If you push a kid into a career and they hate it, they will resent you forever. I know some parents that forced their DC to pick a career just because a stupid aptitude test pointed to a specific obscure job. College was a battle and she isn't using her degree. She is working in retail.

Anonymous wrote:Gosh, I was full of teen attitude when it came time to go through the college admission process. I don't know if I was freaked out about leaving home or just intimidated or what, but I was not willing to take the lead despite being an excellent student. I just wanted to focus on senior year and my ECs. Fortunately my mom stepped up and made me do it. Did she want to? No. Was I a cooperative participant? No. Would many here disapprove? Yup. But it worked out a million times better for the both of us that I got into a good college and left home the following fall. I ended up excelling in college, attending grad school on a full fellowship, and having an excellent career, all without any parent assistance. Notnapplying and floundering at home wouldn't have been good for either of us.

Sometimes teen are going to teen. Parents are there for a reason. No judgment here. I don't know how it will go with my kids, but I'll do my best for their longterm success, whatever I think that looks like at the time.

Great story for those that think help can only be one way or another. Sometimes when my DCs were (1) floundering and (2) not wanting to engage in the college process, I would simply tell them that they probably would not be happy bumping into me next fall when getting coffee in the morning because that is what would be happening if they stayed on their current trajectory. In the moment, it had no effect and maybe not at all, but I just wanted them to know that doing nothing yields a declining, usually unsatisfying, status quo.

Anonymous wrote:My regret is not pushing them harder in high school for better grades.

I have the same regret. If I had to do it over again, I would have cut sports out. Sports sucked up too much time, money and energy and for what.....a bunch of sports injuries that will haunt them for the rest of their lives? I don't understand the emphasis put on sports in HS.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is the level of my involvement:
1. I created one Google doc that had the due dates and application requirements for the schools they were applying to.
2. I worked out the schedule and drove them to campus visits.
3. I did the FAFSA form (it's really hard for a kid to do that--so much of it is really about your finances.)
4. I paid for the SAT registration.
5. I proofread their essays. Proofread as in not editing--only just being a second pair of eyes to spot typos or a "there vs. their" type error. The same thing my DH and I do for each other when writing more significant things for work.
That's it. Everything else was on them.
I don't think folks are doing kids any favors with excessive help, because then you just set them up to have a particularly hard crash come freshman year at college.

I think this is reasonable.

Except for #1.....the child should drive the process from start to finish.

Gosh, I was full of teen attitude when it came time to go through the college admission process. I don't know if I was freaked out about leaving home or just intimidated or what, but I was not willing to take the lead despite being an excellent student. I just wanted to focus on senior year and my ECs. Fortunately my mom stepped up and made me do it. Did she want to? No. Was I a cooperative participant? No. Would many here disapprove? Yup. But it worked out a million times better for the both of us that I got into a good college and left home the following fall. I ended up excelling in college, attending grad school on a full fellowship, and having an excellent career, all without any parent assistance. Notnapplying and floundering at home wouldn't have been good for either of us.

Sometimes teen are going to teen. Parents are there for a reason. No judgment here. I don't know how it will go with my kids, but I'll do my best for their longterm success, whatever I think that looks like at the time.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nope. DH and I each have multiple degrees from Ivies etc etc, but we did not want our kids to be hothouse flowers. We let them do the things they liked and not do the things they hated. We gave support when needed academically (e.g, a few months of math tutoring if they were struggling), but urged them to focus on doing their best without making themselves crazy, not on grades.

DC1 now at a top 50 SLAC and very happy. DC 2 a HS senior and a bit more academic; applying to schools in top 20 and (we hope!) will get into several. Both kids are good humans, kind and funny and creative and smart and resilient.

Maybe they'd both have ended up at HYP if we had enrolled them in math enrichment, violin and Mandarin from an early aged and pushed them from one lesson or sport to another. But I doubt they would be happier people or better humans. I am confident that they will have successful lives and careers regardless.

+1

Same situation and wholeheartedly agree. There are parents who believe that that there are only one or two (maybe, possibly, three or four) professions in which to make a living. This is absurd and they are doing their children an enormous disservice. Children are not robots - you can't program them.

Oh, spare me. This poster's kids simply didn't have the grades or the goods for top schools. All the programming in the world makes no difference if you don't have the minimum. Revisionist history.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is the level of my involvement:
1. I created one Google doc that had the due dates and application requirements for the schools they were applying to.
2. I worked out the schedule and drove them to campus visits.
3. I did the FAFSA form (it's really hard for a kid to do that--so much of it is really about your finances.)
4. I paid for the SAT registration.
5. I proofread their essays. Proofread as in not editing--only just being a second pair of eyes to spot typos or a "there vs. their" type error. The same thing my DH and I do for each other when writing more significant things for work.
That's it. Everything else was on them.
I don't think folks are doing kids any favors with excessive help, because then you just set them up to have a particularly hard crash come freshman year at college.

I think this is reasonable.

As do I. Except the poster laid this out like she did nothing to help. And this isn't nothing. Many parents do less.

+1

Schools know entirely which parents are over involved in the process - a programmed kid is no good to them.

Anonymous wrote:Nope. DH and I each have multiple degrees from Ivies etc etc, but we did not want our kids to be hothouse flowers. We let them do the things they liked and not do the things they hated. We gave support when needed academically (e.g, a few months of math tutoring if they were struggling), but urged them to focus on doing their best without making themselves crazy, not on grades.

DC1 now at a top 50 SLAC and very happy. DC 2 a HS senior and a bit more academic; applying to schools in top 20 and (we hope!) will get into several. Both kids are good humans, kind and funny and creative and smart and resilient.

Maybe they'd both have ended up at HYP if we had enrolled them in math enrichment, violin and Mandarin from an early aged and pushed them from one lesson or sport to another. But I doubt they would be happier people or better humans. I am confident that they will have successful lives and careers regardless.

+1

Same situation and wholeheartedly agree. There are parents who believe that that there are only one or two (maybe, possibly, three or four) professions in which to make a living. This is absurd and they are doing their children an enormous disservice. Children are not robots - you can't program them.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is the level of my involvement:
1. I created one Google doc that had the due dates and application requirements for the schools they were applying to.
2. I worked out the schedule and drove them to campus visits.
3. I did the FAFSA form (it's really hard for a kid to do that--so much of it is really about your finances.)
4. I paid for the SAT registration.
5. I proofread their essays. Proofread as in not editing--only just being a second pair of eyes to spot typos or a "there vs. their" type error. The same thing my DH and I do for each other when writing more significant things for work.
That's it. Everything else was on them.
I don't think folks are doing kids any favors with excessive help, because then you just set them up to have a particularly hard crash come freshman year at college.

I think this is reasonable.

As do I. Except the poster laid this out like she did nothing to help. And this isn't nothing. Many parents do less.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Am I the only one with a contrarian, obstinate kid who refused almost all proffered help/guidance (including an executive function/ADHD coach, language tutor, SAT class, college counselor, tho reluctantly let us read essay after big resistance)? So kid who is smarter than all get out (except in some ways it matters most, like accepting help when needed), is going to end up at a much less selective school than his IQ would predict, because of his less than perfect gpa, and probably his less than perfect application, which we didn’t review because he wouldn’t show us, except for the essay. It is what it is.

I'm having trouble understanding what makes a stubborn kid with a low GPA and all of those other problems "smarter than all get out." I'm guessing it's because he has high test scores. That alone makes no one "smarter than all get out."

Stupid is as stupid does.

Dp. The kid who won't take help and is smarter than all get out sounds like my DH who has a PhD and is really smart! His father tried to push him?angel to upset him, and made it 100 times worse. He ended up graduating from high school as a B student with zero work ethic. He basically was a mess until his mid-to-late 20s. Some kids are late bloomers and it is hard for parents to see.

And that was obviously the result of bad parenting (if any) from the very beginning.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Am I the only one with a contrarian, obstinate kid who refused almost all proffered help/guidance (including an executive function/ADHD coach, language tutor, SAT class, college counselor, tho reluctantly let us read essay after big resistance)? So kid who is smarter than all get out (except in some ways it matters most, like accepting help when needed), is going to end up at a much less selective school than his IQ would predict, because of his less than perfect gpa, and probably his less than perfect application, which we didn’t review because he wouldn’t show us, except for the essay. It is what it is.

I'm having trouble understanding what makes a stubborn kid with a low GPA and all of those other problems "smarter than all get out." I'm guessing it's because he has high test scores. That alone makes no one "smarter than all get out."

Stupid is as stupid does.

Dp. The kid who won't take help and is smarter than all get out sounds like my DH who has a PhD and is really smart! His father tried to push him?angel to upset him, and made it 100 times worse. He ended up graduating from high school as a B student with zero work ethic. He basically was a mess until his mid-to-late 20s. Some kids are late bloomers and it is hard for parents to see.

Parental guidance and some hands on involvement is good. I am confident of that. Of course definitely it can go too far so it is a balancing act.

A lot of this thread is from a very upper class perspective and reflect upper class concerns. I went to high school in a midwestern working class area. Most of my classmates received almost zero guidance from their parents academically or professionally. They clearly suffered for it. It is unusual for a teenager to have the maturity and vision to navigate through a complex world on their own.

Anonymous wrote:This is the level of my involvement:
1. I created one Google doc that had the due dates and application requirements for the schools they were applying to.
2. I worked out the schedule and drove them to campus visits.
3. I did the FAFSA form (it's really hard for a kid to do that--so much of it is really about your finances.)
4. I paid for the SAT registration.
5. I proofread their essays. Proofread as in not editing--only just being a second pair of eyes to spot typos or a "there vs. their" type error. The same thing my DH and I do for each other when writing more significant things for work.
That's it. Everything else was on them.
I don't think folks are doing kids any favors with excessive help, because then you just set them up to have a particularly hard crash come freshman year at college.

I think this is reasonable.

I am very close to my child. She runs in the living room to read emails that announce good news (when she is home). She knows how proud I am of her hard work and the accomplishments that it has enabled.

I am also a professor, so can give her inside tips regarding college.

BUT, I believed she should take the lead with the whole college search (deciding what type of school she wanted, which to visit, which to apply to, which to accept). She chose her essay topic, wrote a draft, and I read it over (as did an English teacher at her public school) to point out problematic areas (such as this," is awkward" or "needs to be broken into two sentences").

I was always available, to talk things over and take her to see schools (which I know is a luxury that COVID or finances did not permit for some families).

Now that she is in college, I have NO involvement with her assignments of course. I do, upon her request, read over essays for internship or grad school applications. That is the extent of it.

It has worked for us. She is doing well. She has gained confidence and independence since high school. Part of that confidence was the result of making her own decisions, and seeing that I had faith in her ability to do so.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nope. DH and I each have multiple degrees from Ivies etc etc, but we did not want our kids to be hothouse flowers. We let them do the things they liked and not do the things they hated. We gave support when needed academically (e.g, a few months of math tutoring if they were struggling), but urged them to focus on doing their best without making themselves crazy, not on grades.

DC1 now at a top 50 SLAC and very happy. DC 2 a HS senior and a bit more academic; applying to schools in top 20 and (we hope!) will get into several. Both kids are good humans, kind and funny and creative and smart and resilient.

Maybe they'd both have ended up at HYP if we had enrolled them in math enrichment, violin and Mandarin from an early aged and pushed them from one lesson or sport to another. But I doubt they would be happier people or better humans. I am confident that they will have successful lives and careers regardless.

Why it is necessary to tell us you are Ivy graduates? And let me guess: the top 50 school your kid attends is a CTCL school.

Personal insecurities. Not just one but "multiple degrees"... LOL at that.

You guys are harsh, I read it as "we are exactly they type of parents you would expect to push our kids to get into Ivies because that was our experience and anything less would be failure" -- but her point is that they aren't like that even though you might have expected them to be so.

But here's the thing. They ARE "like that." They're saying they really hope their second kid gets into "several" top 20s. They clearly care about college rankings.