Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:@1040- your assumptions on what a neighborhood Drew FARMS rate will be are incorrect.
If you look at the transfer report- https://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Transfer-Report-2016-17.pdf
Drew has 78 kids who are economically disadvantaged transferring in for Montessori.
It has 364 kids who are FARMS. That means that 80% of the current FARMS kids are neighborhood kids.

Also - the 2/3 spots only applies to preschool, not elementary. And those 2/3 spots are reserved for people whose income for a family of 4 is below 88,240. In order to be FARMS- a family of 4 has to make less than 45,000. https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2017/04/10/2017-07043/child-nutrition-programs-income-eligibility-guidelines

I figured I had to be doing something wrong on that point. But some of those neighborhood FARMS kids must be Montessori kids as well. Drew doesn't have 286 kids in the neighborhood program in total. Whether they will go with the Montessori or stay put, who knows.

No, kids who live in the neighborhood look like Montessori transfers in the report.

Anonymous wrote:@1040- your assumptions on what a neighborhood Drew FARMS rate will be are incorrect.
If you look at the transfer report- https://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Transfer-Report-2016-17.pdf
Drew has 78 kids who are economically disadvantaged transferring in for Montessori.
It has 364 kids who are FARMS. That means that 80% of the current FARMS kids are neighborhood kids.

Also - the 2/3 spots only applies to preschool, not elementary. And those 2/3 spots are reserved for people whose income for a family of 4 is below 88,240. In order to be FARMS- a family of 4 has to make less than 45,000. https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2017/04/10/2017-07043/child-nutrition-programs-income-eligibility-guidelines

I figured I had to be doing something wrong on that point. But some of those neighborhood FARMS kids must be Montessori kids as well. Drew doesn't have 286 kids in the neighborhood program in total. Whether they will go with the Montessori or stay put, who knows.

Anonymous wrote:Drew supporters tell me, an UMC family about to be zoned from Henry/Fleet to Drew, potentially why I shouldn’t freak out? Convince me that this school will not just survive but excel?

That’s not their job. If you are concerned get involved and help make it a great school.

We're at Claremont now, and will be continuing on to Gunston & Wakefield. We're all very happy with the school and our kids seem to be thriving. Have talked with more than a few Gunston parents, and they all say very positive things about their school too. A couple neighbors teach at Abingdon and are happy there, and even if we didn't get into Claremont that would've been a perfectly acceptable n'hood school. We're comfortable with Wakefield as is, but our oldest is still 6 years from going there - so not going to make judgments on what that school will be like in 2024.

We meet families like ours every day, that are perfectly happy with where we live. That said, there are real problems in some S Arlington schools, and the CB is doing us no favors by cramming more and more AH on top of what's already here.

@1040- your assumptions on what a neighborhood Drew FARMS rate will be are incorrect.
If you look at the transfer report- https://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Transfer-Report-2016-17.pdf
Drew has 78 kids who are economically disadvantaged transferring in for Montessori.
It has 364 kids who are FARMS. That means that 80% of the current FARMS kids are neighborhood kids.

Also - the 2/3 spots only applies to preschool, not elementary. And those 2/3 spots are reserved for people whose income for a family of 4 is below 88,240. In order to be FARMS- a family of 4 has to make less than 45,000. https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2017/04/10/2017-07043/child-nutrition-programs-income-eligibility-guidelines

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DP poster here. I chose S Arlington because of the commute to work and the idea that it seems to only be getting nicer. I didn't count on the entrenched affordable housing though. I just assumed that the schools would be getting better. And some are. It's just not as even.

Yes, I've been here for 16 years and it took me awhile to understand the politics of affordable housing, and its disparate impact on north and south Arlington. It's an article of faith for wealthy north Arlington dems; its how they can sleep at night. I'm a liberal and I believe in integrated communities not just as a nice idea but as something that broadly produces better outcomes for all. I think north of 50 it's not a tangible, and if it was, we'd see more affordable housing there and a boundary process that valued diversity. It's laughable what was spent on HB and the new high schools only to be told that we must live with school segregation because busing students around the smallest county in America costs too much.

The thing about busing is that no one wants their kids on the bus to the other side of the county. The county is small in miles but heavy in traffic. If you were told that your planning unit was going to be bused to Jamestown, would you be happy about that?

I mean there are a ton of kids in my S. Arlington neighborhood that have a very long bus ride every day to ATS. So I don't think people really care about the bus ride. They care about the school.

Actually, not true. I am middle class and live in S. Arlington and didn't apply to option schools for reasons related to long bus ride and logistics for extended day pickup. This is also true for many kids who are low income and who would need extended day. It can be very hard for their families to come get them from extended day at a school across town. Many of these families have every parent working 2 or more jobs and some don't have cars. Also, at my child's school many kids arrive 20 minutes early for breakfast. I'm not sure how that works with buses.

Our bus gets kids there early enough for breakfast.

Okay, yes some people care about the bus ride, but I don't think it is every single parent (as made obvious by the 10 kids waiting for ATS in front of my house every morning). But I think folks are more inclined to complain about long bus rides if their kids are bused to a lower performing school than if they are bused to a higher performing one.

Agreed. Also the key is the kids getting bused to ATS all CHOSE to do that (or their parents did) as opposed to being forced to take a bus when there is a school 3 blocks away. I hear what you are saying and obviously most families would be happier to bus to a higher-performing school than a lower-performing one. It's just sticky, because historically when busing was used to help desegregate it was chiildren of color and those with lesser resources that were forced to ride the bus.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DP poster here. I chose S Arlington because of the commute to work and the idea that it seems to only be getting nicer. I didn't count on the entrenched affordable housing though. I just assumed that the schools would be getting better. And some are. It's just not as even.

Yes, I've been here for 16 years and it took me awhile to understand the politics of affordable housing, and its disparate impact on north and south Arlington. It's an article of faith for wealthy north Arlington dems; its how they can sleep at night. I'm a liberal and I believe in integrated communities not just as a nice idea but as something that broadly produces better outcomes for all. I think north of 50 it's not a tangible, and if it was, we'd see more affordable housing there and a boundary process that valued diversity. It's laughable what was spent on HB and the new high schools only to be told that we must live with school segregation because busing students around the smallest county in America costs too much.

The thing about busing is that no one wants their kids on the bus to the other side of the county. The county is small in miles but heavy in traffic. If you were told that your planning unit was going to be bused to Jamestown, would you be happy about that?

I mean there are a ton of kids in my S. Arlington neighborhood that have a very long bus ride every day to ATS. So I don't think people really care about the bus ride. They care about the school.

Actually, not true. I am middle class and live in S. Arlington and didn't apply to option schools for reasons related to long bus ride and logistics for extended day pickup. This is also true for many kids who are low income and who would need extended day. It can be very hard for their families to come get them from extended day at a school across town. Many of these families have every parent working 2 or more jobs and some don't have cars. Also, at my child's school many kids arrive 20 minutes early for breakfast. I'm not sure how that works with buses.

Our bus gets kids there early enough for breakfast.

Okay, yes some people care about the bus ride, but I don't think it is every single parent (as made obvious by the 10 kids waiting for ATS in front of my house every morning). But I think folks are more inclined to complain about long bus rides if their kids are bused to a lower performing school than if they are bused to a higher performing one.

Anonymous wrote:Drew supporters tell me, an UMC family about to be zoned from Henry/Fleet to Drew, potentially why I shouldn’t freak out? Convince me that this school will not just survive but excel?

I'll give that a go. Full disclosure, we are zoned for Drew but currently enrolled in Montessori.

As I understand it, Drew's FARMs rate is around 55% currently. That should be an aggregated rate, i.e., taking into account the Montessori program, which is 2/3 low income. The Montessori program is far and away the biggest part of that school, about 450 out of 600 kids, give or take. So, using the above assumptions, that means the neighborhood program should clock in at a much lower FARMs rate. (My math says 20%, but I acknowledge both that that seems optimistic knowing the neighborhood and that I'm bad at math.) I've posted this before, but I understand from working group materials that Drew is slated to receive kids currently zoned Henry and Oakridge, in addition to Randolph, Abingdon, and Hoffman-Boston. I'm not as familiar with the Oakridge PUs or what can be done there in light of "walkability" but I think influx from Oakridge is a positive. Same for Henry - I assume you're in the Glebe/Walter Reed/Pike triangle. So those numbers should help. Also, I understand that people will no longer be able to opt into Hoffman-Boston from the Drew zone, so those kids (and their parents who paid enough attention to education to choose Hoffman-Boston) will come to Drew. All of this seems favorable demographically. Also, the current Drew zone does not have committed AH that I'm aware of (correct me if I'm wrong). There are plenty of smaller SFH, undoubtedly many illegal rentals, and the older garden apartments, but I don't view those through the same lens as the CAFs that have gone up in, say, the Barcroft zone. I don't think they have the same effect of concentrating lower income families/students with limited hope for turnover.

Anecdotally, in my immediate neighborhood there are at least a dozen kids currently under the age of 5 in UMC families, some of whom have already missed the boat on the lottery (some are not old enough yet), who will likely wind up at Drew. I doubt we're alone, given the relatively rampant house flipping in the area.

Drew is getting focus from APS and pressure from the community. They have a new STEAM focus. Drew will be getting a new principal this year, a year ahead of the Montessori move, rather than continuing to share a principal. The teachers I've met at Drew are all great. Some are Montessori and will move, others are not and presumably will stay. We've been there 3 years now and I have yet to notice any significant teacher turnover issues (the assistant principal has turned over once during that time, she left to take a position with APS). My child has had the same teachers for art, Spanish, PE, and whatever they call the counselor's role when she does classroom things instead of counseling. The administrators are the same for the most part.

We go to school events as allowed by the schedules of two working parents with relatively long hours and they seem well attended. Movie night each semester is packed. The book fair is a zoo. They do concerts and performances and plays.

Drew's facilities are fine. I've personally been inside Henry, Campbell, Hoffman-Boston, and Jamestown and haven't seen material differences among them, inside or out.

All that says, who knows. I can't explain why a school suddenly flourishes or why another seems to founder. I've posted this previously too, but when I moved here Hoffman-Boston was no great shakes and now it's pretty well-regarded. I don't know why, but I also don't see why Drew can't be that in another couple of years. I think the split program did the smaller neighborhood program a real disservice over the years. Having a cohesive school on its own is a step in the right direction.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Drew supporters tell me, an UMC family about to be zoned from Henry/Fleet to Drew, potentially why I shouldn’t freak out? Convince me that this school will not just survive but excel?

We are zoned Drew but go to Claremont. I don't know to be honest. I think the fact that they are actually going to focus on the traditional program now (since they have no other choice) is good because I do believe that is one of the reasons for issues they have been having. On a related note, the Drew student body has been very limited to neighborhood lower income kids. You change the student body you change the school. Rezoning is going to change the student body.

There are a lot of young families in Nauck and since they won't have the guaranteed option of Claremont this year (and may not have the option of Hoffman Boston) I think there will be a movement to start sending the kids there. There is a lot of talk at the park about sending the kids to Drew, but I don't know if it will actually happen...it just seems that people want it to happen (so maybe a bit of a good sign).

The school is very nice IMO, as are the grounds go. They also have a lot of activities and festivals.

I guess that’s the only way to do it - to force most of the choice options off the table. I assume Montessori will become really cutthroat, though, because some of those who will probably be rezoned are just across the Pike from the Henry site.

Anonymous wrote:Drew supporters tell me, an UMC family about to be zoned from Henry/Fleet to Drew, potentially why I shouldn’t freak out? Convince me that this school will not just survive but excel?

I don’t know but I’m in the same boat. Luckily I have a few years to wait it out and make the assessment when it’s time.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DP poster here. I chose S Arlington because of the commute to work and the idea that it seems to only be getting nicer. I didn't count on the entrenched affordable housing though. I just assumed that the schools would be getting better. And some are. It's just not as even.

Yes, I've been here for 16 years and it took me awhile to understand the politics of affordable housing, and its disparate impact on north and south Arlington. It's an article of faith for wealthy north Arlington dems; its how they can sleep at night. I'm a liberal and I believe in integrated communities not just as a nice idea but as something that broadly produces better outcomes for all. I think north of 50 it's not a tangible, and if it was, we'd see more affordable housing there and a boundary process that valued diversity. It's laughable what was spent on HB and the new high schools only to be told that we must live with school segregation because busing students around the smallest county in America costs too much.

The thing about busing is that no one wants their kids on the bus to the other side of the county. The county is small in miles but heavy in traffic. If you were told that your planning unit was going to be bused to Jamestown, would you be happy about that?

I mean there are a ton of kids in my S. Arlington neighborhood that have a very long bus ride every day to ATS. So I don't think people really care about the bus ride. They care about the school.

Actually, not true. I am middle class and live in S. Arlington and didn't apply to option schools for reasons related to long bus ride and logistics for extended day pickup. This is also true for many kids who are low income and who would need extended day. It can be very hard for their families to come get them from extended day at a school across town. Many of these families have every parent working 2 or more jobs and some don't have cars. Also, at my child's school many kids arrive 20 minutes early for breakfast. I'm not sure how that works with buses.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DP poster here. I chose S Arlington because of the commute to work and the idea that it seems to only be getting nicer. I didn't count on the entrenched affordable housing though. I just assumed that the schools would be getting better. And some are. It's just not as even.

Yes, I've been here for 16 years and it took me awhile to understand the politics of affordable housing, and its disparate impact on north and south Arlington. It's an article of faith for wealthy north Arlington dems; its how they can sleep at night. I'm a liberal and I believe in integrated communities not just as a nice idea but as something that broadly produces better outcomes for all. I think north of 50 it's not a tangible, and if it was, we'd see more affordable housing there and a boundary process that valued diversity. It's laughable what was spent on HB and the new high schools only to be told that we must live with school segregation because busing students around the smallest county in America costs too much.

The thing about busing is that no one wants their kids on the bus to the other side of the county. The county is small in miles but heavy in traffic. If you were told that your planning unit was going to be bused to Jamestown, would you be happy about that?

I mean there are a ton of kids in my S. Arlington neighborhood that have a very long bus ride every day to ATS. So I don't think people really care about the bus ride. They care about the school.

Anonymous wrote:Drew supporters tell me, an UMC family about to be zoned from Henry/Fleet to Drew, potentially why I shouldn’t freak out? Convince me that this school will not just survive but excel?

We are zoned Drew but go to Claremont. I don't know to be honest. I think the fact that they are actually going to focus on the traditional program now (since they have no other choice) is good because I do believe that is one of the reasons for issues they have been having. On a related note, the Drew student body has been very limited to neighborhood lower income kids. You change the student body you change the school. Rezoning is going to change the student body.

There are a lot of young families in Nauck and since they won't have the guaranteed option of Claremont this year (and may not have the option of Hoffman Boston) I think there will be a movement to start sending the kids there. There is a lot of talk at the park about sending the kids to Drew, but I don't know if it will actually happen...it just seems that people want it to happen (so maybe a bit of a good sign).

The school is very nice IMO, as are the grounds go. They also have a lot of activities and festivals.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know where I will move, probably north Arlington. I just won’t have as nice a place as I have now.

...
"And yes, I could not afford the house I wanted in north arlington otherwise I would have moved there because of the schools.

I am curious what house and yard features are more important than your child's education. We are going through the same choices right now.

Unless you are at one of the poorest schools, I have a hard time believing actual education is being affected. In a handful of schools, I think it's possible that there's a lot of focus on test prep. I wouldn't want that for my kids, but again, I don't think this a problem across the board.

Do the schools look like a country club? No. Does your kid get to take a charter bus to a field trip out of state? Maybe not. But is your kid falling behind educationally? Also no. The kids who are affected by segregation are not the children of parents posting over here. You can take your kid to the Baltimore Aquarium any time you like, and I bet you already have. It's the kids whose families can't do that who are getting less and for whom the "experience" can't be replicated outside of school hours.

That's the thing, they're all increasingly poorest. Oakridge and fleet and possibly Abingdon are probably going to have farms rates under 40 percent when the dust clears, so great for them. They're going to donate their poorest to the other south Arlington elementaries. The sky's the limit for barcroft, Randolph, Carlin springs and the new drew, which are all going to clock in at about 70% farms or more. I'm not unsympathetic to these children, and they need a lot of help academically and otherwise. You can easily see this in test scores; poor kids always do a lot worse. My concern is that when the student body is that disadvantaged, there's not many resources to direct to kids performing at or above grade level, and their relative advantage leads to comments like, they'll be fine which basically means, they can be ignored. Not my kid.

They're not all increasingly poorest. As you said, some S Arlington schools are going to have fewer fr/l students. Randolph, because of its walk zone, is always going to be among the poorest schools. Barcroft and Carlin Spings have a good likelihood of staying about the same or decreasing slightly depending on what they decide to do with moving around option programs and where they send PU's that aren't in any effective walk zone. Drew and the other schools are similarly unclear.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DP poster here. I chose S Arlington because of the commute to work and the idea that it seems to only be getting nicer. I didn't count on the entrenched affordable housing though. I just assumed that the schools would be getting better. And some are. It's just not as even.

Yes, I've been here for 16 years and it took me awhile to understand the politics of affordable housing, and its disparate impact on north and south Arlington. It's an article of faith for wealthy north Arlington dems; its how they can sleep at night. I'm a liberal and I believe in integrated communities not just as a nice idea but as something that broadly produces better outcomes for all. I think north of 50 it's not a tangible, and if it was, we'd see more affordable housing there and a boundary process that valued diversity. It's laughable what was spent on HB and the new high schools only to be told that we must live with school segregation because busing students around the smallest county in America costs too much.

+1

DP. I've been here for less time, but likewise am coming to understand the AH dynamics. I have a lot of disdain for the paper Dems with all the #resist fever, who trash "flyover" states or areas with Confederate monuments but don't notice the segregation in their own backyards. "We're not like them; we just *really* value walking." Oh, is that the explanation? Okay then.

That said, I believe we're doing the right thing for our family by living in South Arl. My children will be fine academically and may even be better off for less competitive/striverish environments with a more diverse peer group. They are young, but I have a lot of concern over the stories out of WMS and YHS, such that Gunston and Wakefield look pretty darn appealing. We can afford North Arlington, we choose not to. It's not always easy to have confidence in our choices, and these threads always seem to devolve at some point into group therapy or SALA jokes, but we're planning to stick it out.