Anonymous
03/07/2021 10:31
Subject: Help me understand the impact of a $15 minimum wage?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:If you ask someone to work for you for full time hours, but don't pay them enough to reasonably sustain themselves, you've essentially got yourself an indentured servant. Are we really okay with that as a country? Having an underclass of indentured servants that we allow the merchant class to abuse and treat however they want?
If you offer someone a job and tell them upfront the wage you are willing to pay, and the person says YES to your offer, then you’ve got yourself an employee who has entered into an at-will agreement to work for you at the wage you both agreed upon.
And in most cases, the wage is very clearly indicated in the job posting. The “indentured servant” need not apply to that job of the wage is not suitable to them.
Buddy, you ever been hungry?
Anonymous
03/07/2021 10:31
Subject: Help me understand the impact of a $15 minimum wage?
Anonymous wrote:If you ask someone to work for you for full time hours, but don't pay them enough to reasonably sustain themselves, you've essentially got yourself an indentured servant. Are we really okay with that as a country? Having an underclass of indentured servants that we allow the merchant class to abuse and treat however they want?
If you offer someone a job and tell them upfront the wage you are willing to pay, and the person says YES to your offer, then you’ve got yourself an employee who has entered into an at-will agreement to work for you at the wage you both agreed upon.
And in most cases, the wage is very clearly indicated in the job posting. The “indentured servant” need not apply to that job of the wage is not suitable to them.
Anonymous
03/07/2021 10:28
Subject: Help me understand the impact of a $15 minimum wage?
Let them eat cake, right?
That went real well.
That went real well.
Anonymous
03/07/2021 10:26
Subject: Help me understand the impact of a $15 minimum wage?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:15k a year does not pay for food, rent, and health care. No way in hell. Add in public transportation, childcare, and utilities and you are SOL but working 40 hours a week. Absurdly low: and explains the exponential growth in cost or government services we’ve seen since the 50’s. People cannot get by on their own labor, and it’s time to fix that.
So now you’ve added health care and child care....
Minimum wage is not and was never designed to support a family.
No health care? really? you really think people should be without health care?
And if you don't let people have families, prepare for the revolution.
You can have families, but again, minimum wage is for minimum skills and not designed to be a permanent wage to raise a family on.
If you can’t better yourself, that’s on you, not me.
Work. A full days work, no matter how unskilled, should be paid based on the value of the worker’s time, i.e. the cost of LIVING. Not some random person’s valuation of what their output is worth. If the job doesn’t generate enough revenue to pay for a person’s time, it’s not a job. It’s indentured servitude.
Then don’t take the job. You set the value of your time, not the employer. If you take the minimum wage job, you have decided you’re only worth the minimum. It’s not a "random persons valuation" it’s yours as the employee.
Yes!!!!! Bingo!!! Ding ding ding!!!
The number of people who don’t get how the at-will free market labor system works is astounding.
If you can’t get someone to pay you more for your time it means they found someone else who will do that same work for less. So then you go get some other/different skills that have fewer people able or willing to do that job so that you can command more $$.
A house cleaner works just as hard as a plumber. But the plumber knows that since it takes more and different training to learn the skills of a plumber (and do there are likely fewer who can perform the job of a plumber), she can demand more for her time than if she were working as a housekeeper.
Of course, a plumber can also try to set their own rate at 40% higher than other plumbers charge, but that will lead to fewer jobs for that plumber because the free market allows competition.
No we understand. We understand that employers will absolutely pay the lowest possible price for labor, including not paying at all, if people are desperate enough.
Anonymous
03/07/2021 10:23
Subject: Help me understand the impact of a $15 minimum wage?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:15k a year does not pay for food, rent, and health care. No way in hell. Add in public transportation, childcare, and utilities and you are SOL but working 40 hours a week. Absurdly low: and explains the exponential growth in cost or government services we’ve seen since the 50’s. People cannot get by on their own labor, and it’s time to fix that.
So now you’ve added health care and child care....
Minimum wage is not and was never designed to support a family.
No health care? really? you really think people should be without health care?
And if you don't let people have families, prepare for the revolution.
You can have families, but again, minimum wage is for minimum skills and not designed to be a permanent wage to raise a family on.
If you can’t better yourself, that’s on you, not me.
Work. A full days work, no matter how unskilled, should be paid based on the value of the worker’s time, i.e. the cost of LIVING. Not some random person’s valuation of what their output is worth. If the job doesn’t generate enough revenue to pay for a person’s time, it’s not a job. It’s indentured servitude.
Then don’t take the job. You set the value of your time, not the employer. If you take the minimum wage job, you have decided you’re only worth the minimum. It’s not a "random persons valuation" it’s yours as the employee.
Yes!!!!! Bingo!!! Ding ding ding!!!
The number of people who don’t get how the at-will free market labor system works is astounding.
If you can’t get someone to pay you more for your time it means they found someone else who will do that same work for less. So then you go get some other/different skills that have fewer people able or willing to do that job so that you can command more $$.
A house cleaner works just as hard as a plumber. But the plumber knows that since it takes more and different training to learn the skills of a plumber (and do there are likely fewer who can perform the job of a plumber), she can demand more for her time than if she were working as a housekeeper.
Of course, a plumber can also try to set their own rate at 40% higher than other plumbers charge, but that will lead to fewer jobs for that plumber because the free market allows competition.
Anonymous
03/07/2021 09:56
Subject: Help me understand the impact of a $15 minimum wage?
Anonymous wrote:If you ask someone to work for you for full time hours, but don't pay them enough to reasonably sustain themselves, you've essentially got yourself an indentured servant. Are we really okay with that as a country? Having an underclass of indentured servants that we allow the merchant class to abuse and treat however they want?
Well yes, apparently we have been okay with it at various times in our history. But I appreciate you pointing it out. Enough is enough.
Anonymous
03/07/2021 09:45
Subject: Help me understand the impact of a $15 minimum wage?
If you ask someone to work for you for full time hours, but don't pay them enough to reasonably sustain themselves, you've essentially got yourself an indentured servant. Are we really okay with that as a country? Having an underclass of indentured servants that we allow the merchant class to abuse and treat however they want?
Anonymous
03/07/2021 09:43
Subject: Help me understand the impact of a $15 minimum wage?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:15k a year does not pay for food, rent, and health care. No way in hell. Add in public transportation, childcare, and utilities and you are SOL but working 40 hours a week. Absurdly low: and explains the exponential growth in cost or government services we’ve seen since the 50’s. People cannot get by on their own labor, and it’s time to fix that.
So now you’ve added health care and child care....
Minimum wage is not and was never designed to support a family.
No health care? really? you really think people should be without health care?
And if you don't let people have families, prepare for the revolution.
You can have families, but again, minimum wage is for minimum skills and not designed to be a permanent wage to raise a family on.
If you can’t better yourself, that’s on you, not me.
When it was created, minimum wage could support a family of 3 above the poverty line. It has only been since the 1980s that we've decided minimum wage is for teenagers and losers who should never have families. The reality is that we need people working those jobs, even if we all want to pretend the jobs have no value.
The minimum wage was ALWAYS intended to be a living wage. Someone working a full-time job should make enough to live on. That's just basic decency, and surely we, in one of the richest and supposed greatest countries on earth, can muster this basic level of decency for our lowest paid workers.
Anonymous
03/07/2021 09:40
Subject: Help me understand the impact of a $15 minimum wage?
I had an uncle who was unable to keep a job, other than a minimum wage type job. He was probably autistic but no one back then knew what that was or what to do about it. He had a hard time in life. He was lucky his brother was rich and successful, or he would have been homeless. I saw how working but not being able to afford to pay for his own food, housing and health care, diminished him as a human being, and made him feel like his brother’s servant. It taught me something valuable about power and money. Raise the minimum wage.
Anonymous
03/07/2021 09:18
Subject: Help me understand the impact of a $15 minimum wage?
The alternative to a higher minimum wage, is UBI. Or societal unrest. Pick.
Anonymous
03/07/2021 09:16
Subject: Help me understand the impact of a $15 minimum wage?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:15k a year does not pay for food, rent, and health care. No way in hell. Add in public transportation, childcare, and utilities and you are SOL but working 40 hours a week. Absurdly low: and explains the exponential growth in cost or government services we’ve seen since the 50’s. People cannot get by on their own labor, and it’s time to fix that.
So now you’ve added health care and child care....
Minimum wage is not and was never designed to support a family.
No health care? really? you really think people should be without health care?
And if you don't let people have families, prepare for the revolution.
You can have families, but again, minimum wage is for minimum skills and not designed to be a permanent wage to raise a family on.
If you can’t better yourself, that’s on you, not me.
Work. A full days work, no matter how unskilled, should be paid based on the value of the worker’s time, i.e. the cost of LIVING. Not some random person’s valuation of what their output is worth. If the job doesn’t generate enough revenue to pay for a person’s time, it’s not a job. It’s indentured servitude.
Then don’t take the job. You set the value of your time, not the employer. If you take the minimum wage job, you have decided you’re only worth the minimum. It’s not a "random persons valuation" it’s yours as the employee.
Don't you have anybody in your family that isn't particularly bright? there will always be people on the bottom. If you don't make their lives tolerable, they will rise up and revolt. And then yes: it is on you. When they come for you because they have no choice, you will see it is indeed on you. Humans are well known for fighting for what they need.
Anonymous
03/07/2021 09:15
Subject: Help me understand the impact of a $15 minimum wage?
These people would bring back slavery if they could.
Anonymous
03/07/2021 09:15
Subject: Help me understand the impact of a $15 minimum wage?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:15k a year does not pay for food, rent, and health care. No way in hell. Add in public transportation, childcare, and utilities and you are SOL but working 40 hours a week. Absurdly low: and explains the exponential growth in cost or government services we’ve seen since the 50’s. People cannot get by on their own labor, and it’s time to fix that.
So now you’ve added health care and child care....
Minimum wage is not and was never designed to support a family.
No health care? really? you really think people should be without health care?
And if you don't let people have families, prepare for the revolution.
You can have families, but again, minimum wage is for minimum skills and not designed to be a permanent wage to raise a family on.
If you can’t better yourself, that’s on you, not me.
Work. A full days work, no matter how unskilled, should be paid based on the value of the worker’s time, i.e. the cost of LIVING. Not some random person’s valuation of what their output is worth. If the job doesn’t generate enough revenue to pay for a person’s time, it’s not a job. It’s indentured servitude.
Then don’t take the job. You set the value of your time, not the employer. If you take the minimum wage job, you have decided you’re only worth the minimum. It’s not a "random persons valuation" it’s yours as the employee.
People that don’t have skills deserve fair pay. The minimum is too low. It is unfair. It is exploitative. It is dragging our country down. Raising it will substantially decrease poverty. That is a good thing, even for rich people that don’t have to think about things like feeding themselves.
Anonymous
03/07/2021 09:13
Subject: Help me understand the impact of a $15 minimum wage?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:15k a year does not pay for food, rent, and health care. No way in hell. Add in public transportation, childcare, and utilities and you are SOL but working 40 hours a week. Absurdly low: and explains the exponential growth in cost or government services we’ve seen since the 50’s. People cannot get by on their own labor, and it’s time to fix that.
So now you’ve added health care and child care....
Minimum wage is not and was never designed to support a family.
No health care? really? you really think people should be without health care?
And if you don't let people have families, prepare for the revolution.
You can have families, but again, minimum wage is for minimum skills and not designed to be a permanent wage to raise a family on.
If you can’t better yourself, that’s on you, not me.
Work. A full days work, no matter how unskilled, should be paid based on the value of the worker’s time, i.e. the cost of LIVING. Not some random person’s valuation of what their output is worth. If the job doesn’t generate enough revenue to pay for a person’s time, it’s not a job. It’s indentured servitude.
Then don’t take the job. You set the value of your time, not the employer. If you take the minimum wage job, you have decided you’re only worth the minimum. It’s not a "random persons valuation" it’s yours as the employee.
Anonymous
03/07/2021 09:10
Subject: Help me understand the impact of a $15 minimum wage?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:15k a year does not pay for food, rent, and health care. No way in hell. Add in public transportation, childcare, and utilities and you are SOL but working 40 hours a week. Absurdly low: and explains the exponential growth in cost or government services we’ve seen since the 50’s. People cannot get by on their own labor, and it’s time to fix that.
So now you’ve added health care and child care....
Minimum wage is not and was never designed to support a family.
No health care? really? you really think people should be without health care?
And if you don't let people have families, prepare for the revolution.
You can have families, but again, minimum wage is for minimum skills and not designed to be a permanent wage to raise a family on.
If you can’t better yourself, that’s on you, not me.
Work. A full days work, no matter how unskilled, should be paid based on the value of the worker’s time, i.e. the cost of LIVING. Not some random person’s valuation of what their output is worth. If the job doesn’t generate enough revenue to pay for a person’s time, it’s not a job. It’s indentured servitude.