Anonymous
Post 03/26/2024 18:44     Subject: Key bridge in Baltimore collapses after cargo ship crashes into it
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I have not read everything but if someone can answer some questions. All I hear about is 7 people who are unaccounted for and who may or may not be undocumented and they were hardworking etc and this is so sad. What about the people in the cars and tractor trailers? I cannot imagine they got out and also hear about underwater sonar pinging on cars. Why is there no focus on those victims? Was there a miracle and there were actually no cars/trucks that went over? I saw the video and thought this was impossible but also heard some people were able to close road so maybe they did get out? Details please.


The vehicles seem to be related to the construction. It's possible that people were in them using them to evacuate, but they would be the 6 people who are missing or the 2 people who were rescued. But it's also possible that they were parked on the bridge and no one was in them.


They were empty vehicles, including a cement truck. They were parked since they were doing construction


Yes, but they've said some workers were probably sitting in their cars eating. They were on lunch break when the accident happened.
Anonymous
Post 03/26/2024 18:41     Subject: Key bridge in Baltimore collapses after cargo ship crashes into it
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I can’t believe the state of our infrastructure is so bad that this would take out the WHOLE bridge. God bless the people who were driving on it at the time, there’s no way they will pull many survivors out of the river


I do not want to sound obnoxious but every single time I am traveling on a bridge over water I am always on alert and anticipate that I could end up in the water at any moment.



Same, it's a massive fear of mine. I actually wind down my window so I can get out if my car ends up in the water.
It's even worse now that I'm always driving with my toddler in her car seat in the back seat..

So sorry for those people who were on the bridge, it happened so quick


I wind up the windows and have this tool ready if we fall in the water.
I image that if you have the windows down, the water would flood the car with such force that you couldn't fight it and it would submerge the car more quickly.

Car Safety Hammer Set of 2... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07MK2GNKD?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share


would this actually break the glass of a fully submerged vehicle? I keep reading that nothing will break that class and only chance is to have rolled down the window before being submerged.


OK, I just went down a total rabbit hole researching this. Here's what I learned.

Car window-breaker tools only work on tempered window glass, NOT laminated glass. Even with tempered glass, hammers like the one linked above often won't work underwater due to the pressure. To break tempered glass more effectively underwater you need a spring-loaded window puncher like the one they use in the video below. Always try to break windows in the corners, not the middle. Corners are the weakest. See the results of AAA's tool testing here: https://newsroom.aaa.com/2019/07/vehicle-escape-tools-testing/

Cars made in the last 8 years or so, generally have laminated glass on the side windows rather than tempered. You can double-check the sticker in the corner of your door window (or your car owner's manual) to see which kind you have, but if your car was made pre-2016, the door windows are probably tempered. Front windshields are always made of laminated glass, even pre-2016, so never waste time trying to break a front windshield. As noted above, laminated glass is impossible to break with any window-breaker hammer or punching tool. That said, your best bet is always to undo your seat belt, roll down the window, and get out as fast as possible before your car submerges and your power windows stop working.

Here's the good news. Some cars made post-2016 will still have one or more side windows that are made with tempered glass (usually in the back seat). You need to check the window stickers or your owner's manual to find out for sure about your make/model. So it's probably still worthwhile to have a window-puncher in your car. The video I saw (below) recommended zip-tying it someplace accessible rather than keeping it in your glovebox or purse, which may not be accessible in an emergency--especially if the car flips upside-down.


Anonymous
Post 03/26/2024 18:39     Subject: Key bridge in Baltimore collapses after cargo ship crashes into it
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:The scanner of construction crew/police was released earlier today and it is 90 seconds long. Construction crew in trucks went to either end to block the bridge. One says they were already leaving so they will go ahead and stay parked to block the road. The other is saying they will take the other end.

What pains me is that one person keeps asking: "are there still construction crew in the middle? Can you confirm whether people are still on the bridge? I need everyone off the bridge?" But he isn't sounding frantic or urgent and no one will answer those questions directly except to say, once I get to the end of the bridge to block it I will check. "

Unreal.


They had no idea the bridge was seconds/minutes from collapsing.


They had no idea but they also sound like they doubt it would happen. They asked to have the crew moved temporarily.
Anonymous
Post 03/26/2024 18:34     Subject: Key bridge in Baltimore collapses after cargo ship crashes into it
Anonymous wrote:The scanner of construction crew/police was released earlier today and it is 90 seconds long. Construction crew in trucks went to either end to block the bridge. One says they were already leaving so they will go ahead and stay parked to block the road. The other is saying they will take the other end.

What pains me is that one person keeps asking: "are there still construction crew in the middle? Can you confirm whether people are still on the bridge? I need everyone off the bridge?" But he isn't sounding frantic or urgent and no one will answer those questions directly except to say, once I get to the end of the bridge to block it I will check. "

Unreal.


They had no idea the bridge was seconds/minutes from collapsing.
Anonymous
Post 03/26/2024 18:32     Subject: Key bridge in Baltimore collapses after cargo ship crashes into it
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I can’t believe the state of our infrastructure is so bad that this would take out the WHOLE bridge. God bless the people who were driving on it at the time, there’s no way they will pull many survivors out of the river


I do not want to sound obnoxious but every single time I am traveling on a bridge over water I am always on alert and anticipate that I could end up in the water at any moment.



Same, it's a massive fear of mine. I actually wind down my window so I can get out if my car ends up in the water.
It's even worse now that I'm always driving with my toddler in her car seat in the back seat..

So sorry for those people who were on the bridge, it happened so quick


It’s a big fear of mine too- I should start rolling down the window.

So awful- and could have been so much worse of it had happened a few hours later. I imagine that even by 630am on a weekday there is typically more than 20 cars on the bridge.

Yup it’s the Baltimore Beltway and doesn’t look dissimilar from the DC Beltway during rush hour.


And the shipping to the Port of Baltimore. Thats the main shipping channel isn’t it? That’s got to be a huge economic hit until the bridge is removed. I wonder how many cruise ships won’t be able to get back from spring break trips.

Anonymous
Post 03/26/2024 18:30     Subject: Key bridge in Baltimore collapses after cargo ship crashes into it
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I have not read everything but if someone can answer some questions. All I hear about is 7 people who are unaccounted for and who may or may not be undocumented and they were hardworking etc and this is so sad. What about the people in the cars and tractor trailers? I cannot imagine they got out and also hear about underwater sonar pinging on cars. Why is there no focus on those victims? Was there a miracle and there were actually no cars/trucks that went over? I saw the video and thought this was impossible but also heard some people were able to close road so maybe they did get out? Details please.


The vehicles seem to be related to the construction. It's possible that people were in them using them to evacuate, but they would be the 6 people who are missing or the 2 people who were rescued. But it's also possible that they were parked on the bridge and no one was in them.


They were empty vehicles, including a cement truck. They were parked since they were doing construction
Anonymous
Post 03/26/2024 18:29     Subject: Key bridge in Baltimore collapses after cargo ship crashes into it
Anonymous wrote:The scanner of construction crew/police was released earlier today and it is 90 seconds long. Construction crew in trucks went to either end to block the bridge. One says they were already leaving so they will go ahead and stay parked to block the road. The other is saying they will take the other end.

What pains me is that one person keeps asking: "are there still construction crew in the middle? Can you confirm whether people are still on the bridge? I need everyone off the bridge?" But he isn't sounding frantic or urgent and no one will answer those questions directly except to say, once I get to the end of the bridge to block it I will check. "

Unreal.


Have you not listened to many dispatch calls etc? They don't really get "frantic" or urgent, they're trained to be calm and collect information to handle the emergency.
Anonymous
Post 03/26/2024 18:24     Subject: Key bridge in Baltimore collapses after cargo ship crashes into it
Here’s a good utube maritime video showing the path of the ship and where it veered out of the channel. The end of the channel appears to be awfully close to the bridge piers.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?si=YXC8H_1if-YJ_Po0&v=N39w6aQFKSQ&feature=youtu.be
Anonymous
Post 03/26/2024 18:23     Subject: Key bridge in Baltimore collapses after cargo ship crashes into it
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Thanks for the update. Now I understand about the vehicles Wow kudos to police for getting there and stopping traffic. This could have been so much worse. It is horrible for the workers though because it seems to be recovery now. I don’t think anyone is going to feel good going over a suspension bridge and seeing a boat near. Of all the things I have worried about..this was not in the kit but is now for sure. I hope there is a mandate for bridges like this to have some of the safety measures the Sunshine bridge in Florida has after their collapse in 1980. Apparently the new bridge has something underwater that forces a boat away if it comes too close to
pilings. This should be retrofitted for all these large suspension bridges.


Construction started for this bridge in 1972 and completed in '77, before the Sunshine bridge collapse. New bridges are built to withstand greater boat impacts (but the Dali really is gigantic - I wonder if newer bridges would have withstood a direct hit like this).


They had tugboats, to exit the harbor.

I saw a structural engineer on the news who said the container ships of today are at least twice the size of the biggest ships we had in the 70s when the Key bridge was designed and built.

I’m sad today for the lives lost but also for the loss of that lovely iconic bridge which I drove over so many times on my travels to and from law school in DC and my family further up the eastern seaboard.

I hope the new bridge is as lovely at the old one was, Baltimore deserves an iconic bridge. And maybe they need to bring back the tugboats?
Anonymous
Post 03/26/2024 18:22     Subject: Key bridge in Baltimore collapses after cargo ship crashes into it
Names of the workers are starting to be released as some of the families are speaking and WaPo did a short blurb with a son who was waiting to hear about his father and it described how the entire family was together waiting and that sobbing could be heard in the background.

I was in tears. These poor people.
Anonymous
Post 03/26/2024 18:21     Subject: Key bridge in Baltimore collapses after cargo ship crashes into it
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I noticed when I first watched the video, that you could see cars driving over ( by their lights) then right before the collapse, they stop.

Now we know why. That is miraculous. Really quick thinking and action on the part of public servants (and the harbor pilot).


Unclear that the police had time (from the radio call).

Was it the workers who stopped the cars?

Seems like some combination of workers, state police and maybe DOT/MTA vehicles. There are generally a lot of those vehicles at either end of a bridge.
Anonymous
Post 03/26/2024 18:19     Subject: Key bridge in Baltimore collapses after cargo ship crashes into it
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I noticed when I first watched the video, that you could see cars driving over ( by their lights) then right before the collapse, they stop.

Now we know why. That is miraculous. Really quick thinking and action on the part of public servants (and the harbor pilot).


Unclear that the police had time (from the radio call).

Was it the workers who stopped the cars?


No, it was police who stopped the traffic on both ends. The workers were not involved. One of the police was going to go onto the bridge to alert the workers when his back-up arrived but the bridge fell at that moment.
Anonymous
Post 03/26/2024 18:19     Subject: Key bridge in Baltimore collapses after cargo ship crashes into it
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I noticed when I first watched the video, that you could see cars driving over ( by their lights) then right before the collapse, they stop.

Now we know why. That is miraculous. Really quick thinking and action on the part of public servants (and the harbor pilot).


Unclear that the police had time (from the radio call).

Was it the workers who stopped the cars?


I have seen videos on twitter of drivers being upset that they are being prevented from continuing on 695 and being told to turn around. There are white pick up trucks that are blocking.
Anonymous
Post 03/26/2024 18:15     Subject: Key bridge in Baltimore collapses after cargo ship crashes into it
Anonymous wrote:I noticed when I first watched the video, that you could see cars driving over ( by their lights) then right before the collapse, they stop.

Now we know why. That is miraculous. Really quick thinking and action on the part of public servants (and the harbor pilot).


Unclear that the police had time (from the radio call).

Was it the workers who stopped the cars?
Anonymous
Post 03/26/2024 18:08     Subject: Key bridge in Baltimore collapses after cargo ship crashes into it
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Thanks for the update. Now I understand about the vehicles Wow kudos to police for getting there and stopping traffic. This could have been so much worse. It is horrible for the workers though because it seems to be recovery now. I don’t think anyone is going to feel good going over a suspension bridge and seeing a boat near. Of all the things I have worried about..this was not in the kit but is now for sure. I hope there is a mandate for bridges like this to have some of the safety measures the Sunshine bridge in Florida has after their collapse in 1980. Apparently the new bridge has something underwater that forces a boat away if it comes too close to
pilings. This should be retrofitted for all these large suspension bridges.


Construction started for this bridge in 1972 and completed in '77, before the Sunshine bridge collapse. New bridges are built to withstand greater boat impacts (but the Dali really is gigantic - I wonder if newer bridges would have withstood a direct hit like this).


I saw a structural engineer on the news who said the container ships of today are at least twice the size of the biggest ships we had in the 70s when the Key bridge was designed and built.

I’m sad today for the lives lost but also for the loss of that lovely iconic bridge which I drove over so many times on my travels to and from law school in DC and my family further up the eastern seaboard.

I hope the new bridge is as lovely at the old one was, Baltimore deserves an iconic bridge. And maybe they need to bring back the tugboats?


I still don't think they built it to withstand being rammed by a freighter of the size they had in the 70s. That's only a factor of 2, not a factor of 10.