Anonymous
Post 04/28/2022 14:52     Subject: Re:Parents of seniors - what should my 9th grader be doing now to ensure a solid college application?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Take at least Calc AB by 12th, as well as at least 4 years of foreign language and at least an honors physics course.

This is regardless of intended major if you’re aiming for top schools.


Do you need to take 4 years of a foreign language if your kid was in an immersion program and takes the AP level course in 9th grade? DC is more interested in STEM subjects and we're hoping to load up on all the math and science APs, plus one year of AP Spanish, then stay in honors or even regular English and humanities classes.


This is my DC's exact situation- taking AP French now, in 9th grade, after going to an immersion school. We had a lot of discussion about this with her guidance counselor, who recommended that she start another language next year since colleges want to see several years of language taken during high school (not high school credit earned in middle school). DC is not thrilled, as she was looking forward to being done with a language and taking electives that she was more interested in. She is actually in a STEM program and this is still the recommendation. Not sure if she will take three more years though- probably only two. From a parent's perspective, it seems kind of ridiculous- she has four years of high school foreign language credit taken in middle school (for French and another language) and one year of AP French taken in HS and she is not likely to become fluent after taking three years of HS Spanish, so what is really the point?


Take this with a grain of salt, but my oldest made the calculated decision to stop foreign language after Spanish 3 sophomore year of HS. He was not at all a foreign language kid and certainly wasn't going to go any further in it just for the sake of having 3-4 years in HS to make him more attractive to private/liberal arts focused colleges. Instead he loaded up on the STEM classes and CS -- AP Physics 1 and C, Honors Chem plus AP Chem, Calc BC, multivariate, AP Java, engineering design, etc. But he was targeting public in-state and OOS big STEM-specialized colleges and is now double-majoring in Physics and CS at UMD, where he only needed 2 years of a FL recommended anyway if I recall. But he wasn't applying to Dartmouth and Brown or Cornell Arts & Sciences where they intend to turn out Renaissance scholars.

I'd think in your DC's situation that they'd be even better positioned in that she will have the AP. Is there a French 6 language/literature option maybe? Or maybe one year of ASL? If she took that, she'd have two years of FL in HS, plus if that immersion program shows up on the transcript as HS credit, that's really what she needs. Since she's targeting STEM, that seems like a great all-around package to me -- two years in HS of FL but then take those slots for STEM or something else interesting (arts? music?). I'd still have her do honors/AP humanities (English/social studies) to demonstrate breadth, but it does seem silly for her particular case to start over with three years in another language just to check that box.


In that case, why are we rushing to take AP French in 9th grade? Why not just enroll DC in an easier French class for a few years and then save AP French for 10th, 11th or 12th grade. It's been a struggle from day 1. He's always been in the bottom half of his class in French, even though he does well in other subjects. If colleges expect 4 years of a foreign language to check a box, I'm inclined to play the game and sign him up for French 2 or 3 in 9th grade and continue from there, that way he has one easy A.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2022 14:44     Subject: Re:Parents of seniors - what should my 9th grader be doing now to ensure a solid college application?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Take at least Calc AB by 12th, as well as at least 4 years of foreign language and at least an honors physics course.

This is regardless of intended major if you’re aiming for top schools.


Do you need to take 4 years of a foreign language if your kid was in an immersion program and takes the AP level course in 9th grade? DC is more interested in STEM subjects and we're hoping to load up on all the math and science APs, plus one year of AP Spanish, then stay in honors or even regular English and humanities classes.


This is my DC's exact situation- taking AP French now, in 9th grade, after going to an immersion school. We had a lot of discussion about this with her guidance counselor, who recommended that she start another language next year since colleges want to see several years of language taken during high school (not high school credit earned in middle school). DC is not thrilled, as she was looking forward to being done with a language and taking electives that she was more interested in. She is actually in a STEM program and this is still the recommendation. Not sure if she will take three more years though- probably only two. From a parent's perspective, it seems kind of ridiculous- she has four years of high school foreign language credit taken in middle school (for French and another language) and one year of AP French taken in HS and she is not likely to become fluent after taking three years of HS Spanish, so what is really the point?

Be wary of guidance counselors and use common sense. What is described here is a particular formula--a formula that SO many kids in the DMV are following and are therefore looking like clones to admissions committees. Relax on the foreign language, not to mention the rigid nature of the formula, and let DC explore interests that may actually make them stand out and not look exactly like everyone else. For that matter, none of the kids in high school foreign language programs will come close to approximating fluency. They are just checking a box. Those that are seeking fluency will do AFS or similar immersion programs overseas during the summer, senior year, etc.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2022 14:44     Subject: Parents of seniors - what should my 9th grader be doing now to ensure a solid college application?
Maybe get them excited about being a 9th grader first.
1) Make good friends - adults and peers.
2) Get engaged in the community - the world is bigger than you.
3) Find new things to love to do.
4) Build some grit by completing hard tasks.
5) Take risks and explore your creativity.
6) Learn how to be independent. Do your own laundry, buy your own crap.
7) Disagree (nicely) with peers and parents.

Kids do a whole lot of growing up in 4 years and it is seriously irrational to expect their high school years to be only about getting into college. 95% of applicants to the elite schools are going to get rejected and half of those who do get in are going to be in the bottom of their class. So it is foolish to stake your child's worth on where they go to college. There are plenty of colleges with wonderful faculty that accept public school kids with B and even C averages. And there are lots of high schoolers who are better off not going to college at all.

Anonymous
Post 04/28/2022 14:37     Subject: Parents of seniors - what should my 9th grader be doing now to ensure a solid college application?
Anonymous wrote:Just relax OP. I have a kid at a top-25 and another one who will not have anything resembling a *checks notes* "solid college application." (This is not uncommon in my friend group, btw.)

I did the same thing for both of them...

What I did: Let them choose their path, and help each one individually as they requested/needed.

What I didn't do: Map out a 4-year plan that you have no control over (and doesn't guarantee anything) and overly stress about college.

This is the best advice posted. Let them learn how to live and discover what interests and motivates them. Take some risks! Explore! You know, what teenagers used to be able to do.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2022 14:02     Subject: Parents of seniors - what should my 9th grader be doing now to ensure a solid college application?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:It's a lottery now. Best for your kid: do whatever they want to do, be happy, forget about college until mid-junior year and then hope for the best. Not kidding. Don't let your kid ruin their HS years trying to "work" for something that is a 4-6% acceptance rate. Accept it as a lottery and let the kid have fun.


High school teacher here. Yes! I have so many miserable students in my advanced classes. They *only* focus on transcripts and applications. Meanwhile, four years of their lives are slipping away. I get it. They want to be admitted to top colleges, but at what cost? High school should be more than a pressure-cooker stepping stone to something else. This is balanced, reasoned advice above and I tell it to my own children.

College admissions do operate as lotteries these days, especially at higher GPA and SAT ranges. Knowing this, I’m having my own kids do the best they can in rigorous courses, but not to the point of misery. They *will* get in somewhere because we will strategically apply to mostly target schools.



Agree with this. Rigor & top grades etc are necessary for the most competitive colleges, but all that does is buy you a lottery ticket. If your kid is going to do all that anyway, that’s great, but there’s no point in forcing it for a vanishingly small chance at Harvard (if you’re not “hooked”).

My almost straight A kid didn’t take the very most rigorous math classes. He probably could have done it, but he would have been miserable. He was accepted to six excellent colleges, albeit not “top 20,” all with significant merit aid. He had a mostly pleasant, relatively stress-free HS experience, and is very happy with his college choice. Read the results threads. There are a LOT of kids out there who pushed themselves hard in HS who are disappointed with their results because their expectations were not realistic.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2022 13:27     Subject: Re:Parents of seniors - what should my 9th grader be doing now to ensure a solid college application?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Take at least Calc AB by 12th, as well as at least 4 years of foreign language and at least an honors physics course.

This is regardless of intended major if you’re aiming for top schools.


Do you need to take 4 years of a foreign language if your kid was in an immersion program and takes the AP level course in 9th grade? DC is more interested in STEM subjects and we're hoping to load up on all the math and science APs, plus one year of AP Spanish, then stay in honors or even regular English and humanities classes.


This is my DC's exact situation- taking AP French now, in 9th grade, after going to an immersion school. We had a lot of discussion about this with her guidance counselor, who recommended that she start another language next year since colleges want to see several years of language taken during high school (not high school credit earned in middle school). DC is not thrilled, as she was looking forward to being done with a language and taking electives that she was more interested in. She is actually in a STEM program and this is still the recommendation. Not sure if she will take three more years though- probably only two. From a parent's perspective, it seems kind of ridiculous- she has four years of high school foreign language credit taken in middle school (for French and another language) and one year of AP French taken in HS and she is not likely to become fluent after taking three years of HS Spanish, so what is really the point?


Take this with a grain of salt, but my oldest made the calculated decision to stop foreign language after Spanish 3 sophomore year of HS. He was not at all a foreign language kid and certainly wasn't going to go any further in it just for the sake of having 3-4 years in HS to make him more attractive to private/liberal arts focused colleges. Instead he loaded up on the STEM classes and CS -- AP Physics 1 and C, Honors Chem plus AP Chem, Calc BC, multivariate, AP Java, engineering design, etc. But he was targeting public in-state and OOS big STEM-specialized colleges and is now double-majoring in Physics and CS at UMD, where he only needed 2 years of a FL recommended anyway if I recall. But he wasn't applying to Dartmouth and Brown or Cornell Arts & Sciences where they intend to turn out Renaissance scholars.

I'd think in your DC's situation that they'd be even better positioned in that she will have the AP. Is there a French 6 language/literature option maybe? Or maybe one year of ASL? If she took that, she'd have two years of FL in HS, plus if that immersion program shows up on the transcript as HS credit, that's really what she needs. Since she's targeting STEM, that seems like a great all-around package to me -- two years in HS of FL but then take those slots for STEM or something else interesting (arts? music?). I'd still have her do honors/AP humanities (English/social studies) to demonstrate breadth, but it does seem silly for her particular case to start over with three years in another language just to check that box.
Anonymous
Post 04/27/2022 22:32     Subject: Re:Parents of seniors - what should my 9th grader be doing now to ensure a solid college application?
This isn’t so much related to your 9th grader, but either have them grind for scholarships or start increasing 529 contributions.
Anonymous
Post 04/27/2022 22:29     Subject: Parents of seniors - what should my 9th grader be doing now to ensure a solid college application?
Anonymous wrote:1- Get good grades
2- Develop a top relationship with the guidance counselor who will write the recommendation
3- Don't get fixated on any particular college or group of colleges
4- Be themselves and have fun


Pretty much agree with this. DC didn't have such a great freshman year, but the grades def went into an upward trajectory. DC had a great relationship with the college counselor and we believe the counselor really went to bat for DC who got in ED1 at a reach based on GPA, but probably not on test score and evolving ability.
Anonymous
Post 04/27/2022 21:41     Subject: Re:Parents of seniors - what should my 9th grader be doing now to ensure a solid college application?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Take at least Calc AB by 12th, as well as at least 4 years of foreign language and at least an honors physics course.

This is regardless of intended major if you’re aiming for top schools.


Do you need to take 4 years of a foreign language if your kid was in an immersion program and takes the AP level course in 9th grade? DC is more interested in STEM subjects and we're hoping to load up on all the math and science APs, plus one year of AP Spanish, then stay in honors or even regular English and humanities classes.


This is my DC's exact situation- taking AP French now, in 9th grade, after going to an immersion school. We had a lot of discussion about this with her guidance counselor, who recommended that she start another language next year since colleges want to see several years of language taken during high school (not high school credit earned in middle school). DC is not thrilled, as she was looking forward to being done with a language and taking electives that she was more interested in. She is actually in a STEM program and this is still the recommendation. Not sure if she will take three more years though- probably only two. From a parent's perspective, it seems kind of ridiculous- she has four years of high school foreign language credit taken in middle school (for French and another language) and one year of AP French taken in HS and she is not likely to become fluent after taking three years of HS Spanish, so what is really the point?
Anonymous
Post 04/27/2022 20:26     Subject: Parents of seniors - what should my 9th grader be doing now to ensure a solid college application?
1- Get good grades
2- Develop a top relationship with the guidance counselor who will write the recommendation
3- Don't get fixated on any particular college or group of colleges
4- Be themselves and have fun
Anonymous
Post 04/27/2022 20:20     Subject: Re:Parents of seniors - what should my 9th grader be doing now to ensure a solid college application?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:PP here. Forgot to add, make sure your child takes at least one of the following: 1 year of Chem, 1 year of bio and 1 year of physics. Preferably honors & AP.


NP. I realize graduation requirement doesn't always equal what is advisable for competitive college admissions. What if student is def not going into STEM, should they still take Physics, Bio, Chem, and Calculus? DC will start a school that requires 2 years of lab sciences including Biology, but beyond that students can take 'fun' electives in science or load of up on other subjects of interest, whether arts or history.


Our child is not math focused whatsoever (much stronger in language arts as well as performing and visual arts). Her private school only requires three years of math. She’s a rising 9th grader so we haven’t mapped things out, but I’ll be curious to see what happens. Would most colleges frown on only three years of math course work?


In my kids' public school system (MoCo MD), four years of HS math isn't optional -- it's mandatory. That doesn't mean that the kid who hates math will be forced to take multivariable calculus, but they will have to find a math class to take every year. That could be statistics or quantitative literacy (budgeting, investing, etc.). I'd imagine your private school has to have similar offerings, but I would still plan for your child to take math all four years.

You're still at such an early stage of college planning, but it's not too early for you (and other parents of rising 9th graders) to get a grasp on what your HS graduation requirements are and what the course options are. For each of my three kids, we've sat down with a spreadsheet to register for courses for freshman year and sketched out a plan (even if not fully fleshed out) for all four years to satisfy graduation requirements and figure out how to protect interests/electives. Each year when course registration rolls around we update it. For example, my oldest wanted to be in jazz band all four years but that meant taking health and his tech ed requirement during the summers. He didn't want to continue his foreign language after three years because he wanted to fit in two years of CS instead. Etc. Even if there is flexibility as interests change, it's still important to see how the pieces/parts fit together and sketch out a roadmap upfront.
Anonymous
Post 04/27/2022 19:58     Subject: Re:Parents of seniors - what should my 9th grader be doing now to ensure a solid college application?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Take at least Calc AB by 12th, as well as at least 4 years of foreign language and at least an honors physics course.

This is regardless of intended major if you’re aiming for top schools.


This kind of advice is a great way to end up with a kid with mental health issues. Kids should never start off with the assumption that they're going to be applying to "top schools" and then try to force their way into being a strong candidate by following some formula that's worked for others. They should work hard in the most rigorous courses they can be successful in and then see what's possible.


Then you realize in 12th grade that you haven’t taken the courses you needed to take if you decide to apply to top schools.


Do you really think the most selective colleges will turn down a kid with scores of 5 on every math and science AP offered because they didn't take a language all 4 years? That they'll pass on a winner of a national award in journalism because they never made it to calculus?

Kids should do what they love and are good at, and put everything they've got into that. Stop trying to figure out a formula and then trying to force it to work for every kid.


Sure there are exceptions for the national journalism award or the kid who is majoring in dance and is in shows 4x a year at Washington ballet, but that isn’t most kids, not even your “smart” kids who is the lead in the plays and in the select choir is viewed like that - they want to see calculus for those “average local stars” if the school they are applying to is selective. Colleges have firm things that will eliminate the general student - xx score, calculus, 4 yes language etc. it’s a universal way to start the weeding out process.
Anonymous
Post 04/27/2022 19:57     Subject: Re:Parents of seniors - what should my 9th grader be doing now to ensure a solid college application?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Do not rush math. Both my kids were skipped a year ahead in math in 9th grade. In hindsight, this was a bad move. Schools were not impressed by AP calc classes a year or two early with Bs. Better to be “on time” with As.

Do not take AP world history. Not worth the ding to their GPA unless they LOVE history.

The trick is to max out APs without taking the ones that might hurt your GPA. “Most rigorous” but not really.

Don’t have any life changes or experiences that interfere with getting As. Selective colleges aren’t forgiving about mistakes after 8th grade. Even if the kids’ father commits suicide in 10th grade. True story. They want grit and tears PLUS the 4.8 GPA. (Why are kids so stressed and anxious? Such a mystery)



I have never understood parents pushing their kids to be advanced in math. When I lived in MD, parents would be in the school screaming that little Susie deserved and belonged in "1 grade level ahead math" because she'd been doing Kumon since she was 2. However, during the "test at school" she didn't test at a level to be put in advanced math. But little Susie knew how to memorize math facts, but didn't really understand them or think at an advanced level. I watched several kids get put into the advanced math due to parental pressure and those kids struggled and were not happy in math class. I suspect they would do much better if they had been at their actual level and allowed to actually learn.
Math is so important to so much in life and so many careers, why would you not want your kid to be working at the level that is appropriate for them? Math is so cyclical, if you don't have a strong foundation, Algebra 1 and beyond is going to be a challenge. Why rush it?



Have you not read the thread? People don't care about mastery, or even competency. That is not the OP. People care about doing everything possible to get their kid to the best school possible. That's why you have parents pushing things they don't know about. Upthread someone says you need to get national recognition for a selective college. These threads keep fanning the flames. This is why kids are burnt out and can't think for themselves.


I agree with you---that was my point. People push their kids for reasons that don't make sense and in return are creating unhealthy situations (including mental health). So happy to be out of the DCUM area. So refreshing to see people be a bit more grounded.
Anonymous
Post 04/27/2022 19:55     Subject: Re:Parents of seniors - what should my 9th grader be doing now to ensure a solid college application?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Do not rush math. Both my kids were skipped a year ahead in math in 9th grade. In hindsight, this was a bad move. Schools were not impressed by AP calc classes a year or two early with Bs. Better to be “on time” with As.

Do not take AP world history. Not worth the ding to their GPA unless they LOVE history.

The trick is to max out APs without taking the ones that might hurt your GPA. “Most rigorous” but not really.

Don’t have any life changes or experiences that interfere with getting As. Selective colleges aren’t forgiving about mistakes after 8th grade. Even if the kids’ father commits suicide in 10th grade. True story. They want grit and tears PLUS the 4.8 GPA. (Why are kids so stressed and anxious? Such a mystery)



I have never understood parents pushing their kids to be advanced in math. When I lived in MD, parents would be in the school screaming that little Susie deserved and belonged in "1 grade level ahead math" because she'd been doing Kumon since she was 2. However, during the "test at school" she didn't test at a level to be put in advanced math. But little Susie knew how to memorize math facts, but didn't really understand them or think at an advanced level. I watched several kids get put into the advanced math due to parental pressure and those kids struggled and were not happy in math class. I suspect they would do much better if they had been at their actual level and allowed to actually learn.
Math is so important to so much in life and so many careers, why would you not want your kid to be working at the level that is appropriate for them? Math is so cyclical, if you don't have a strong foundation, Algebra 1 and beyond is going to be a challenge. Why rush it?



I’m PP and I agree. My kids were placed by their schools through school testing and teacher recommendations, though, not me. It wasn’t awful and my kids did like math, but they also got Bs in AP math and colleges want As. No one cares when you took it. I think it’s fine at the lower grades if they enjoy it and do well, but dial back in 9th grade. There’s enough to do.
Anonymous
Post 04/27/2022 19:54     Subject: Parents of seniors - what should my 9th grader be doing now to ensure a solid college application?
Be realistic with them about their options. Don’t have them set on UVA of that’s just not going to be a realistic
Option, get them excited about JMU or whatever. Take 4 years of core subjects and get to calculus for math. Have them do one sport for four years, even if it’s like XC and they suck. Instill healthy sleep habits.