Omg. In dcps expulsion is prohibited by law. So yes please let’s find another way to protect our kids from the aggressors. RJ isn’t going to work without a threat of expulsion.

Like some the PPs, I've only ever seen it work in private schools with relatively low stakes. It works because the parents are bought into the concept and because expulsion remains on the table for serious transgressions.

In a public school, parents may or may not be on board, and RJ is used for offenses that would lead to a termination of the child's presence at a private school.

Anonymous wrote:My kid is at a Quaker school and has been since he was 4. He’s in high school now. They’ve been using restorative justice since before there was a fancy name for it. It is not a replacement for boundaries and consequences, and those things happen too. It also can be really unsatisfying to see a kid who can’t seem to behave continue to misbehave and be disruptive or hurtful. But overall it has produced a really good community in my kid’s school, and my kid behaves and is kind not because he is afraid of punishment but because he wants to do right by people. Other types of discipline certainly create those same results.

It isn’t a fad, but it also isn’t easy and it doesn’t scratch the very human itch for punishment when something bad happens to someone you love. But if you can drop the belief that people misbehave because they aren’t afraid enough of consequences, it is a robust and challenging and meaningful way to be in community.

Consequences still happen, because if someone is unable to keep themselves from hurting or disturbing others they can’t come to school. The purpose of that isn’t punishment, but protection.

+1 I think it's honestly the strongest way to build a functioning community, but it's hard and not without problems (esp. in a public school where it's harder to say someone can't come to school for the protection of others and there is less time devoted to it). But the benefit is that the majority of the community really gets a sense of what it means to be a part of the community. I think it works best when there's a structure that even "small" things get addressed so kids who are generally well-behaved but with some blind spots become more aware and empathetic about their impact of their actions. And when there isn't an expectation of consensus--or that the majority is "right" but rather that as a community we make communal decisions that respect differing viewpoints on an incident.

One time I saw it work really well is in a school that started off with discussion of only hypotheticals in the youngest grades (e.g. made up cases) and didn't move to discussion of examples in the classroom until a particular class community was good and fair-minded in discussion of hypotheticals.

When it's not done well it's only trotted out when there's a bigger issue and people don't have the skills to see issues in a proportional way.

My kid is at a Quaker school and has been since he was 4. He’s in high school now. They’ve been using restorative justice since before there was a fancy name for it. It is not a replacement for boundaries and consequences, and those things happen too. It also can be really unsatisfying to see a kid who can’t seem to behave continue to misbehave and be disruptive or hurtful. But overall it has produced a really good community in my kid’s school, and my kid behaves and is kind not because he is afraid of punishment but because he wants to do right by people. Other types of discipline certainly create those same results.

It isn’t a fad, but it also isn’t easy and it doesn’t scratch the very human itch for punishment when something bad happens to someone you love. But if you can drop the belief that people misbehave because they aren’t afraid enough of consequences, it is a robust and challenging and meaningful way to be in community.

Consequences still happen, because if someone is unable to keep themselves from hurting or disturbing others they can’t come to school. The purpose of that isn’t punishment, but protection.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PSA on the term “bullying”. Run of the mill meanness is *not* bullying. Bullying is a repeated abuse of power.

https://www.ncab.org.au/bullying-advice/bullying-for-parents/definition-of-bullying/

Apologies for interrupting the regularly scheduled programming, but the term “bullying” is way overused these days. Carry on.

Girl got shoved three times and said Stop each time, the fourth push she said Stop it are you stupid? And pushing bully took her to the RJ session for saying the word stupid.

The RJ session empowered the bully. And everyone in the class and recess saw it play out and that the bully won.

Power and control enabled by RJ.

Meanwhile the teachers are coached to tell concerned parents that all the kids are nice kids.

This scenario seems to be the norm for schools attempting to use RJ.

I’ll try talking to the rich parents next time about their bratty bully girl or disruptive boy. Nothing else has helped and now 3 girls in the class are leaving the school entirely. Coed private school.

Swift punishments end up saving more kids than they harm.

Same at our school.

Even witnesses stopped telling the teachers or aides what they saw really happen since then they’d get bullied next week after the RJ session.

My child was assigned to work on a longish term project with two kids who were friends and picked on him while the small groups were working each day. He asked his teacher (without saying why) if he could work in project by himself-she said no and questioned him about why until he described what was going on (nothing major but annoying and mean to the point of causing dread about school, including small physical stuff like repeatedly shoving his elbow when he was drawing for the project in order to make his marker slip.) she first stealthily observed their group work to confirm the behaviors then initiated a restorative justice meeting where she prodded my son to to tell the kids it bothered him when they shoved him or called him a nerd, etc (which, no sh1+!) and one boy said a quick “sorry!” And the other boy stone cold denied (even after teacher said she had seen) and then was even meaner for the rest of the project (and the rest of the school year, actually!) my son came away with the idea he shouldn’t go to a teacher for help and that bad behavior has no consequences. hooray, restorative justice!

Bad experiences at our private school.
Overused as well. Also makes teacher never manage or attempt to keep discipline in the classroom.
Empowers the bully when they successfully get the victim kid in the Time Out chair or sent to an RJ session.

This is the person posing the original question writing - and I ask that we really focus on making this a creative thread.

In fact, THAT previous response was the only positive one that has arisen and I have a true authentic compassionate curiosity —HOW— it worked for the author of that reply.

I, for one, promise to support anyone sharing your own view if you would kindly tell me what YOU RIGHTFULLY HAVE YOUR OWN THOUGHTS AND OPINIONS on why you think it can have merit and yield results —

Please tell us your views — and please set aside any anonymous aggressive judgmental statements you made read here. Please consider me your audience.

Provid examples of it “working great”.

Let me guess, you’re one of the 5 guidance counselors who think because you did a session with some kids and never hear from them again it’s a big success. Yet can’t figure out why families in a certain grade keep leaving the school yet stay local.

Anonymous wrote:Restorative justice seems like it offers many rewards – but is that only in theory?

I seek instances were restorative justice was particularly helpful; and what was it that made it so –

There are many factors that vary, for instance do parents/guardians need to be there in order to make it work? If parents and guardians are not present, is it really restorative justice - or just students in an office being told to say sorry.

Does someone have an experience where the bullying ("You're stupid and ugly”)/hitting/pushing/kicking actually diminished after a restorative justice circle?

Works great when it's done correctly.

Anonymous wrote:PSA on the term “bullying”. Run of the mill meanness is *not* bullying. Bullying is a repeated abuse of power.

https://www.ncab.org.au/bullying-advice/bullying-for-parents/definition-of-bullying/

Apologies for interrupting the regularly scheduled programming, but the term “bullying” is way overused these days. Carry on.

Girl got shoved three times and said Stop each time, the fourth push she said Stop it are you stupid? And pushing bully took her to the RJ session for saying the word stupid.

The RJ session empowered the bully. And everyone in the class and recess saw it play out and that the bully won.

Power and control enabled by RJ.

Meanwhile the teachers are coached to tell concerned parents that all the kids are nice kids.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Might be useful in ECE. In upper ES and beyond it does not work. Kids need boundaries and consequences. When there are no real consequences they figure it out real quick. A conversation about how they made someone feel and having to apologize is not a consequence.

+1

+1