Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

First generation college student, and pell grant eligible are both very valuable hooks right now. I keep hearing that. But DS freshman at an Ivy is surrounded by rich white kids. Which schools are upping their numbers considerably for the first gen and/or Pell student?

I would echo this question and include URM students. We were discussing this at Christmas dinner with a family member who also said their Ivy was mostly rich white kids and Asian students.

Every top 25 school but numbers are so low to begin with, even substantial increases on small numbers is still relatively small numbers.

For instance, Harvard class of 2026 is 20 percent first gen and 20 percent pell eligible. The vast majority of students are neither.

Anonymous wrote:

First generation college student, and pell grant eligible are both very valuable hooks right now. I keep hearing that. But DS freshman at an Ivy is surrounded by rich white kids. Which schools are upping their numbers considerably for the first gen and/or Pell student?

I would echo this question and include URM students. We were discussing this at Christmas dinner with a family member who also said their Ivy was mostly rich white kids and Asian students.

Every top 25 school but numbers are so low to begin with, even substantial increases on small numbers is still relatively small numbers.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are specific instruments really a hook? My kid is very good at a difficult instrument (Interlochen, regional orchestras) but it was my impression this wouldn't matter for admissions (or at least wouldn't matter more than any other activity to show he has dedication and outside interests).

it can be if the instrument they play is the instrument the band or orchestra needs and they are the best that is interested in the school

I have professional musicians and band directors in my family and they say this is a decades-old canard. It is not been true outside of the conservatory/school of music world.

+1. The only time it matters is if you play bagpipes and you're applying to Notre Dame.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

First generation college student, and pell grant eligible are both very valuable hooks right now. I keep hearing that. But DS freshman at an Ivy is surrounded by rich white kids. Which schools are upping their numbers considerably for the first gen and/or Pell student?

I would echo this question and include URM students. We were discussing this at Christmas dinner with a family member who also said their Ivy was mostly rich white kids and Asian students.

That was our observation at a couple campuses DD was admitted to as well.

I find it strange that some are so purist about hooks, and that they go to race first. A hook is whatever the college wants to fill the class. The problem is knowing what they want! Mine loves her art and earned national acclaim. I would say that functioned as a hook for her.

When I think of hooks I think of obscure sports that are expensive to play and require a huge time and money commitment from parents. These tend to be played by white kids. I say this as a parent whose kid sails competitively!

Anonymous wrote:

First generation college student, and pell grant eligible are both very valuable hooks right now. I keep hearing that. But DS freshman at an Ivy is surrounded by rich white kids. Which schools are upping their numbers considerably for the first gen and/or Pell student?

I would echo this question and include URM students. We were discussing this at Christmas dinner with a family member who also said their Ivy was mostly rich white kids and Asian students.

That was our observation at a couple campuses DD was admitted to as well.

I find it strange that some are so purist about hooks, and that they go to race first. A hook is whatever the college wants to fill the class. The problem is knowing what they want! Mine loves her art and earned national acclaim. I would say that functioned as a hook for her.

First generation college student, and pell grant eligible are both very valuable hooks right now. I keep hearing that. But DS freshman at an Ivy is surrounded by rich white kids. Which schools are upping their numbers considerably for the first gen and/or Pell student?

I would echo this question and include URM students. We were discussing this at Christmas dinner with a family member who also said their Ivy was mostly rich white kids and Asian students.

Immediate PP here,

I'll also add that anytime I hear someone whining about how their kid didn't get into a school because other people had "hooks", I figure that they passed their racism and classism on to their kids, and it shown through in some way in the application. Probably in the teacher recommendations. You can't really hide racism in a classroom setting.

Anonymous wrote:"Hook" is a dog whistle. A "URM" with a 1510 SAT, IB diploma, and 4.6 weighted GPA can be safely sneered at and dismissed by other students and families from the moment they start receiving acceptance letters and, frankly, dismissed their whole life during and after college.

Yep! Racist classist dog whistle.

Basically, if someone uses the word "hook" around me in the way it is on DCUM, I know that's not a person I want my children exposed to.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are specific instruments really a hook? My kid is very good at a difficult instrument (Interlochen, regional orchestras) but it was my impression this wouldn't matter for admissions (or at least wouldn't matter more than any other activity to show he has dedication and outside interests).

it can be if the instrument they play is the instrument the band or orchestra needs and they are the best that is interested in the school

I have professional musicians and band directors in my family and they say this is a decades-old canard. It is not been true outside of the conservatory/school of music world.

Disagree. Selingo talks about this in "Who Gets in and Why." He worked with various AOs. It is a thing.

Thanks! Here's hoping Northwestern needs a French horn player in a couple years!

GL. I’ve read Selingo’s books and talked with him when he came to the area. Regarding the so-called hook of instruments, I’ll take the intel of my relatives who, together, know dozens of university band directors.

My kid isn't playing g French horn to get into college. He loves it, so if it is a hook great if not, he'd still do it and I wouldn't regret funding it or driving all over creation.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

But to answer the question, for some lesser known schools, being a legacy (but not giving money) might be an advantage (stats otherwise being acceptable) because the school thinks perhaps admission may make you give more money.

But in general for the more elite schools, yes, they want to see substantial giving. A history of it. Seven figures or a building-sized gift.

Being a legacy but not giving money can help at MANY schools, not just lesser known ones. The case against Harvard revealed that the legacy admission rate was above 30%.

OK, but my high-stats kid was applying to Harvard and got a soft rejection. We were told seven figures. We gave - oh - maybe 1 figure

In this year's REA legacies to HYP Ivies at our school - the legacy ED admits also had a VIP parent - one parent legacy and the other parent VIP. Will need to wait to see what happens for RD for other legacy kids (and, since they only report acceptances, it is not not known whether other legacy applicants to those schools were deferred or rejected).

The only true hooks are URM, big donor, recruited athletes. Playing the French honor or being legacy (less and less important now unless making 6+figure donations which then just moves to the big donor hook) will maybe tip a scale or give a second look assuming the kid is above the 50th percentile for stats but would’ve been otherwise rejected or WL

"Hook" is a dog whistle. A "URM" with a 1510 SAT, IB diploma, and 4.6 weighted GPA can be safely sneered at and dismissed by other students and families from the moment they start receiving acceptance letters and, frankly, dismissed their whole life during and after college.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is there a percentage of dna needed to qualify for urm ?

25%. you need to have it lab certified.

non URM kids at publics check the box all time - the only chance of being caught is by the overworked and under manned hs guidance department. Would not fly at a private. The college is not going to check or require documentation, they just want to be able to report another URM.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are specific instruments really a hook? My kid is very good at a difficult instrument (Interlochen, regional orchestras) but it was my impression this wouldn't matter for admissions (or at least wouldn't matter more than any other activity to show he has dedication and outside interests).

it can be if the instrument they play is the instrument the band or orchestra needs and they are the best that is interested in the school

I have professional musicians and band directors in my family and they say this is a decades-old canard. It is not been true outside of the conservatory/school of music world.

Disagree. Selingo talks about this in "Who Gets in and Why." He worked with various AOs. It is a thing.

Thanks! Here's hoping Northwestern needs a French horn player in a couple years!

GL. I’ve read Selingo’s books and talked with him when he came to the area. Regarding the so-called hook of instruments, I’ll take the intel of my relatives who, together, know dozens of university band directors.

Rare diseases can be hooks.