Anonymous wrote:I will say that the folks over on Reddit have a much better understanding of this show than the stay at home moms of the DMV, LOL!

Anonymous wrote:I will say that the folks over on Reddit have a much better understanding of this show than the stay at home moms of the DMV, LOL!

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Anonymous wrote:Haven’t read a lot of the posts, but, agree that I feel puzzled by what decade it is meant to be set in as well as location. All desolate. Constant winter. Weird light at all times. What are we supposed to be taking away from all of that?

I've entertained the idea that the outies are all actually the first layer down in Severance world, a la The Matrix. So the real world is actually a construct, and not physical, which is why everything is slightly off, it's always winter, etc. But there are a lot of things that also contradict that idea.

I just get the impression that Mark is not a hapless victim of Lumon.

One other thing in hung up on—has there been any indication of what knowledge or information the innies vs. outties retain? I couldn’t work out that the innies believed the waterfall they saw during their outdoor adventure thingy was the biggest one in the world. They seem to possess some sort of baseline knowledge of the world-mark knew what sex was, and when we were introduced to Hellie, we didn’t see her go through some of start up programming to inform her baseline intellect. I guess I feel like I can’t reconcile that bit. Did I fall asleep at some point and miss something?

Yeah -- I've been wondering about this too.

I feel like Severance rules are a little like ghost rules - why can ghosts walk through walls but don't fall through the floor? Because otherwise you don't have much of a story, really!

But I think that the severed characters retain sort of the basic knowledge of being an adult human - they know how to go to the bathroom on their own; they know how to use a computer. But they don't have the knowledge specific to their own lives.

Though actually - SPOILERS ****



That's what was being tested at Cold Harbor, right? Whether the severed character retained any knowledge of their previous life, when put into what was essentially the most tragic and emotionally wrecking situation their outie had ever experienced (that we know of). And the answer was no - they don't remember - but also Gemma clearly had something going on that led her to trust Mark and run away with him even when she didn't remember him.

I agree that Lumon gave Gemma’s innie the worst part of her outie’s life to recreate to test the severance procedure. But how did they know her outie had had those miscarriages and had to deconstruct a crib in the first place?

Either they weee spying on them the whole time at their house, or they interrogated Gemma about her life when she first arrived. Maybe through torture or maybe just oretendijg to be doing therapy or something. The dentist and the thank you notes seem like basic things that someone would say if asked “name the top five things you hate…”. The crib is so specific that it could only come up in therapy or if they were spying on them. The fact that the crib was the exact same make/model (as was the screwdriver) suggest that they were spying on them, unless this is a Soviet type world in which there is little consumer choice so everyone owns basically the exact same stuff. (This was one of the weirdest things for me when I lived in Russia — you’d see something that seemed very unique, like a china set with bright orange flowers, and then realize basically everyone had the exact same set because there wax on factory that made tea cups and that was the pattern they had used for a specific period of time.). I think I tend towards Lumpn was spying on them, since it seems that Lumon had tracked Mark and Gemma as being the ideal Guinea pigs from probably a year before. And I think we can probably also blame Gemma’s infertility and miscarriage on Lumon, since we know they have a special nyetest in breeding programs (human and goat).

This is part of the reason why I think Lumon is a closed world and Mark and Gemma volunteered to be there, and likely volunteered to have every part of their life monitored. I hope this is going to be part of season 3.

Did you guys not watch the Mark & Gemma episode? Everything in their world (including the place they donated blood, the fertility clinic, the little cards Gemma was looking at), they were all run by Lumon. Think of it as the Amazon of that world -- Lumon sells all sorts of goods, Lumon has a medical practice, Lumon has a pharmacy, Lumon has a security company/video feeds all over the place, Lumon has speakers in every home, it's impossible to avoid them and impossible for your life to remain private from them.

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Anonymous wrote:Haven’t read a lot of the posts, but, agree that I feel puzzled by what decade it is meant to be set in as well as location. All desolate. Constant winter. Weird light at all times. What are we supposed to be taking away from all of that?

I've entertained the idea that the outies are all actually the first layer down in Severance world, a la The Matrix. So the real world is actually a construct, and not physical, which is why everything is slightly off, it's always winter, etc. But there are a lot of things that also contradict that idea.

I just get the impression that Mark is not a hapless victim of Lumon.

One other thing in hung up on—has there been any indication of what knowledge or information the innies vs. outties retain? I couldn’t work out that the innies believed the waterfall they saw during their outdoor adventure thingy was the biggest one in the world. They seem to possess some sort of baseline knowledge of the world-mark knew what sex was, and when we were introduced to Hellie, we didn’t see her go through some of start up programming to inform her baseline intellect. I guess I feel like I can’t reconcile that bit. Did I fall asleep at some point and miss something?

Yeah -- I've been wondering about this too.

I feel like Severance rules are a little like ghost rules - why can ghosts walk through walls but don't fall through the floor? Because otherwise you don't have much of a story, really!

But I think that the severed characters retain sort of the basic knowledge of being an adult human - they know how to go to the bathroom on their own; they know how to use a computer. But they don't have the knowledge specific to their own lives.

Though actually - SPOILERS ****



That's what was being tested at Cold Harbor, right? Whether the severed character retained any knowledge of their previous life, when put into what was essentially the most tragic and emotionally wrecking situation their outie had ever experienced (that we know of). And the answer was no - they don't remember - but also Gemma clearly had something going on that led her to trust Mark and run away with him even when she didn't remember him.

I agree that Lumon gave Gemma’s innie the worst part of her outie’s life to recreate to test the severance procedure. But how did they know her outie had had those miscarriages and had to deconstruct a crib in the first place?

Either they weee spying on them the whole time at their house, or they interrogated Gemma about her life when she first arrived. Maybe through torture or maybe just oretendijg to be doing therapy or something. The dentist and the thank you notes seem like basic things that someone would say if asked “name the top five things you hate…”. The crib is so specific that it could only come up in therapy or if they were spying on them. The fact that the crib was the exact same make/model (as was the screwdriver) suggest that they were spying on them, unless this is a Soviet type world in which there is little consumer choice so everyone owns basically the exact same stuff. (This was one of the weirdest things for me when I lived in Russia — you’d see something that seemed very unique, like a china set with bright orange flowers, and then realize basically everyone had the exact same set because there wax on factory that made tea cups and that was the pattern they had used for a specific period of time.). I think I tend towards Lumpn was spying on them, since it seems that Lumon had tracked Mark and Gemma as being the ideal Guinea pigs from probably a year before. And I think we can probably also blame Gemma’s infertility and miscarriage on Lumon, since we know they have a special nyetest in breeding programs (human and goat).

This is part of the reason why I think Lumon is a closed world and Mark and Gemma volunteered to be there, and likely volunteered to have every part of their life monitored. I hope this is going to be part of season 3.

Did you guys not watch the Mark & Gemma episode? Everything in their world (including the place they donated blood, the fertility clinic, the little cards Gemma was looking at), they were all run by Lumon. Think of it as the Amazon of that world -- Lumon sells all sorts of goods, Lumon has a medical practice, Lumon has a pharmacy, Lumon has a security company/video feeds all over the place, Lumon has speakers in every home, it's impossible to avoid them and impossible for your life to remain private from them.

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Haven’t read a lot of the posts, but, agree that I feel puzzled by what decade it is meant to be set in as well as location. All desolate. Constant winter. Weird light at all times. What are we supposed to be taking away from all of that?

I've entertained the idea that the outies are all actually the first layer down in Severance world, a la The Matrix. So the real world is actually a construct, and not physical, which is why everything is slightly off, it's always winter, etc. But there are a lot of things that also contradict that idea.

I just get the impression that Mark is not a hapless victim of Lumon.

One other thing in hung up on—has there been any indication of what knowledge or information the innies vs. outties retain? I couldn’t work out that the innies believed the waterfall they saw during their outdoor adventure thingy was the biggest one in the world. They seem to possess some sort of baseline knowledge of the world-mark knew what sex was, and when we were introduced to Hellie, we didn’t see her go through some of start up programming to inform her baseline intellect. I guess I feel like I can’t reconcile that bit. Did I fall asleep at some point and miss something?

Yeah -- I've been wondering about this too.

I feel like Severance rules are a little like ghost rules - why can ghosts walk through walls but don't fall through the floor? Because otherwise you don't have much of a story, really!

But I think that the severed characters retain sort of the basic knowledge of being an adult human - they know how to go to the bathroom on their own; they know how to use a computer. But they don't have the knowledge specific to their own lives.

Though actually - SPOILERS ****



That's what was being tested at Cold Harbor, right? Whether the severed character retained any knowledge of their previous life, when put into what was essentially the most tragic and emotionally wrecking situation their outie had ever experienced (that we know of). And the answer was no - they don't remember - but also Gemma clearly had something going on that led her to trust Mark and run away with him even when she didn't remember him.

I agree that Lumon gave Gemma’s innie the worst part of her outie’s life to recreate to test the severance procedure. But how did they know her outie had had those miscarriages and had to deconstruct a crib in the first place?

Either they weee spying on them the whole time at their house, or they interrogated Gemma about her life when she first arrived. Maybe through torture or maybe just oretendijg to be doing therapy or something. The dentist and the thank you notes seem like basic things that someone would say if asked “name the top five things you hate…”. The crib is so specific that it could only come up in therapy or if they were spying on them. The fact that the crib was the exact same make/model (as was the screwdriver) suggest that they were spying on them, unless this is a Soviet type world in which there is little consumer choice so everyone owns basically the exact same stuff. (This was one of the weirdest things for me when I lived in Russia — you’d see something that seemed very unique, like a china set with bright orange flowers, and then realize basically everyone had the exact same set because there wax on factory that made tea cups and that was the pattern they had used for a specific period of time.). I think I tend towards Lumpn was spying on them, since it seems that Lumon had tracked Mark and Gemma as being the ideal Guinea pigs from probably a year before. And I think we can probably also blame Gemma’s infertility and miscarriage on Lumon, since we know they have a special nyetest in breeding programs (human and goat).

This is part of the reason why I think Lumon is a closed world and Mark and Gemma volunteered to be there, and likely volunteered to have every part of their life monitored. I hope this is going to be part of season 3.

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Anonymous wrote:Milchek is such a weird guy. Like he clearly hates his job but will do anything for it. I guess that tracks with a world where Lumom is basically the only employer. Does marks sister work? If so, do we know what she does or did? She seems very smart.

He may be the best character on the show.

There are strong racial undertones surrounding his hatred of his job. It's really interesting and I'd like to see more about it in S3.

When they made Kier black I was done. Hilarious.

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Anonymous wrote:Haven’t read a lot of the posts, but, agree that I feel puzzled by what decade it is meant to be set in as well as location. All desolate. Constant winter. Weird light at all times. What are we supposed to be taking away from all of that?

I've entertained the idea that the outies are all actually the first layer down in Severance world, a la The Matrix. So the real world is actually a construct, and not physical, which is why everything is slightly off, it's always winter, etc. But there are a lot of things that also contradict that idea.

I just get the impression that Mark is not a hapless victim of Lumon.

One other thing in hung up on—has there been any indication of what knowledge or information the innies vs. outties retain? I couldn’t work out that the innies believed the waterfall they saw during their outdoor adventure thingy was the biggest one in the world. They seem to possess some sort of baseline knowledge of the world-mark knew what sex was, and when we were introduced to Hellie, we didn’t see her go through some of start up programming to inform her baseline intellect. I guess I feel like I can’t reconcile that bit. Did I fall asleep at some point and miss something?

Yeah -- I've been wondering about this too.

I feel like Severance rules are a little like ghost rules - why can ghosts walk through walls but don't fall through the floor? Because otherwise you don't have much of a story, really!

But I think that the severed characters retain sort of the basic knowledge of being an adult human - they know how to go to the bathroom on their own; they know how to use a computer. But they don't have the knowledge specific to their own lives.

Though actually - SPOILERS ****



That's what was being tested at Cold Harbor, right? Whether the severed character retained any knowledge of their previous life, when put into what was essentially the most tragic and emotionally wrecking situation their outie had ever experienced (that we know of). And the answer was no - they don't remember - but also Gemma clearly had something going on that led her to trust Mark and run away with him even when she didn't remember him.

I agree that Lumon gave Gemma’s innie the worst part of her outie’s life to recreate to test the severance procedure. But how did they know her outie had had those miscarriages and had to deconstruct a crib in the first place?

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Anonymous wrote:Gemma will have access to Outie Mark in the real world , right?

Unless Innie Mark doesn't leave.

Oh, I forgot they share the same body!

So how were they talking by video? The brain kept switching back and forth but not the body?

I am still confused about how the numbers erased her memories (“passions”) while creating new innies??

What? Are you stupid?

You must make a great colleague in brainstorming sessions.

Such respectful, constructive input.

I mean, PP literally said she didn't understand how the Marks were talking to each other and it was very, very clear that they were sharing the video camera. You'd have to be a complete idiot to not understand that. So yeah, PP is stupid.

DP. The PP asked "So how were they talking by video?" But Mark switching between innie and outie wasn't really about the video camera, it was about his innie being inside the cabin and his outie being outside on the deck. The camera just allowed them to have the conversation asynchronously.

Thank you for being much more precise than the knee jerk critic.

If the switch is all mental (not physical), why was it even necessary for each Mark to be in a different place ? (Perhaps just a device to help the audience recognize who was talking at that moment?)

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Anonymous wrote:Haven’t read a lot of the posts, but, agree that I feel puzzled by what decade it is meant to be set in as well as location. All desolate. Constant winter. Weird light at all times. What are we supposed to be taking away from all of that?

I've entertained the idea that the outies are all actually the first layer down in Severance world, a la The Matrix. So the real world is actually a construct, and not physical, which is why everything is slightly off, it's always winter, etc. But there are a lot of things that also contradict that idea.

I just get the impression that Mark is not a hapless victim of Lumon.

One other thing in hung up on—has there been any indication of what knowledge or information the innies vs. outties retain? I couldn’t work out that the innies believed the waterfall they saw during their outdoor adventure thingy was the biggest one in the world. They seem to possess some sort of baseline knowledge of the world-mark knew what sex was, and when we were introduced to Hellie, we didn’t see her go through some of start up programming to inform her baseline intellect. I guess I feel like I can’t reconcile that bit. Did I fall asleep at some point and miss something?

Yeah -- I've been wondering about this too.

I feel like Severance rules are a little like ghost rules - why can ghosts walk through walls but don't fall through the floor? Because otherwise you don't have much of a story, really!

But I think that the severed characters retain sort of the basic knowledge of being an adult human - they know how to go to the bathroom on their own; they know how to use a computer. But they don't have the knowledge specific to their own lives.

Though actually - SPOILERS ****



That's what was being tested at Cold Harbor, right? Whether the severed character retained any knowledge of their previous life, when put into what was essentially the most tragic and emotionally wrecking situation their outie had ever experienced (that we know of). And the answer was no - they don't remember - but also Gemma clearly had something going on that led her to trust Mark and run away with him even when she didn't remember him.

I agree that Lumon gave Gemma’s innie the worst part of her outie’s life to recreate to test the severance procedure. But how did they know her outie had had those miscarriages and had to deconstruct a crib in the first place?

Either they weee spying on them the whole time at their house, or they interrogated Gemma about her life when she first arrived. Maybe through torture or maybe just oretendijg to be doing therapy or something. The dentist and the thank you notes seem like basic things that someone would say if asked “name the top five things you hate…”. The crib is so specific that it could only come up in therapy or if they were spying on them. The fact that the crib was the exact same make/model (as was the screwdriver) suggest that they were spying on them, unless this is a Soviet type world in which there is little consumer choice so everyone owns basically the exact same stuff. (This was one of the weirdest things for me when I lived in Russia — you’d see something that seemed very unique, like a china set with bright orange flowers, and then realize basically everyone had the exact same set because there wax on factory that made tea cups and that was the pattern they had used for a specific period of time.). I think I tend towards Lumpn was spying on them, since it seems that Lumon had tracked Mark and Gemma as being the ideal Guinea pigs from probably a year before. And I think we can probably also blame Gemma’s infertility and miscarriage on Lumon, since we know they have a special nyetest in breeding programs (human and goat).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Gemma will have access to Outie Mark in the real world , right?

Unless Innie Mark doesn't leave.

Oh, I forgot they share the same body!

So how were they talking by video? The brain kept switching back and forth but not the body?

I am still confused about how the numbers erased her memories (“passions”) while creating new innies??

What? Are you stupid?

You must make a great colleague in brainstorming sessions.

Such respectful, constructive input.

I mean, PP literally said she didn't understand how the Marks were talking to each other and it was very, very clear that they were sharing the video camera. You'd have to be a complete idiot to not understand that. So yeah, PP is stupid.

DP. The PP asked "So how were they talking by video?" But Mark switching between innie and outie wasn't really about the video camera, it was about his innie being inside the cabin and his outie being outside on the deck. The camera just allowed them to have the conversation asynchronously.

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Gemma will have access to Outie Mark in the real world , right?

Unless Innie Mark doesn't leave.

Oh, I forgot they share the same body!

So how were they talking by video? The brain kept switching back and forth but not the body?

I am still confused about how the numbers erased her memories (“passions”) while creating new innies??

What? Are you stupid?

You must make a great colleague in brainstorming sessions.

Such respectful, constructive input.

I mean, PP literally said she didn't understand how the Marks were talking to each other and it was very, very clear that they were sharing the video camera. You'd have to be a complete idiot to not understand that. So yeah, PP is stupid.

DP. The PP asked "So how were they talking by video?" But Mark switching between innie and outie wasn't really about the video camera, it was about his innie being inside the cabin and his outie being outside on the deck. The camera just allowed them to have the conversation asynchronously.

Thank you for being much more precise than the knee jerk critic.

If the switch is all mental (not physical), why was it even necessary for each Mark to be in a different place ? (Perhaps just a device to help the audience recognize who was talking at that moment?)

no, no, no

The birthing center is a special place set up by Lumon for the wealthy ladies who have a chip inside them so they won't experience/remember childbirth. So when someone with a chip goes INSIDE A CABIN, their innie takes over. Then when you go OUTSIDE the cabin, you're the outie again. So Mark would film himself as the outie outside the cabin, and then go inside, his innie would watch the video, respond, step outside....and then the outie would watch and respond. Hope that is clear.

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Anonymous wrote:Milchek is such a weird guy. Like he clearly hates his job but will do anything for it. I guess that tracks with a world where Lumom is basically the only employer. Does marks sister work? If so, do we know what she does or did? She seems very smart.

He may be the best character on the show.

There are strong racial undertones surrounding his hatred of his job. It's really interesting and I'd like to see more about it in S3.

Definitely. It really seems like there an internal battle going on between his outward mask of obsequience and his inner core personality, which is strong and confident and smart. I assume there is some reason why he is wearing that mask and playing this game despite the obvious racism at Lumon. (Because he’s not just playing the game, he is excelling at it, and working like a freakin’ Olympian to do so, see for example his incredible marching band flash mob dance.). It may be limited economic opportunities elsewhere. It may be that he’s a really deeply placed undercover spy. It may be that they have his family or something in some awkward position. Or it may be that he was raised in some creepy boys home run by the cult. He’s clearly reaching a breaking point, so I think the question is whether he ends up advancing beyond his pointless useless middle managers to take a more powerful role in Lumon, or whether he joins forces with the people trying to break Lumon. I don’t think he knows yet. The death of Mr Drummond might meaningfully change things for him.

Separately, can I just say how much I loved Dylan’s outie’s response to his resignation request? It was so Dylan G. At the core, although they’ve had different experiences, they are really the same people. Inside or out, Dylan is a fundamentally decent, loving, loyal guy. And inside or out, Mark is the kind of person that is a little self-preoccupied or clueless, but also is loyal, worries about others, and has a high baseline level of skepticism. And inside or out, Helly is a badass with a core of steel running through her but a longing to be loved. Irving is the only one whose innie and outie seemed to me to be very different.

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Gemma will have access to Outie Mark in the real world , right?

Unless Innie Mark doesn't leave.

Oh, I forgot they share the same body!

So how were they talking by video? The brain kept switching back and forth but not the body?

I am still confused about how the numbers erased her memories (“passions”) while creating new innies??

What? Are you stupid?

You must make a great colleague in brainstorming sessions.

Such respectful, constructive input.

I mean, PP literally said she didn't understand how the Marks were talking to each other and it was very, very clear that they were sharing the video camera. You'd have to be a complete idiot to not understand that. So yeah, PP is stupid.

DP. The PP asked "So how were they talking by video?" But Mark switching between innie and outie wasn't really about the video camera, it was about his innie being inside the cabin and his outie being outside on the deck. The camera just allowed them to have the conversation asynchronously.

Thank you for being much more precise than the knee jerk critic.

If the switch is all mental (not physical), why was it even necessary for each Mark to be in a different place ? (Perhaps just a device to help the audience recognize who was talking at that moment?)