Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think these people are complete and total a-holes. And completely clueless. They clearly saw nothing wrong with leaving their children unattended IN PUBLIC! So clearly their judgement is scary. That said, I really feel for those children. They must be terrified without their parents. I do think it's in the kids best interest to be reunited with their parents. How that happens and under what supervision I don't know. But I do think being away from their parents is more damaging.

+1. I feel so bad for the kids, separated from their parents. What the parents did was reckless neglect, but all the gleeful cackling here seems in poor taste because of those tiny babies who want and need their parents.

+1. The parents need to be punished and punished in the worst way. But the kids don't need to be punished. They need to be put first here. They need to be back in their home and their parents need serious supervision and counseling. I do think what they did is criminal. I can't even fathom doing what they did. And when I heard one child didn't even have shoes and socks on that put me over the edge. So I don't know what the answer is but I think those kids need to be put first.

I can't imagine this is the first time they've done this. I imagine they've tried "smaller" things before (like leaving them home alone for a little bit etc.), gotten away with it, so that gave them the confidence to leave the kids on a public street in broad daylight. Who knows but just my suspicion.

If it's just that they are want kids but are clearly over the screaming toddler thing and want to maintain their own lives, isn't it possible to get weekend nannies? Like have childcare 5 days/wk for work and evenings, and then have separate childcare lined up for 48 hrs on the weekend so you can come and go as you please? I feel like I've heard of wealthy couples in NYC having multiple nannies as shift-work, so that they can come and go when they want and don't ever have to miss events or be "stuck" with the kids if they don't want. I mean there are solutions -- particularly if you have means -- until the kids are old enough for boarding school.

Anonymous wrote:
As someone who's used emergency WH nannies, it would cost them $35 referral fee + nanny's hourly rate ($15-30, 4 hr minimum). If they are not members, they'd also have to join and pay an annual fee of $200 (maybe $250?). So around $400 max. All in all, a LOT cheaper than paying their lawyer will turn out to be.

I get going stir-crazy with two small children but (a) get a sitter! and (b) if the sitter falls through, suck it up - those mental giants are not living their last day on earth, they can go to a wine tasting another time.

Another option, since they were already there with the kids in the car, why didn't they leave the car on and take turns going in for 30-45 minutes at a time, then coming out and tagging to let the other parent go in. If they were really parked just a couple of blocks away, how hard would it be to just take turns going in?

Anonymous wrote:For those of you who have kids this age (mine isn't old enough yet), how much do they talk and convey thoughts and more importantly how much do they remember?

Will a 3 yr old talk about how he/she was so cold in the car or develop a fear of cars or whatever? How about a 2 yr old? Will they forget eventually or is it going to take years? Or is it like infants where they don't remember/have a sense of time? I realize every kid is different but just curious from a child dev point of view.

I have 3.5 yo twins and they are pretty talkative, but they don't always have the right meanings of words. For example, one calls both hot and cold "too hot" even though they know the difference when we tell them. He just usually knows that sensation as "hot". As for remembering, they don't always remember specific incidents, but they do remember things that cause strong feelings. In a case like this, I can see them freaking out just seeing the car seat for a while. They will just associate being scared, cold and abandoned with the car seat. It may not happen all the time, but if they are cold or tired and see the car seat, they may have a major meltdown. We've seen triggers like this over bad incidents. Like my son was at daycare once, playing on a particular bench and a girl slightly bigger than him came and tried to take his toy away. He fought and the girl pushed him backwards off the bench and he cracked his head on the concrete behind him with a big goose-egg and a little blood. I was called and took him to the ER that afternoon. For the next few months, he always talked about not liking the girl and he would never sit on that bench. When asked he didn't remember the incident, but he wouldn't go near that bench and avoided the girl and talked about not liking the girl. The daycare didn't tell us who the child who pushed him was, but it was pretty clear from my son's reaction that that girl was the bully. From our experience with two and with other classmates and friends of similar ages, this type of association is not uncommon.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:s/o - what would you say if it were your colleague?

i'm not sure i could look either of them in the eye. i would think so poorly of them.

I would print out the article and leave it on their chair.

Oh, the passive aggressive leave it on the chair move, staple of federal bureaucrats everywhere! "Here's that thing I don't want to have to talk to you about."

HAHAHA, yep.

Anonymous wrote:I think these people are complete and total a-holes. And completely clueless. They clearly saw nothing wrong with leaving their children unattended IN PUBLIC! So clearly their judgement is scary. That said, I really feel for those children. They must be terrified without their parents. I do think it's in the kids best interest to be reunited with their parents. How that happens and under what supervision I don't know. But I do think being away from their parents is more damaging.

+1. I feel so bad for the kids, separated from their parents. What the parents did was reckless neglect, but all the gleeful cackling here seems in poor taste because of those tiny babies who want and need their parents.

I wonder if they were on drugs. I seriously can't fathom any other reason why they would have thought this was a good idea.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm surprised the judge ordered them to stay away from the kids completely. While I think they did an extremely foolish thing, I feel for the kids - first having been left alone in the cold, then taken by strangers (police/CPS), and now they won't be able to see their parents for weeks. I think some sort of supervised visits would be better for the kids.

Seriously at this point the kids are likely more traumatized by not having seen their parents since Sat afternoon than by a cold car. I wonder where they are -- i.e. with family or in some hellish foster home with complete strangers and a ton of other kids. I imagine the parents do/will get to visit wherever the kids are. Any idea if this couple has family in this general area? I'm guessing no bc if you were so desperate to go out or were at your wit's end and just needed 2 hrs away from the kids on a Sat afternoon and you had a sister or grandmom or someone close by -- I'd imagine you'd beg them to take the kids instead of leaving them in a car.

Also what's the going rate for those emergency nanny services like WH Nannies? For 3 hrs on a Saturday would it even cost more than a few hundred?

As someone who's used emergency WH nannies, it would cost them $35 referral fee + nanny's hourly rate ($15-30, 4 hr minimum). If they are not members, they'd also have to join and pay an annual fee of $200 (maybe $250?). So around $400 max. All in all, a LOT cheaper than paying their lawyer will turn out to be.

I get going stir-crazy with two small children but (a) get a sitter! and (b) if the sitter falls through, suck it up - those mental giants are not living their last day on earth, they can go to a wine tasting another time.

Anonymous wrote:I'm surprised the judge ordered them to stay away from the kids completely. While I think they did an extremely foolish thing, I feel for the kids - first having been left alone in the cold, then taken by strangers (police/CPS), and now they won't be able to see their parents for weeks. I think some sort of supervised visits would be better for the kids.

FaceTime?

Anonymous wrote:I'm surprised the judge ordered them to stay away from the kids completely. While I think they did an extremely foolish thing, I feel for the kids - first having been left alone in the cold, then taken by strangers (police/CPS), and now they won't be able to see their parents for weeks. I think some sort of supervised visits would be better for the kids.

Seriously at this point the kids are likely more traumatized by not having seen their parents since Sat afternoon than by a cold car. I wonder where they are -- i.e. with family or in some hellish foster home with complete strangers and a ton of other kids. I imagine the parents do/will get to visit wherever the kids are. Any idea if this couple has family in this general area? I'm guessing no bc if you were so desperate to go out or were at your wit's end and just needed 2 hrs away from the kids on a Sat afternoon and you had a sister or grandmom or someone close by -- I'd imagine you'd beg them to take the kids instead of leaving them in a car.

Also what's the going rate for those emergency nanny services like WH Nannies? For 3 hrs on a Saturday would it even cost more than a few hundred?

Anonymous wrote:I'm surprised the judge ordered them to stay away from the kids completely. While I think they did an extremely foolish thing, I feel for the kids - first having been left alone in the cold, then taken by strangers (police/CPS), and now they won't be able to see their parents for weeks. I think some sort of supervised visits would be better for the kids.

Since they were surprised the police were called and what they did was was incredibly stupid, maybe it was a precaution.

I'm surprised the judge ordered them to stay away from the kids completely. While I think they did an extremely foolish thing, I feel for the kids - first having been left alone in the cold, then taken by strangers (police/CPS), and now they won't be able to see their parents for weeks. I think some sort of supervised visits would be better for the kids.

Only they NEVER in one hour checked in and car was around the corner on a City street.

NP here. Wait, the car was on the street? I must not have read the first article carefully enough because all this time I have pictured this occurring in a virtually empty, since it was a Saturday afternoon, downtown parking garage. NOT THAT THAT WOULD BE ANY BETTER from the neglect perspective, but on the street is just much, much stupider from the likely to be caught perspective.

I think the misanthrope poster is probably bang on about the circumstances that led up to this. I was thinking that they were out and about all day and the kids fell asleep in the car, but PPs scenario rings much more likely. It's chilling picturing them in the car, waiting their ten minutes both to develop their plan and also be fashionably late.
- someone who has an unreliable babysitter and who has felt that crushing disappointment of wanting to go somewhere and not being able to at the last fucking minute, but would never, ever do this.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The footage of those two losers racing away from the camera crew was just the laugh I needed tonight.

Link, please. TIA

Go to page 20 at 20:58 from WJLA

Anonymous wrote:For those of you who have kids this age (mine isn't old enough yet), how much do they talk and convey thoughts and more importantly how much do they remember?

Will a 3 yr old talk about how he/she was so cold in the car or develop a fear of cars or whatever? How about a 2 yr old? Will they forget eventually or is it going to take years? Or is it like infants where they don't remember/have a sense of time? I realize every kid is different but just curious from a child dev point of view.

My youngest kid will be three in a few weeks and she could tell me in great detail how she didn't want to do something again if it upset her. Last summer a neighborhood girl tossed her out of a wagon head first at a party and she almost hit the cement, but was still stunned and shaken. To this day, if we walk past that girl's house, she comments on how so-and-so isn't nice and she never wants to play with her again. She wasn't even 2 1/2 then. I am not sure how she would deal with this, and all kids are different, but I hope both those kids are in a loving environment right now, and haven't been abused in other ways. So darn sad, and so damn selfish.