Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I also don’t get why we compare with other districts when we know historically teaching has been a ‘female job,’ and is underpaid throughout this nation, just as many nursing positions. If teaching was a revered field like being a doctor, I promise you would see more teachers and also in some cases better quality ones.

I realize this wasn't your main point, but the reason we compare is that the surrounding districts are the competition for hiring teachers.

We don't evaluate every job on the basis of what it means to society and pay accordingly, because how would you do that? It's all subjective. Wishing we did it that way won't change capitalism.

I think the relevant point is: DC has higher teacher salaries but can lose teachers to lower-paying surrounding districts for reasons other than pay. That means that you want to address those other reasons (at least first). It sounds like some of those reasons are COL and just having a demoralizing work environment. That work environment might be cured by XYZ (insert all of the stuff regularly discussed on DCUM).

But to get back to the point of the thread, even with a beautiful work environment and higher pay, would teachers be able to make up for the learning losses of the pandemic? Would any of that actually measurably help students? The end goal is students' education.

Sadly, the research is pretty clear that even the best teachers with the best support are unlikely to be able to ameliorate the effects of the closures and quarantines without funding for intensive support for the kids, including one-on-one tutoring. And that just isn't something we can provide in bulk, regardless of funding. There aren't enough potential support staff available in the entire region. I hate to be a downer but this is a generation of black and poor children in DC who will all experience lasting harmful effects.

I don’t agree, I can have had students grow 2 grade levels in 1 school year. BUT they were 2-3.5 grade levels behind, were at school 90-100% of the school year, and I got their parents involved at home.

People really don’t think acceleration is possible?? The issue is that when you have a child missing 70 days of school what do you expect? I can reach if I can’t teach. You think the average attendance of 126 days vs. at minimum 162 days doesn’t make a difference?

And what research? Because from my own and personal experience you can close the achievement gap with:
A good teacher
Minimal absences
Parental involvement
Student engagement
Decent class sizes
And optionally a strong teacher’s aide

What is the population you teach? And also, we are talking systematically, not just in your classroom. I am not denying that you are an exceptional teacher, but acknowledging that you are the exception, not the rule, is important.

I teach at a dcps title 1 school, with a high at risk population.

You don’t think if DCPS changed their absence and tardy policy things wouldn’t change? I’m not saying parents who have their children miss 20-100+ days of school should go to jail but there needs to be a tangible consequence such as a mandatory check in or be fined, then maybe a little jail time as a very, very, very last resort. Because CPS isn’t all that helpful, at least none of the parents at my school seem to give a crap. Something has got to give on this end, I love my parents, especially the tough ones who I have to wiggle my way to knowing. But tbh it’s exhausting to get these parents whose main job is a parent to be one.

More parental involvement would be great for parents especially of students with high needs, whether it’s academic, emotional, etc. It starts in elementary, why aren’t all DCPS schools Flamboyan or the like schools? It’s time for teacher compensated mandatory home visits.

Student engagement is a systemic issue. you know how many teachers think their point system, taking recess, seeing the dean or principal, in school suspension is working? Not many and if they do it’s because they don’t know any better.
Teachers are seldom trained in how to keep students engaged and no, engagement doesn’t mean a child who ‘hates’ math is going to love it. But why do they hate it and how can we incorporate their interests? If teachers had adequate planning time, as in it’s never taken away this could be something every individual teacher could work on.

I think I don’t have to explain overcrowding of classes.

A teacher’s aide in every class would be helpful too, more small groups and another adult to help de-escalate students as needed.

Idk the answers seem fairly clear to me but dcps will never do it. They don’t want to pay teachers, aides, and subs any more. Because let me tell you we have a huge shortage. Finding great people who are ok with 30k a year (aides) is almost impossible. They also don’t want to hold parents accountable for tardies and absences. It IS neglect if you allow your child to miss so much school.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm not understanding why the OP is getting such pushback.

+1. It’s kind of shocking how many people can’t look back and accept that mistakes were made, agree we need a plan to address learning and social loss, and make a plan so that working families can once again rely on schools. I do not see what is so controversial about that. I thought the first reply had some great suggestions.

Mistakes were made? It was an absolute disaster that will affect the poorest and most vulnerable kids for years.

Top victimizing kids who struggled before Covid and you did not care.

I cared then and I care now. I’ll never believe that the 2020-21 school year was allowed to happen as it did. Eternal shame for those who went along with it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I also don’t get why we compare with other districts when we know historically teaching has been a ‘female job,’ and is underpaid throughout this nation, just as many nursing positions. If teaching was a revered field like being a doctor, I promise you would see more teachers and also in some cases better quality ones.

I realize this wasn't your main point, but the reason we compare is that the surrounding districts are the competition for hiring teachers.

We don't evaluate every job on the basis of what it means to society and pay accordingly, because how would you do that? It's all subjective. Wishing we did it that way won't change capitalism.

I think the relevant point is: DC has higher teacher salaries but can lose teachers to lower-paying surrounding districts for reasons other than pay. That means that you want to address those other reasons (at least first). It sounds like some of those reasons are COL and just having a demoralizing work environment. That work environment might be cured by XYZ (insert all of the stuff regularly discussed on DCUM).

But to get back to the point of the thread, even with a beautiful work environment and higher pay, would teachers be able to make up for the learning losses of the pandemic? Would any of that actually measurably help students? The end goal is students' education.

Sadly, the research is pretty clear that even the best teachers with the best support are unlikely to be able to ameliorate the effects of the closures and quarantines without funding for intensive support for the kids, including one-on-one tutoring. And that just isn't something we can provide in bulk, regardless of funding. There aren't enough potential support staff available in the entire region. I hate to be a downer but this is a generation of black and poor children in DC who will all experience lasting harmful effects.

I don’t agree, I can have had students grow 2 grade levels in 1 school year. BUT they were 2-3.5 grade levels behind, were at school 90-100% of the school year, and I got their parents involved at home.

People really don’t think acceleration is possible?? The issue is that when you have a child missing 70 days of school what do you expect? I can reach if I can’t teach. You think the average attendance of 126 days vs. at minimum 162 days doesn’t make a difference?

And what research? Because from my own and personal experience you can close the achievement gap with:
A good teacher
Minimal absences
Parental involvement
Student engagement
Decent class sizes
And optionally a strong teacher’s aide

What is the population you teach? And also, we are talking systematically, not just in your classroom. I am not denying that you are an exceptional teacher, but acknowledging that you are the exception, not the rule, is important.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I also don’t get why we compare with other districts when we know historically teaching has been a ‘female job,’ and is underpaid throughout this nation, just as many nursing positions. If teaching was a revered field like being a doctor, I promise you would see more teachers and also in some cases better quality ones.

I realize this wasn't your main point, but the reason we compare is that the surrounding districts are the competition for hiring teachers.

We don't evaluate every job on the basis of what it means to society and pay accordingly, because how would you do that? It's all subjective. Wishing we did it that way won't change capitalism.

I think the relevant point is: DC has higher teacher salaries but can lose teachers to lower-paying surrounding districts for reasons other than pay. That means that you want to address those other reasons (at least first). It sounds like some of those reasons are COL and just having a demoralizing work environment. That work environment might be cured by XYZ (insert all of the stuff regularly discussed on DCUM).

But to get back to the point of the thread, even with a beautiful work environment and higher pay, would teachers be able to make up for the learning losses of the pandemic? Would any of that actually measurably help students? The end goal is students' education.

Sadly, the research is pretty clear that even the best teachers with the best support are unlikely to be able to ameliorate the effects of the closures and quarantines without funding for intensive support for the kids, including one-on-one tutoring. And that just isn't something we can provide in bulk, regardless of funding. There aren't enough potential support staff available in the entire region. I hate to be a downer but this is a generation of black and poor children in DC who will all experience lasting harmful effects.

I don’t agree, I can have had students grow 2 grade levels in 1 school year. BUT they were 2-3.5 grade levels behind, were at school 90-100% of the school year, and I got their parents involved at home.

People really don’t think acceleration is possible?? The issue is that when you have a child missing 70 days of school what do you expect? I can reach if I can’t teach. You think the average attendance of 126 days vs. at minimum 162 days doesn’t make a difference?

And what research? Because from my own and personal experience you can close the achievement gap with:
A good teacher
Minimal absences
Parental involvement
Student engagement
Decent class sizes
And optionally a strong teacher’s aide

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I also don’t get why we compare with other districts when we know historically teaching has been a ‘female job,’ and is underpaid throughout this nation, just as many nursing positions. If teaching was a revered field like being a doctor, I promise you would see more teachers and also in some cases better quality ones.

I realize this wasn't your main point, but the reason we compare is that the surrounding districts are the competition for hiring teachers.

We don't evaluate every job on the basis of what it means to society and pay accordingly, because how would you do that? It's all subjective. Wishing we did it that way won't change capitalism.

I think the relevant point is: DC has higher teacher salaries but can lose teachers to lower-paying surrounding districts for reasons other than pay. That means that you want to address those other reasons (at least first). It sounds like some of those reasons are COL and just having a demoralizing work environment. That work environment might be cured by XYZ (insert all of the stuff regularly discussed on DCUM).

But to get back to the point of the thread, even with a beautiful work environment and higher pay, would teachers be able to make up for the learning losses of the pandemic? Would any of that actually measurably help students? The end goal is students' education.

Sadly, the research is pretty clear that even the best teachers with the best support are unlikely to be able to ameliorate the effects of the closures and quarantines without funding for intensive support for the kids, including one-on-one tutoring. And that just isn't something we can provide in bulk, regardless of funding. There aren't enough potential support staff available in the entire region. I hate to be a downer but this is a generation of black and poor children in DC who will all experience lasting harmful effects.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are the hurdles to hiring more support staff to aid with the learning losses? My understanding of the issues is:
1) no one to hire
2) pay probably sucks = no one to hire
3) DCPS is slow at hiring

But is there a lack of funding for such positions, even if there were people to hire? Because funding seems like something parents could advocate for. The finding of people seems like it would require maybe a training program. Idk.

This is a huge problem. Many posters here would not deign to do these jobs at $18/hr. Even schools that raise their own funds to staff these positions pay the same low rate. Raise the pay and you’ll get more applicants. And I’m talking 25-30 an hour.

Would that do it, though? I mean, if so, great, let’s advocate for that. But I’m wondering if there just aren’t people to hire, at any pay rate. This would sort of seem to be the case as well with DCPS teachers, who get a higher salary compared to surrounding districts — we are still hearing concerns about teacher shortages in DC.

Oh no there are people to hire, staff are leaving for other districts, certain charters, privates, or a whole other job.

Being in education is never easy but when you see police officers getting a huge pay raise, 20k bonuses, and all WITHOUT a shortage…I mean you start to see your worth to the mayor.

Honestly we could help learning loss by giving any teacher who want one an teacher’s assistant (para) and pay them at least double. Some of these people have a BA and only get paid $16/hr and NOT full time lol. Even if they have the same hours as teachers.

Teachers also need to be paid more and have a better evaluation system, more will just continue to leave. Also yes after 21+ years teachers are paid up to 116k. That is not much for someone who has a master’s or PhD in DC.

I also don’t get why we compare with other districts when we know historically teaching has been a ‘female job,’ and is underpaid throughout this nation, just as many nursing positions. If teaching was a revered field like being a doctor, I promise you would see more teachers and also in some cases better quality ones.

Rambling here but in a nutshell we need more pay for teaching assistants and teachers. More teaching assistants, better evaluation systems. Less central office involvement, more school based decision making and supports.
More targeted and specific SEL training, stop with the PBIS BS.


I mean there are a million things I could list but it all boils down to money and resources, of which the mayor says we can’t spend.

What is PBIS?

To add: In no way am I questioning the efforts of teacher and educators to help kids. I'm wondering if there are other issues (outside of school) that are so overwhelming that they flood any attempts by schools to help.

Anonymous wrote:

I also don’t get why we compare with other districts when we know historically teaching has been a ‘female job,’ and is underpaid throughout this nation, just as many nursing positions. If teaching was a revered field like being a doctor, I promise you would see more teachers and also in some cases better quality ones.

I realize this wasn't your main point, but the reason we compare is that the surrounding districts are the competition for hiring teachers.

We don't evaluate every job on the basis of what it means to society and pay accordingly, because how would you do that? It's all subjective. Wishing we did it that way won't change capitalism.

I think the relevant point is: DC has higher teacher salaries but can lose teachers to lower-paying surrounding districts for reasons other than pay. That means that you want to address those other reasons (at least first). It sounds like some of those reasons are COL and just having a demoralizing work environment. That work environment might be cured by XYZ (insert all of the stuff regularly discussed on DCUM).

But to get back to the point of the thread, even with a beautiful work environment and higher pay, would teachers be able to make up for the learning losses of the pandemic? Would any of that actually measurably help students? The end goal is students' education.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are the hurdles to hiring more support staff to aid with the learning losses? My understanding of the issues is:
1) no one to hire
2) pay probably sucks = no one to hire
3) DCPS is slow at hiring

But is there a lack of funding for such positions, even if there were people to hire? Because funding seems like something parents could advocate for. The finding of people seems like it would require maybe a training program. Idk.

This is a huge problem. Many posters here would not deign to do these jobs at $18/hr. Even schools that raise their own funds to staff these positions pay the same low rate. Raise the pay and you’ll get more applicants. And I’m talking 25-30 an hour.

Would that do it, though? I mean, if so, great, let’s advocate for that. But I’m wondering if there just aren’t people to hire, at any pay rate. This would sort of seem to be the case as well with DCPS teachers, who get a higher salary compared to surrounding districts — we are still hearing concerns about teacher shortages in DC.

Oh no there are people to hire, staff are leaving for other districts, certain charters, privates, or a whole other job.

Being in education is never easy but when you see police officers getting a huge pay raise, 20k bonuses, and all WITHOUT a shortage…I mean you start to see your worth to the mayor.

Honestly we could help learning loss by giving any teacher who want one an teacher’s assistant (para) and pay them at least double. Some of these people have a BA and only get paid $16/hr and NOT full time lol. Even if they have the same hours as teachers.

Teachers also need to be paid more and have a better evaluation system, more will just continue to leave. Also yes after 21+ years teachers are paid up to 116k. That is not much for someone who has a master’s or PhD in DC.

I also don’t get why we compare with other districts when we know historically teaching has been a ‘female job,’ and is underpaid throughout this nation, just as many nursing positions. If teaching was a revered field like being a doctor, I promise you would see more teachers and also in some cases better quality ones.

Rambling here but in a nutshell we need more pay for teaching assistants and teachers. More teaching assistants, better evaluation systems. Less central office involvement, more school based decision making and supports.
More targeted and specific SEL training, stop with the PBIS BS.


I mean there are a million things I could list but it all boils down to money and resources, of which the mayor says we can’t spend.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are the hurdles to hiring more support staff to aid with the learning losses? My understanding of the issues is:
1) no one to hire
2) pay probably sucks = no one to hire
3) DCPS is slow at hiring

But is there a lack of funding for such positions, even if there were people to hire? Because funding seems like something parents could advocate for. The finding of people seems like it would require maybe a training program. Idk.

This is a huge problem. Many posters here would not deign to do these jobs at $18/hr. Even schools that raise their own funds to staff these positions pay the same low rate. Raise the pay and you’ll get more applicants. And I’m talking 25-30 an hour.

Would that do it, though? I mean, if so, great, let’s advocate for that. But I’m wondering if there just aren’t people to hire, at any pay rate. This would sort of seem to be the case as well with DCPS teachers, who get a higher salary compared to surrounding districts — we are still hearing concerns about teacher shortages in DC.

Well one issue is that DC is more expensive than surrounding districts, so the higher pay does not necessarily translate to more money unless teachers accept long commutes, which come with their own costs. Which is why from a policy perspective, affordable housing has long been a major concern with attracting teachers to the district. This is becoming increasingly important as even close in suburbs are priced beyond what a teacher, but especially what a para, can afford. It’s a huge issue with attracting new, younger people to these professions. I know people in DC who grew up here, got teaching degrees locally, but are looking at other cities for jobs because they want to be able to own a home and have kids. It’s hard here.

If quarantines have to continue, each school needs their "Covid Coordinator" to take over all COVID related notices, etc. Our Principal left at the end of the year and specifically told me they were exhausted after spending all year, every day telling families why they could not come to school that day. Many teachers are leaving because the Principal is, not to mention their own exhaustion. Teacher and Leadership retention is critical for kids success. This is what I think needs to be prioritized.

A competent district would have tutoring options and robust summer school

DCPS is incompetent so here we are

I'll also add most parents are ok with the state of schools, it's pathetic but it is what it is.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are the hurdles to hiring more support staff to aid with the learning losses? My understanding of the issues is:
1) no one to hire
2) pay probably sucks = no one to hire
3) DCPS is slow at hiring

But is there a lack of funding for such positions, even if there were people to hire? Because funding seems like something parents could advocate for. The finding of people seems like it would require maybe a training program. Idk.

This is a huge problem. Many posters here would not deign to do these jobs at $18/hr. Even schools that raise their own funds to staff these positions pay the same low rate. Raise the pay and you’ll get more applicants. And I’m talking 25-30 an hour.

Would that do it, though? I mean, if so, great, let’s advocate for that. But I’m wondering if there just aren’t people to hire, at any pay rate. This would sort of seem to be the case as well with DCPS teachers, who get a higher salary compared to surrounding districts — we are still hearing concerns about teacher shortages in DC.

Anonymous wrote:What are the hurdles to hiring more support staff to aid with the learning losses? My understanding of the issues is:
1) no one to hire
2) pay probably sucks = no one to hire
3) DCPS is slow at hiring

But is there a lack of funding for such positions, even if there were people to hire? Because funding seems like something parents could advocate for. The finding of people seems like it would require maybe a training program. Idk.

This is a huge problem. Many posters here would not deign to do these jobs at $18/hr. Even schools that raise their own funds to staff these positions pay the same low rate. Raise the pay and you’ll get more applicants. And I’m talking 25-30 an hour.

It’s sad that people are so rude and short-sighted. But I guess the pandemic has brought out the worst in us.

To answer OP’s question, I would say:

Council and/or mayor’s office should have a task force with principals, teachers, counselors/school psychiatrists, and parents from all eight wards. Ask the task force to share experiences from this year and where they see gaps and needs.

Consider ways to ensure sufficient numbers of great teachers in all schools. Compensation and also other incentives — housing incentives? - to be considered.

How to support kids. Even in our very good NW DC school, some kids were totally nuts this year. More than usual. Consider more staffing for student support services, but also how to integrate programs focusing on social skills, treating each other with kindness, anti-bullying, etc.

Academic gaps — consider how to address, and consider need for teaching kids at different levels so everyone’s academic needs are met.

How to get parents on board/outreach to parents and figuring out if there are ways to help parents support their kids and schools better.