Anonymous wrote:I was a second grade teacher at a center school. I can assure you that there are kids who scored very high on the Cogat , FxGat, NNat, or Wisc who had GBRs as low as 4s. Some kids do absolutely nothing in class that would ever indicate higher intelligence. There are kids who never open their mouths and kids who do as little work as possible which leaves the teacher with no indicators of gifted behavior. These kids still get in to GT/AAP notwithstanding their low GBRs and in most cases continue to do next to nothing and their AAP teachers are very frustrated by them. Of course their parents have told them for years how brilliant they are and that may lead to their lack of work ethic. It is sad how many parents in this county have created kids who will amount to nothing regardless of their innate intelligence.

Dear teacher, we are not talking about kids who space out or do nothing in class all day. We're talking about kids who get 4s in their report cards, which I take it to mean that they must be doing something right in class... What's the excuse for low GBRS for kids who have 4s in their report cards plus great scores in all tests plus above grade DRA2 etc? There are many such kids that had to resort to WISC to make it into the program because of low GBRS. That's what I do not get. The kids you're talking about, I am not surprised that they get low GBRS, but the kids I'm talking about? No sense at all...

Furthermore, most of the kids I know (my own included) who ended up with low GBRS but had great scores, had no idea that AAP even existed. So nobody at home is telling them that they are great and that they deserve special treatment. It's the parents who are always at the school and constantly promote and push their kids to do whatever it takes to get into the program, who tell them about AAP and how special they are, and these are the kids who end up with the high GBRS, not the other way around.

22:32, what are you saying? gbrs reflects what your dc demonstrates in school. if they show nothing they have low gbrs regardless of their precious brilliance scores

So, WISC is not even accurate now, but GBRS is? Give me a break! There is nothing more subjective in the AAP selection process than GBRS. And for all their faults, the various tests that kids take to get there are the only objective (or as close to objective as humanly possible) measures in the process.

^ that assumes the WISC scores are even accurate, which is called into some question by this thread: http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/315908.page

Anonymous wrote:I was a second grade teacher at a center school. I can assure you that there are kids who scored very high on the Cogat , FxGat, NNat, or Wisc who had GBRs as low as 4s. Some kids do absolutely nothing in class that would ever indicate higher intelligence. There are kids who never open their mouths and kids who do as little work as possible which leaves the teacher with no indicators of gifted behavior. These kids still get in to GT/AAP notwithstanding their low GBRs and in most cases continue to do next to nothing and their AAP teachers are very frustrated by them. Of course their parents have told them for years how brilliant they are and that may lead to their lack of work ethic. It is sad how many parents in this county have created kids who will amount to nothing regardless of their innate intelligence.

all the WISC demonstrates is the ability to answer certain very specialized questions that have little or no relevance in the real world. In other words they're "gifted" at what? Answering questions on the WISc test.

I was a second grade teacher at a center school. I can assure you that there are kids who scored very high on the Cogat , FxGat, NNat, or Wisc who had GBRs as low as 4s. Some kids do absolutely nothing in class that would ever indicate higher intelligence. There are kids who never open their mouths and kids who do as little work as possible which leaves the teacher with no indicators of gifted behavior. These kids still get in to GT/AAP notwithstanding their low GBRs and in most cases continue to do next to nothing and their AAP teachers are very frustrated by them. Of course their parents have told them for years how brilliant they are and that may lead to their lack of work ethic. It is sad how many parents in this county have created kids who will amount to nothing regardless of their innate intelligence.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1. My Sept born DC got high scores in test and WISC, but received extremely low GBRS from school. I think some teachers are confused with maturity or intelligence.

Exact same situation. Very bright Sept. kid, great test scores, low GBRS. The AART was very dismissive, even when we showed her DC's great WISC scores. In on appeal based on WISC.

Same thing here! With great wisc scores (152) and low BGRS (9). Even after seeing the high WISC score the AART was so negative and dismissal. I got a feeling that AART didn't like high wisc since it basically proved their evaluation of my kid resulting in low GBRS was wrong.

this is completely inaccurate. Doesn't prove shit. These two assessments measure different things and bioth can be right. A WISC 157 and a GBRS 9 can both be right.

Really? How about NNAT and FxAT/CogAT? How about all three of them? How about every possible score pointing towards a highly intelligent kid, yet in the classroom the same kid shows nothing even close to "Gifted Behavior" (the G and B in GBRS)? Come on, not even AARTs are buying this... It's exactly as 09:43 said, they become defensive and stick to their initial evaluation no matter what. In our case, she didn't even know that DC was reading above grade... She saw it in the report card (and DRA2) when we pointed it to her! Even then, she didn't flinch, she continue with her mantra that DC (whom I am sure she doesn't even remember) didn't show any signs of intelligent behavior in the classroom. Long live the appeals process!

gifted behavior - different than a pencil and paper test,

Have you seen a NNAT test? WISC questions? These are not regular pencil and paper tests, these are tests that measure giftedness, not skills. Therefore, a stellar performance in these tests is highly correlated to gifted behavior. There is no way that a kid with an IQ of 140 (which I bet you is much higher than the teacher's) doesn't show any signs of gifted behavior in the classroom, particularly if they have no other learning or behavioral issues and do well in their report cards. What are they doing in class? Sleeping?

Obviously, WISC scores (actual IQ) trumps GBRS (gifted behavior) looking at those who gets in on appeal. Should we be surprised?

^ if an AART gives a 10 or 11, they are human - but if the give a 6, something is amiss. I don't see how they could be that far off. And a high WISC does not mean the GBRS was in error.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1. My Sept born DC got high scores in test and WISC, but received extremely low GBRS from school. I think some teachers are confused with maturity or intelligence.

Exact same situation. Very bright Sept. kid, great test scores, low GBRS. The AART was very dismissive, even when we showed her DC's great WISC scores. In on appeal based on WISC.

Same thing here! With great wisc scores (152) and low BGRS (9). Even after seeing the high WISC score the AART was so negative and dismissal. I got a feeling that AART didn't like high wisc since it basically proved their evaluation of my kid resulting in low GBRS was wrong.

this is completely inaccurate. Doesn't prove shit. These two assessments measure different things and bioth can be right. A WISC 157 and a GBRS 9 can both be right.

Punched a nerve? It's ok AARTs are only human and can/will make mistakes from time to time. Unless they are super human!

posted in the private schools forum but well worth repeating here: http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/315908.page

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1. My Sept born DC got high scores in test and WISC, but received extremely low GBRS from school. I think some teachers are confused with maturity or intelligence.

Exact same situation. Very bright Sept. kid, great test scores, low GBRS. The AART was very dismissive, even when we showed her DC's great WISC scores. In on appeal based on WISC.

Same thing here! With great wisc scores (152) and low BGRS (9). Even after seeing the high WISC score the AART was so negative and dismissal. I got a feeling that AART didn't like high wisc since it basically proved their evaluation of my kid resulting in low GBRS was wrong.

this is completely inaccurate. Doesn't prove shit. These two assessments measure different things and bioth can be right. A WISC 157 and a GBRS 9 can both be right.

Really? How about NNAT and FxAT/CogAT? How about all three of them? How about every possible score pointing towards a highly intelligent kid, yet in the classroom the same kid shows nothing even close to "Gifted Behavior" (the G and B in GBRS)? Come on, not even AARTs are buying this... It's exactly as 09:43 said, they become defensive and stick to their initial evaluation no matter what. In our case, she didn't even know that DC was reading above grade... She saw it in the report card (and DRA2) when we pointed it to her! Even then, she didn't flinch, she continue with her mantra that DC (whom I am sure she doesn't even remember) didn't show any signs of intelligent behavior in the classroom. Long live the appeals process!

gifted behavior - different than a pencil and paper test,

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1. My Sept born DC got high scores in test and WISC, but received extremely low GBRS from school. I think some teachers are confused with maturity or intelligence.

Exact same situation. Very bright Sept. kid, great test scores, low GBRS. The AART was very dismissive, even when we showed her DC's great WISC scores. In on appeal based on WISC.

Same thing here! With great wisc scores (152) and low BGRS (9). Even after seeing the high WISC score the AART was so negative and dismissal. I got a feeling that AART didn't like high wisc since it basically proved their evaluation of my kid resulting in low GBRS was wrong.

this is completely inaccurate. Doesn't prove shit. These two assessments measure different things and bioth can be right. A WISC 157 and a GBRS 9 can both be right.

Really? How about NNAT and FxAT/CogAT? How about all three of them? How about every possible score pointing towards a highly intelligent kid, yet in the classroom the same kid shows nothing even close to "Gifted Behavior" (the G and B in GBRS)? Come on, not even AARTs are buying this... It's exactly as 09:43 said, they become defensive and stick to their initial evaluation no matter what. In our case, she didn't even know that DC was reading above grade... She saw it in the report card (and DRA2) when we pointed it to her! Even then, she didn't flinch, she continue with her mantra that DC (whom I am sure she doesn't even remember) didn't show any signs of intelligent behavior in the classroom. Long live the appeals process!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1. My Sept born DC got high scores in test and WISC, but received extremely low GBRS from school. I think some teachers are confused with maturity or intelligence.

Exact same situation. Very bright Sept. kid, great test scores, low GBRS. The AART was very dismissive, even when we showed her DC's great WISC scores. In on appeal based on WISC.

Same thing here! With great wisc scores (152) and low BGRS (9). Even after seeing the high WISC score the AART was so negative and dismissal. I got a feeling that AART didn't like high wisc since it basically proved their evaluation of my kid resulting in low GBRS was wrong.

^ so where did you get the WISC done?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1. My Sept born DC got high scores in test and WISC, but received extremely low GBRS from school. I think some teachers are confused with maturity or intelligence.

Exact same situation. Very bright Sept. kid, great test scores, low GBRS. The AART was very dismissive, even when we showed her DC's great WISC scores. In on appeal based on WISC.

Same thing here! With great wisc scores (152) and low BGRS (9). Even after seeing the high WISC score the AART was so negative and dismissal. I got a feeling that AART didn't like high wisc since it basically proved their evaluation of my kid resulting in low GBRS was wrong.

this is completely inaccurate. Doesn't prove shit. These two assessments measure different things and bioth can be right. A WISC 157 and a GBRS 9 can both be right.