Anonymous wrote:1A) MIT, Stanford, Princeton, Harvard, Yale
1B) Penn, Caltech, Columbia, Northwestern, Duke

2A) Vanderbilt, Rice, Dartmouth, Brown, UChicago, Cornell, Williams, Amherst, Pomona
2B) UMich, Johns Hopkins, WashU, Notre Dame, Georgetown, UCLA, Berkeley, Swarthmore, Bowdoin, Claremont McKenna

3A) UVA, UNC, CMU, Emory, USC, Georgia Tech, Wellesley, Barnard, Carleton, Middlebury
3B) BC, UT Austin, W&M, W&L, Vassar, Davidson, Hamilton, Haverford

You list ranked by Princeton Review Academic Rating scores. Thought it would be interesting to compare to the list above which appears to be more of a synthesis of rankings.

Academics
How hard students work and how much they get back for their efforts, on a scale of 60–99. This rating is calculated from student survey results and statistical information reported by administrators. Factors weighed include how many hours students study outside of the classroom and the quality of students the school attracts. We also considered students' assessments of their professors, class size, student–teacher ratio, use of teaching assistants, amount of class discussion, registration, and resources.

Middlebury 99
Williams 99

Carleton 98

Chicago 94
Haverford 94
Wellesley 94

Bowdoin 93
Dartmouth 93
Johns Hopkins 93
MIT 93
Pomona 93

Brown 92
Hamilton 92
Vanderbilt 92
Vassar 92
Yale 92

Claremont McKenna 91
Emory 91
Stanford 91

Amherst 90
Caltech 90
Columbia 90
Cornell 90
Wash U 90

Barnard 89
Rice 89
W&M 89

BC 88
Duke 88
Northwestern 88
Princeton 88

CMU 87

Michigan 86
Penn 86

UNC 85
UVA 85

Notre Dame 84

Harvard 83

Davidson 82
Georgia Tech 82
Swarthmore 82

UCLA 81

Georgetown 80
UC Berkeley 80
UT Austin 80

USC 78

Anonymous wrote:Rarely is it worth the time to read a Reddit post!

If reading is too difficult for you, maybe you should let the adults do the talking

Rarely is it worth the time to read a Reddit post!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1A) MIT, Stanford, Princeton, Harvard, Yale
1B) Penn, Caltech, Columbia, Northwestern, Duke

2A) Vanderbilt, Rice, Dartmouth, Brown, UChicago, Cornell, Williams, Amherst, Pomona
2B) UMich, Johns Hopkins, WashU, Notre Dame, Georgetown, UCLA, Berkeley, Swarthmore, Bowdoin, Claremont McKenna

3A) UVA, UNC, CMU, Emory, USC, Georgia Tech, Wellesley, Barnard, Carleton, Middlebury
3B) BC, UT Austin, W&M, W&L, Vassar, Davidson, Hamilton, Haverford

Actually Northwestern needs to be knocked down a tier. Chicago higher actually.

1A) MIT, Stanford, Princeton, Harvard, Yale
1B) Penn, Caltech, Columbia, Duke, Chicago

2A) Vanderbilt, Rice, Dartmouth, Brown, Cornell, Williams, Amherst, Pomona, Northwestern
2B) UMich, Johns Hopkins, WashU, Notre Dame, Georgetown, UCLA, Berkeley, Swarthmore, Bowdoin, Claremont McKenna

3A) UVA, UNC, CMU, Emory, USC, Georgia Tech, Wellesley, Barnard, Carleton, Middlebury
3B) BC, UT Austin, W&M, W&L, Vassar, Davidson, Hamilton, Haverford

Read the Reddit post.

Anonymous wrote:1A) MIT, Stanford, Princeton, Harvard, Yale
1B) Penn, Caltech, Columbia, Northwestern, Duke

2A) Vanderbilt, Rice, Dartmouth, Brown, UChicago, Cornell, Williams, Amherst, Pomona
2B) UMich, Johns Hopkins, WashU, Notre Dame, Georgetown, UCLA, Berkeley, Swarthmore, Bowdoin, Claremont McKenna

3A) UVA, UNC, CMU, Emory, USC, Georgia Tech, Wellesley, Barnard, Carleton, Middlebury
3B) BC, UT Austin, W&M, W&L, Vassar, Davidson, Hamilton, Haverford

+1

Anonymous wrote:1A) MIT, Stanford, Princeton, Harvard, Yale
1B) Penn, Caltech, Columbia, Northwestern, Duke

2A) Vanderbilt, Rice, Dartmouth, Brown, UChicago, Cornell, Williams, Amherst, Pomona
2B) UMich, Johns Hopkins, WashU, Notre Dame, Georgetown, UCLA, Berkeley, Swarthmore, Bowdoin, Claremont McKenna

3A) UVA, UNC, CMU, Emory, USC, Georgia Tech, Wellesley, Barnard, Carleton, Middlebury
3B) BC, UT Austin, W&M, W&L, Vassar, Davidson, Hamilton, Haverford

Actually Northwestern needs to be knocked down a tier. Chicago higher actually.

1A) MIT, Stanford, Princeton, Harvard, Yale
1B) Penn, Caltech, Columbia, Duke, Chicago

2A) Vanderbilt, Rice, Dartmouth, Brown, Cornell, Williams, Amherst, Pomona, Northwestern
2B) UMich, Johns Hopkins, WashU, Notre Dame, Georgetown, UCLA, Berkeley, Swarthmore, Bowdoin, Claremont McKenna

3A) UVA, UNC, CMU, Emory, USC, Georgia Tech, Wellesley, Barnard, Carleton, Middlebury
3B) BC, UT Austin, W&M, W&L, Vassar, Davidson, Hamilton, Haverford

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This debate was basically ended through that popular Reddit post where someone took all the popular ranking systems and averaged each top school's ranks to find the best overall schools: https://www.reddit.com/r/ApplyingToCollege/comments/xc0v5x/the_2023_supreme_t75_college_ranking_aggregating/

My breakdown would be:
1A) MIT, Stanford, Princeton, Harvard, Duke, Yale
1B) Penn, Caltech, Columbia, Northwestern

2A) Vanderbilt, Rice, Dartmouth, Brown, UChicago, Cornell, Williams, Amherst, Pomona
2B) UMich, Johns Hopkins, WashU, Notre Dame, Georgetown, UCLA, Berkeley, Swarthmore, Bowdoin, Claremont McKenna

3A) UVA, UNC, CMU, UF, Emory, USC, Georgia Tech, Wellesley, Barnard, Carleton, Middlebury
3B) UCSD, BC, UT Austin, W&M, UIUC, W&L, Vassar, Davidson, Hamilton, Haverford

If I encountered a UCLA grad (2B) and W&L grad (3B), there is no way I would assume on average the UCLA grade is going to be smarter, better educated, or more capable, so this makes no sense to me. I might have other preconceptions about the graduates of those two schools (background, geography, wealth, etc.), but that is another point. This is but one example.

I think that's fair but there will be some difference on average. UCLA is one of the top handful of public schools if not the top one, and they get the most applications of any school in the country. Their student body especially over the past decade has become extremely strong, so I think on average their students are likely a bit better than the average W&L student. Not that it makes a meaningful difference though. I would say that between schools with just 1 grouping of separation between them (i.e. 1A vs 1B or 1B vs 2A), there won't be a noticeable difference on average. The typical Duke or Yale student won't really be "better" than the typical Penn or Columbia student, you could probably swap the student bodies and have them perform very similarly. I think if you go 2 or more groupings of separation, then you might notice a bit of a difference. The average MIT student is probably better than the average Vanderbilt student, although both schools are of course great.

For UC applicants, you can just check a box to apply to a campus. It is a big factor in driving up the number of applicants.

UCLA's tail is going to be weaker, and I think that may increase now that they don't take standardized tests. If you compare 2020-21 CDS, W&L is 60 points higher at the 25th percentile on the SAT and 3 points higher on the ACT at the 25th percentile.

But here's the rub. If you take a popular area like pre-med, UCLA (the top public in USNEWS), UCLA's pre-med acceptance rate has ranged from a reported high of 51% to a low of 45% (45% is close to the national average). W&L reports 91%. That is a big difference for schools that may have somewhat similar stats.

1A) MIT, Stanford, Princeton, Harvard, Yale
1B) Penn, Caltech, Columbia, Northwestern, Duke

2A) Vanderbilt, Rice, Dartmouth, Brown, UChicago, Cornell, Williams, Amherst, Pomona
2B) UMich, Johns Hopkins, WashU, Notre Dame, Georgetown, UCLA, Berkeley, Swarthmore, Bowdoin, Claremont McKenna

3A) UVA, UNC, CMU, Emory, USC, Georgia Tech, Wellesley, Barnard, Carleton, Middlebury
3B) BC, UT Austin, W&M, W&L, Vassar, Davidson, Hamilton, Haverford

Anonymous wrote:This debate was basically ended through that popular Reddit post where someone took all the popular ranking systems and averaged each top school's ranks to find the best overall schools: https://www.reddit.com/r/ApplyingToCollege/comments/xc0v5x/the_2023_supreme_t75_college_ranking_aggregating/

My breakdown would be:
1A) MIT, Stanford, Princeton, Harvard, Yale
1B) Penn, Caltech, Columbia, Northwestern, Duke

2A) Vanderbilt, Rice, Dartmouth, Brown, UChicago, Cornell, Williams, Amherst, Pomona
2B) UMich, Johns Hopkins, WashU, Notre Dame, Georgetown, UCLA, Berkeley, Swarthmore, Bowdoin, Claremont McKenna

3A) UVA, UNC, CMU, Emory, USC, Georgia Tech, Wellesley, Barnard, Carleton, Middlebury
3B) BC, UT Austin, W&M, W&L, Vassar, Davidson, Hamilton, Haverford

Very good but now way Duke is 1A. 1B is the correct place for it. I don't think Hamilton is in the same league but 3B is properly harder to fill so I will give it to you. I don't think UF/UCSD belong anywhere in the top 40. Only in US News they have a good rank. Lot of publics got pushed up due to Pell Grants. I feel like with the publics you reiterated the US News rankings.

Anonymous wrote:This debate was basically ended through that popular Reddit post where someone took all the popular ranking systems and averaged each top school's ranks to find the best overall schools: https://www.reddit.com/r/ApplyingToCollege/comments/xc0v5x/the_2023_supreme_t75_college_ranking_aggregating/

My breakdown would be:
1A) MIT, Stanford, Princeton, Harvard, Duke, Yale
1B) Penn, Caltech, Columbia, Northwestern

2A) Vanderbilt, Rice, Dartmouth, Brown, UChicago, Cornell, Williams, Amherst, Pomona
2B) UMich, Johns Hopkins, WashU, Notre Dame, Georgetown, UCLA, Berkeley, Swarthmore, Bowdoin, Claremont McKenna

3A) UVA, UNC, CMU, UF, Emory, USC, Georgia Tech, Wellesley, Barnard, Carleton, Middlebury
3B) UCSD, BC, UT Austin, W&M, UIUC, W&L, Vassar, Davidson, Hamilton, Haverford

+1

No matter how many times this question is asked, it's always the same schools. Ivy League, Stanford, Duke, etc. and then a smattering of good research universities, public schools, and LACs.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This debate was basically ended through that popular Reddit post where someone took all the popular ranking systems and averaged each top school's ranks to find the best overall schools: https://www.reddit.com/r/ApplyingToCollege/comments/xc0v5x/the_2023_supreme_t75_college_ranking_aggregating/

My breakdown would be:
1A) MIT, Stanford, Princeton, Harvard, Duke, Yale
1B) Penn, Caltech, Columbia, Northwestern

2A) Vanderbilt, Rice, Dartmouth, Brown, UChicago, Cornell, Williams, Amherst, Pomona
2B) UMich, Johns Hopkins, WashU, Notre Dame, Georgetown, UCLA, Berkeley, Swarthmore, Bowdoin, Claremont McKenna

3A) UVA, UNC, CMU, UF, Emory, USC, Georgia Tech, Wellesley, Barnard, Carleton, Middlebury
3B) UCSD, BC, UT Austin, W&M, UIUC, W&L, Vassar, Davidson, Hamilton, Haverford

If I encountered a UCLA grad (2B) and W&L grad (3B), there is no way I would assume on average the UCLA grade is going to be smarter, better educated, or more capable, so this makes no sense to me. I might have other preconceptions about the graduates of those two schools (background, geography, wealth, etc.), but that is another point. This is but one example.

I think that's fair but there will be some difference on average. UCLA is one of the top handful of public schools if not the top one, and they get the most applications of any school in the country. Their student body especially over the past decade has become extremely strong, so I think on average their students are likely a bit better than the average W&L student. Not that it makes a meaningful difference though. I would say that between schools with just 1 grouping of separation between them (i.e. 1A vs 1B or 1B vs 2A), there won't be a noticeable difference on average. The typical Duke or Yale student won't really be "better" than the typical Penn or Columbia student, you could probably swap the student bodies and have them perform very similarly. I think if you go 2 or more groupings of separation, then you might notice a bit of a difference. The average MIT student is probably better than the average Vanderbilt student, although both schools are of course great.

Anonymous wrote:LACs and universities shouldn't be compared in the same tier. They're too different and they don't have much overlap admissions wise either. I think it's sound to separate the two categories. For top LACs specifically, I do think the gap in difference/educational benefits and opportunities is a lot smaller than universities like Princeton vs UCLA since most of them are very wealthy on a per student basis and all emphasize a liberal arts curriculum largely dominated by undergrad attention. Williams might be significantly favored by cross-admits over Colby, but the Williams and Colby experience are almost 95%+ identical in a way Princeton (#1) and USC (#25) are not.

+1

LACs and universities shouldn't be compared in the same tier. They're too different and they don't have much overlap admissions wise either. I think it's sound to separate the two categories. For top LACs specifically, I do think the gap in difference/educational benefits and opportunities is a lot smaller than universities like Princeton vs UCLA since most of them are very wealthy on a per student basis and all emphasize a liberal arts curriculum largely dominated by undergrad attention. Williams might be significantly favored by cross-admits over Colby, but the Williams and Colby experience are almost 95%+ identical in a way Princeton (#1) and USC (#25) are not.

Anonymous wrote:This debate was basically ended through that popular Reddit post where someone took all the popular ranking systems and averaged each top school's ranks to find the best overall schools: https://www.reddit.com/r/ApplyingToCollege/comments/xc0v5x/the_2023_supreme_t75_college_ranking_aggregating/

My breakdown would be:
1A) MIT, Stanford, Princeton, Harvard, Duke, Yale
1B) Penn, Caltech, Columbia, Northwestern

2A) Vanderbilt, Rice, Dartmouth, Brown, UChicago, Cornell, Williams, Amherst, Pomona
2B) UMich, Johns Hopkins, WashU, Notre Dame, Georgetown, UCLA, Berkeley, Swarthmore, Bowdoin, Claremont McKenna

3A) UVA, UNC, CMU, UF, Emory, USC, Georgia Tech, Wellesley, Barnard, Carleton, Middlebury
3B) UCSD, BC, UT Austin, W&M, UIUC, W&L, Vassar, Davidson, Hamilton, Haverford

If I encountered a UCLA grad (2B) and W&L grad (3B), there is no way I would assume on average the UCLA grade is going to be smarter, better educated, or more capable, so this makes no sense to me. I might have other preconceptions about the graduates of those two schools (background, geography, wealth, etc.), but that is another point. This is but one example.