose priority goal is securing the highest paying job possible no matter what their real interests are.

+1 I dated a guy years ago who worked in finance. He hated his job and really wanted to be a landscape architect. His dad thought going to college to be a "gardener" was stupid so he majored in finance and was miserable. We broke up in part because I could see he was never going to stand up to his dad and just get more unhappy as life went on.

I don't doubt that prestige matters in some careers but neither of my kids (nor do DH and I) aspire to those career areas. And, for the most part, I don't think any prestige benefit would outweigh the debt required for elite schools. Not that it matters since my kids are solid students but were not going to be competitive for those kinds of schools. So, we focused on schools that had strengths in their desired majors, have good retention, graduation and employment rates and would fit our reasonable budget. They'll be fine.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think people who can't handle real majors are more obsessed with school name prestige

This is an important point that recognizes the changing needs of employers. Math, science, technology and other STEM majors are now the basis for securing many--maybe most--of the best post-college positions.

The best funded engineering & tech research schools are found at large universities.

Trend is toward specific majors.

This. Only people majoring in soft, useless fluff like History or Philosophy worry about HYP. The smart, competent kids major in CS and are fine going to state schools.

My very smart and competent DC knows that, due to a lack of interest, he would personally be miserable as a CS major or working as an engineer/technician. He is also wise enough to choose a major and profession that likely won't pay as well, but that affords a decent lifestyle AND provide personal enjoyment and fulfillment. I was in a profession that paid VERY well (big law), but was very unhappy. I took a huge pay cut to change careers and couldn't be happier with what I'm doing now - absolutely no regrets.

Yes your kid can not handle real majors

No, my kid is wise enough not to prioritize salary over happiness. He will be fine and very content never owning a luxury brand car. I feel sorry for people whose priority goal is securing the highest paying jon possible no matter what their real interests are.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think people who can't handle real majors are more obsessed with school name prestige

This is an important point that recognizes the changing needs of employers. Math, science, technology and other STEM majors are now the basis for securing many--maybe most--of the best post-college positions.

The best funded engineering & tech research schools are found at large universities.

Trend is toward specific majors.

This. Only people majoring in soft, useless fluff like History or Philosophy worry about HYP. The smart, competent kids major in CS and are fine going to state schools.

My very smart and competent DC knows that, due to a lack of interest, he would personally be miserable as a CS major or working as an engineer/technician. He is also wise enough to choose a major and profession that likely won't pay as well, but that affords a decent lifestyle AND provide personal enjoyment and fulfillment. I was in a profession that paid VERY well (big law), but was very unhappy. I took a huge pay cut to change careers and couldn't be happier with what I'm doing now - absolutely no regrets.

Yes your kid can not handle real majors

Anonymous wrote:I think people who can't handle real majors are more obsessed with school name prestige

True
Major (and then grad school) matters more than anything, really.

Anonymous wrote:Sure, but it also depends on career aspirations. 40% of VCs have a degree from Harvard or Stanford. If you want to make it big in finance or get funding for a tech startup, you have some advantages coming from an Ivy or school like Stanford, Duke, or MIT. If you want to be a software engineer or teacher, both fulfilling careers as well, the pedigree probably matters much less.

This is well said. Anyone can make it from anywhere but you increase the chances if you go to certain places.

Anonymous wrote:Undergrad prestige does NOT matter. At all. It’s been empirically proven. Smart kids do well anywhere, whether they’re at UMD or Stanford.

Dale and Kruger. Dale and Kruger. Dale and Kruger!!!

It does matter a lot. I know the research and simply do not buy it. The difference between UMD and Stanford is massive. Frankly the difference between UVA and UMD is massive and I am not a UVA fan. Simply put where you go (and how you do there) matters in terms of opening many pathways. Does that mean that if you go to UMD you have no chance? Of course not but there are less pathways to take you there. A smart kid will do well anywhere but may not have the same options depending on where you go.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Undergrad prestige does NOT matter. At all. It’s been empirically proven. Smart kids do well anywhere, whether they’re at UMD or Stanford.

Dale and Kruger. Dale and Kruger. Dale and Kruger!!!

UMD, perhaps, but what about Frostburg State vs. Stanford?

Take a look at where the CEOs of top US companies went.

https://lesshighschoolstress.com/business/

It's the individual that matters, not the college they attended.

Prestige schools are highly OVER-represented in business, law, finance, academia, so the college matters.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Undergrad prestige does NOT matter. At all. It’s been empirically proven. Smart kids do well anywhere, whether they’re at UMD or Stanford.

Dale and Kruger. Dale and Kruger. Dale and Kruger!!!

UMD, perhaps, but what about Frostburg State vs. Stanford?

Take a look at where the CEOs of top US companies went.

https://lesshighschoolstress.com/business/

It's the individual that matters, not the college they attended.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Undergrad prestige does NOT matter. At all. It’s been empirically proven. Smart kids do well anywhere, whether they’re at UMD or Stanford.

Dale and Kruger. Dale and Kruger. Dale and Kruger!!!

Where did Dale and Kruger go to school, choose to teach and then send their kids?

Irrelevant to the outcome of their empirically demonstrated, reproduced, peer-reviewed research.

The authors didn't even believe what they published. That seems relevant to me.

First, the decisions they made for themselves were made before the research was done.

Second, you have no idea why they chose to teach where they did.

And finally, you don't understand the research. Nothing in it implied or stated that elite colleges are harmful to outcomes. I don't know where their kids went, but if it was to elite schools, I'm confident they would have been just as happy if their kids didn't get in because they knew that the opportunities they had would have been the same.

Anonymous wrote:Sure, but it also depends on career aspirations. 40% of VCs have a degree from Harvard or Stanford. If you want to make it big in finance or get funding for a tech startup, you have some advantages coming from an Ivy or school like Stanford, Duke, or MIT. If you want to be a software engineer or teacher, both fulfilling careers as well, the pedigree probably matters much less.

If you've been following the news, you would know that SWE jobs depend on mercurial types like Elon Musk. When you've had enough, having an ivy degree to move on makes it that much easier.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Elite colleges & universities have earned their prestige by producing great results.

While exceptional individuals may rise above their circumstances, that is not justification for attending a lesser school in an environment that may make learning more difficult. It is important to be surrounded by motivated, hard-working, intelligent individuals in order to facilitate one's development. While not required and not a guarantee, the best one can do is strive for the best throughout all stages of life. Life does not come with guarantees so it is better to go with the odds that favor success.

And you really think there are not "peers"/"motivated, hard-working intelligent individuals" at a T40-80 school? That still exists, it may only be 30-40% of the students instead of 90% but it's there. And really someone who got a 1350 on their SAT is not really less smart than someone who got a 1550--both can be highly motivated hard working and excel in life. Just look around you at your job. Highly doubt you work with 100% T20 graduates. Some of the smartest co-workers likely went to State U/ schools outside even the T100.

You misrepresented what I wrote in my post.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think people who can't handle real majors are more obsessed with school name prestige

This is an important point that recognizes the changing needs of employers. Math, science, technology and other STEM majors are now the basis for securing many--maybe most--of the best post-college positions.

The best funded engineering & tech research schools are found at large universities.

Trend is toward specific majors.

This. Only people majoring in soft, useless fluff like History or Philosophy worry about HYP. The smart, competent kids major in CS and are fine going to state schools.

My very smart and competent DC knows that, due to a lack of interest, he would personally be miserable as a CS major or working as an engineer/technician. He is also wise enough to choose a major and profession that likely won't pay as well, but that affords a decent lifestyle AND provide personal enjoyment and fulfillment. I was in a profession that paid VERY well (big law), but was very unhappy. I took a huge pay cut to change careers and couldn't be happier with what I'm doing now - absolutely no regrets.