Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You right-wingers are idiots. Vouchers aren’t accepted at reputable private schools and don’t even come close to covering tuition at any decent private.

Vouchers are a Republican scam to get federal funds to religious organizations that run so-called schools.

Wow you're entitled: "If the voucher is not accepted at elite private, why do we have a voucher program?!?"
Reminder: We have lots of other (non big-3) private schools which the families already prefer to their local public schools.

You likely won't be eligible for vouches anyway. There will be an income based test, guaranteed. And if you do get vouchers, you will not like the schools where you can use them. So instead, the money will go from the federal government into the pockets of mostly for-profit schools through the hands of extremely underprivileged kids who would have had better supports had they stayed in public school.

I love the way they make a voucher program sound in theory, but that is so laughably far from what it would actually be that it should be unethical to spout the voucher nonsense you hear. You imagine the federal government is going to hand you a check, and you will turn around and give it to the school of your dreams and waltz right in: that will never happen. And logistically, if every kid in the country gets one, where are they all going to go? And how different would it end up being from where they all are now? Think it through on the full scale, not the fantasy you have imagining yourself in the world as it is now suddenly having a few extra bucks. Whoever accepts your voucher will be regulated and have to prove they are not discriminating in admissions and are meeting the needs of all students with that tax payer money, and guess how schools do that? Affirmative action and standardized testing.

I don't think we can make that assumption. You are looking at the worst case possibility, and generalizing it. There will be good apples and bad apples. People have their public school if they want, or the voucher for the private if they want. What is wrong with that scenario? Nothing!

Without some mechanism to weed out the bad apples there will be more than a few who are just out for profit. There needs to be some mechanism for oversight to ensure bad actors aren’t creating an even worse education for kids. http://rethinkingschools.org/articles/keeping-public-schools-public-free-market-education/

FYI: There are bad public schools. We are not using that fact as an excuse to get rid of all public schools. When people are constrained within their zipcode, the public school (which may be bad) has a stream of students anyway and not much incentive to improve itself.

Give choice to eligible families, and see where they choose to send their kids.

True, but syphoning money from public schools to con artists can’t be a good idea. I support the idea
of vouchers but only if the schools have to go through some sort
of accreditation process to be sure they are actually educating kids and not just lining their pockets with government funds. You just have to read the Whittle thread to see how easy it is to use smoke and mirrors to convince people to give you money to educate their kids. Reputable private schools are accredited. If you truly believe in giving parents a choice about where to send their kids, shouldn’t you also believe that those schools should be held to some basic standards?

Yes of course the schools have to hold up to some standards. Noone is claiming otherwise.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You right-wingers are idiots. Vouchers aren’t accepted at reputable private schools and don’t even come close to covering tuition at any decent private.

Vouchers are a Republican scam to get federal funds to religious organizations that run so-called schools.

Wow you're entitled: "If the voucher is not accepted at elite private, why do we have a voucher program?!?"
Reminder: We have lots of other (non big-3) private schools which the families already prefer to their local public schools.

You likely won't be eligible for vouches anyway. There will be an income based test, guaranteed. And if you do get vouchers, you will not like the schools where you can use them. So instead, the money will go from the federal government into the pockets of mostly for-profit schools through the hands of extremely underprivileged kids who would have had better supports had they stayed in public school.

I love the way they make a voucher program sound in theory, but that is so laughably far from what it would actually be that it should be unethical to spout the voucher nonsense you hear. You imagine the federal government is going to hand you a check, and you will turn around and give it to the school of your dreams and waltz right in: that will never happen. And logistically, if every kid in the country gets one, where are they all going to go? And how different would it end up being from where they all are now? Think it through on the full scale, not the fantasy you have imagining yourself in the world as it is now suddenly having a few extra bucks. Whoever accepts your voucher will be regulated and have to prove they are not discriminating in admissions and are meeting the needs of all students with that tax payer money, and guess how schools do that? Affirmative action and standardized testing.

I don't think we can make that assumption. You are looking at the worst case possibility, and generalizing it. There will be good apples and bad apples. People have their public school if they want, or the voucher for the private if they want. What is wrong with that scenario? Nothing!

Without some mechanism to weed out the bad apples there will be more than a few who are just out for profit. There needs to be some mechanism for oversight to ensure bad actors aren’t creating an even worse education for kids. http://rethinkingschools.org/articles/keeping-public-schools-public-free-market-education/

FYI: There are bad public schools. We are not using that fact as an excuse to get rid of all public schools. When people are constrained within their zipcode, the public school (which may be bad) has a stream of students anyway and not much incentive to improve itself.

Give choice to eligible families, and see where they choose to send their kids.

True, but syphoning money from public schools to con artists can’t be a good idea. I support the idea
of vouchers but only if the schools have to go through some sort
of accreditation process to be sure they are actually educating kids and not just lining their pockets with government funds. You just have to read the Whittle thread to see how easy it is to use smoke and mirrors to convince people to give you money to educate their kids. Reputable private schools are accredited. If you truly believe in giving parents a choice about where to send their kids, shouldn’t you also believe that those schools should be held to some basic standards?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You right-wingers are idiots. Vouchers aren’t accepted at reputable private schools and don’t even come close to covering tuition at any decent private.

Vouchers are a Republican scam to get federal funds to religious organizations that run so-called schools.

Wow you're entitled: "If the voucher is not accepted at elite private, why do we have a voucher program?!?"
Reminder: We have lots of other (non big-3) private schools which the families already prefer to their local public schools.

You likely won't be eligible for vouches anyway. There will be an income based test, guaranteed. And if you do get vouchers, you will not like the schools where you can use them. So instead, the money will go from the federal government into the pockets of mostly for-profit schools through the hands of extremely underprivileged kids who would have had better supports had they stayed in public school.

I love the way they make a voucher program sound in theory, but that is so laughably far from what it would actually be that it should be unethical to spout the voucher nonsense you hear. You imagine the federal government is going to hand you a check, and you will turn around and give it to the school of your dreams and waltz right in: that will never happen. And logistically, if every kid in the country gets one, where are they all going to go? And how different would it end up being from where they all are now? Think it through on the full scale, not the fantasy you have imagining yourself in the world as it is now suddenly having a few extra bucks. Whoever accepts your voucher will be regulated and have to prove they are not discriminating in admissions and are meeting the needs of all students with that tax payer money, and guess how schools do that? Affirmative action and standardized testing.

I don't think we can make that assumption. You are looking at the worst case possibility, and generalizing it. There will be good apples and bad apples. People have their public school if they want, or the voucher for the private if they want. What is wrong with that scenario? Nothing!

Without some mechanism to weed out the bad apples there will be more than a few who are just out for profit. There needs to be some mechanism for oversight to ensure bad actors aren’t creating an even worse education for kids. http://rethinkingschools.org/articles/keeping-public-schools-public-free-market-education/

FYI: There are bad public schools. We are not using that fact as an excuse to get rid of all public schools. When people are constrained within their zipcode, the public school (which may be bad) has a stream of students anyway and not much incentive to improve itself.

Give choice to eligible families, and see where they choose to send their kids.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You right-wingers are idiots. Vouchers aren’t accepted at reputable private schools and don’t even come close to covering tuition at any decent private.

Vouchers are a Republican scam to get federal funds to religious organizations that run so-called schools.

Wow you're entitled: "If the voucher is not accepted at elite private, why do we have a voucher program?!?"
Reminder: We have lots of other (non big-3) private schools which the families already prefer to their local public schools.

You likely won't be eligible for vouches anyway. There will be an income based test, guaranteed. And if you do get vouchers, you will not like the schools where you can use them. So instead, the money will go from the federal government into the pockets of mostly for-profit schools through the hands of extremely underprivileged kids who would have had better supports had they stayed in public school.

I love the way they make a voucher program sound in theory, but that is so laughably far from what it would actually be that it should be unethical to spout the voucher nonsense you hear. You imagine the federal government is going to hand you a check, and you will turn around and give it to the school of your dreams and waltz right in: that will never happen. And logistically, if every kid in the country gets one, where are they all going to go? And how different would it end up being from where they all are now? Think it through on the full scale, not the fantasy you have imagining yourself in the world as it is now suddenly having a few extra bucks. Whoever accepts your voucher will be regulated and have to prove they are not discriminating in admissions and are meeting the needs of all students with that tax payer money, and guess how schools do that? Affirmative action and standardized testing.

I don't think we can make that assumption. You are looking at the worst case possibility, and generalizing it. There will be good apples and bad apples. People have their public school if they want, or the voucher for the private if they want. What is wrong with that scenario? Nothing!

Without some mechanism to weed out the bad apples there will be more than a few who are just out for profit. There needs to be some mechanism for oversight to ensure bad actors aren’t creating an even worse education for kids. http://rethinkingschools.org/articles/keeping-public-schools-public-free-market-education/

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You right-wingers are idiots. Vouchers aren’t accepted at reputable private schools and don’t even come close to covering tuition at any decent private.

Vouchers are a Republican scam to get federal funds to religious organizations that run so-called schools.

Wow you're entitled: "If the voucher is not accepted at elite private, why do we have a voucher program?!?"
Reminder: We have lots of other (non big-3) private schools which the families already prefer to their local public schools.

You likely won't be eligible for vouches anyway. There will be an income based test, guaranteed. And if you do get vouchers, you will not like the schools where you can use them. So instead, the money will go from the federal government into the pockets of mostly for-profit schools through the hands of extremely underprivileged kids who would have had better supports had they stayed in public school.

I love the way they make a voucher program sound in theory, but that is so laughably far from what it would actually be that it should be unethical to spout the voucher nonsense you hear. You imagine the federal government is going to hand you a check, and you will turn around and give it to the school of your dreams and waltz right in: that will never happen. And logistically, if every kid in the country gets one, where are they all going to go? And how different would it end up being from where they all are now? Think it through on the full scale, not the fantasy you have imagining yourself in the world as it is now suddenly having a few extra bucks. Whoever accepts your voucher will be regulated and have to prove they are not discriminating in admissions and are meeting the needs of all students with that tax payer money, and guess how schools do that? Affirmative action and standardized testing.

I don't think we can make that assumption. You are looking at the worst case possibility, and generalizing it. There will be good apples and bad apples. People have their public school if they want, or the voucher for the private if they want. What is wrong with that scenario? Nothing!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You right-wingers are idiots. Vouchers aren’t accepted at reputable private schools and don’t even come close to covering tuition at any decent private.

Vouchers are a Republican scam to get federal funds to religious organizations that run so-called schools.

Wow you're entitled: "If the voucher is not accepted at elite private, why do we have a voucher program?!?"
Reminder: We have lots of other (non big-3) private schools which the families already prefer to their local public schools.

You likely won't be eligible for vouches anyway. There will be an income based test, guaranteed. And if you do get vouchers, you will not like the schools where you can use them. So instead, the money will go from the federal government into the pockets of mostly for-profit schools through the hands of extremely underprivileged kids who would have had better supports had they stayed in public school.

I love the way they make a voucher program sound in theory, but that is so laughably far from what it would actually be that it should be unethical to spout the voucher nonsense you hear. You imagine the federal government is going to hand you a check, and you will turn around and give it to the school of your dreams and waltz right in: that will never happen. And logistically, if every kid in the country gets one, where are they all going to go? And how different would it end up being from where they all are now? Think it through on the full scale, not the fantasy you have imagining yourself in the world as it is now suddenly having a few extra bucks. Whoever accepts your voucher will be regulated and have to prove they are not discriminating in admissions and are meeting the needs of all students with that tax payer money, and guess how schools do that? Affirmative action and standardized testing.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Youngkin’s kids went to Little Langley, NCS, St Albans and Georgetown Prep. All privates. Most not even in Virginia. Very very telling.

Um, His opponent sent his kids to the Ultra Elite Potomac School in McLean.

And? Had zero to do with current subject. But nice try whataboutism-er.

It is relevant. His democrat opponent sent his kids to the most expensive and ultra elite school in virginia (more elite than Little Langley, more expensive and harder to get into). He had choice for his kids due to the amount of money he has, and exercised that choice. And, his policy proposal is not to give parents public school choice options outside their zipcodes, and not to give vouchers for privae schools. I think that is very apalling, and very very elite.

That’s not how public school works in this country - no one is owed vouchers or “public school choice.” You go to the public school to which you are assigned or test in to a magnet. That is our public school system. If you don’t like it, it’s on you to find an alternative. Stop promoting the notion that you are OWED anything beyond a free education for your kid in the public school system. That’s not how it works.

- product of public schools.

+1

Taxpayers shouldn't subsidize private school. Despite what the entitled private school elites may try to sell the masses.

Taxpayers are already funding the public school system, whether they send their kid to public school or to private, or to neither.

So, when a family is paying taxes, some of that is going to public schools. Families should have the right to not pay their share of taxes intended for public schools if they are choosing private. Basically that is what the voucher is. It is what the family paid in taxes for the public school, but then is taking that money back and giving it to private school to pay for some part of the tuition. That is a choice that is very reasonable. There is nothing elite about this.

Well, not exactly. Not everyone pays taxes, and not everyone pays the same amount of taxes. And at least in DC in order to be eligible for a voucher, you have to be among those not earning enough to be paying taxes (or at least not much).

"families must either receive benefits under the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP) or earn no more than 185 percent of the federal poverty level (FPL) when they enter the program ($48,470 for a family of four in 2020–21)."

Anonymous wrote:You right-wingers are idiots. Vouchers aren’t accepted at reputable private schools and don’t even come close to covering tuition at any decent private.

Vouchers are a Republican scam to get federal funds to religious organizations that run so-called schools.

It’s not just a GOP scam. It also appeals to a lot of “I’m a Liberal but I had to vote for the Trump-loving neo-fascist because he’ll keep the schools open” Democrats.

And of course none of these pro-voucher folks care about anyone except themselves. As long as they get theirs, the rest can crash and burn.

Anonymous wrote:You right-wingers are idiots. Vouchers aren’t accepted at reputable private schools and don’t even come close to covering tuition at any decent private.

Vouchers are a Republican scam to get federal funds to religious organizations that run so-called schools.

Wow you're entitled: "If the voucher is not accepted at elite private, why do we have a voucher program?!?"
Reminder: We have lots of other (non big-3) private schools which the families already prefer to their local public schools.

Anonymous wrote:You right-wingers are idiots. Vouchers aren’t accepted at reputable private schools and don’t even come close to covering tuition at any decent private.

Vouchers are a Republican scam to get federal funds to religious organizations that run so-called schools.

My field is economics of education. I can tell you that your last sentence is wrong.

Your second sentence is not relevant at all. Nobody is expecting it to cover tuition. But say that the tuition is 40K. Financial aid is 5K. Voucher is $X. Whatever the voucher amount is, it will help the family if it is in need. Denying the voucher amount to the family is elite.

You right-wingers are idiots. Vouchers aren’t accepted at reputable private schools and don’t even come close to covering tuition at any decent private.

Vouchers are a Republican scam to get federal funds to religious organizations that run so-called schools.

Except that vouchers aren't even remotely enough to cover tuition at most reputable private schools. Plus most of them don't take vouchers anyways and instead give financial aid. Why in the world would a Big 3 for example take voucher money which opens them up to government oversight? It's not going to happen. Instead voucher students often end up going to storefront schools that are often offering an education that is worse than public and are set up just for profit off the voucher money. Or, they are going to small religious based schools - which for some families is a great option, for others that's not what they are looking for. Charter schools are a better bet if you can't afford private and your public is back although some charters are much better than others so you have to be careful there too. There's no simple solution, despite what the political sound bites on both sides want you to believe.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Youngkin’s kids went to Little Langley, NCS, St Albans and Georgetown Prep. All privates. Most not even in Virginia. Very very telling.

Um, His opponent sent his kids to the Ultra Elite Potomac School in McLean.

And? Had zero to do with current subject. But nice try whataboutism-er.

It is relevant. His democrat opponent sent his kids to the most expensive and ultra elite school in virginia (more elite than Little Langley, more expensive and harder to get into). He had choice for his kids due to the amount of money he has, and exercised that choice. And, his policy proposal is not to give parents public school choice options outside their zipcodes, and not to give vouchers for privae schools. I think that is very apalling, and very very elite.

That’s not how public school works in this country - no one is owed vouchers or “public school choice.” You go to the public school to which you are assigned or test in to a magnet. That is our public school system. If you don’t like it, it’s on you to find an alternative. Stop promoting the notion that you are OWED anything beyond a free education for your kid in the public school system. That’s not how it works.

- product of public schools.

+1

Taxpayers shouldn't subsidize private school. Despite what the entitled private school elites may try to sell the masses.

Taxpayers are already funding the public school system, whether they send their kid to public school or to private, or to neither.

So, when a family is paying taxes, some of that is going to public schools. Families should have the right to not pay their share of taxes intended for public schools if they are choosing private. Basically that is what the voucher is. It is what the family paid in taxes for the public school, but then is taking that money back and giving it to private school to pay for some part of the tuition. That is a choice that is very reasonable. There is nothing elite about this.

When a family is not a millionaire, that voucher to be used for a private school is a meaningful amount of money. The family has every right to demand it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Youngkin’s kids went to Little Langley, NCS, St Albans and Georgetown Prep. All privates. Most not even in Virginia. Very very telling.

Um, His opponent sent his kids to the Ultra Elite Potomac School in McLean.

And? Had zero to do with current subject. But nice try whataboutism-er.

It is relevant. His democrat opponent sent his kids to the most expensive and ultra elite school in virginia (more elite than Little Langley, more expensive and harder to get into). He had choice for his kids due to the amount of money he has, and exercised that choice. And, his policy proposal is not to give parents public school choice options outside their zipcodes, and not to give vouchers for privae schools. I think that is very apalling, and very very elite.

That’s not how public school works in this country - no one is owed vouchers or “public school choice.” You go to the public school to which you are assigned or test in to a magnet. That is our public school system. If you don’t like it, it’s on you to find an alternative. Stop promoting the notion that you are OWED anything beyond a free education for your kid in the public school system. That’s not how it works.

- product of public schools.

+1

Taxpayers shouldn't subsidize private school. Despite what the entitled private school elites may try to sell the masses.

Taxpayers are already funding the public school system, whether they send their kid to public school or to private, or to neither.

So, when a family is paying taxes, some of that is going to public schools. Families should have the right to not pay their share of taxes intended for public schools if they are choosing private. Basically that is what the voucher is. It is what the family paid in taxes for the public school, but then is taking that money back and giving it to private school to pay for some part of the tuition. That is a choice that is very reasonable. There is nothing elite about this.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Youngkin’s kids went to Little Langley, NCS, St Albans and Georgetown Prep. All privates. Most not even in Virginia. Very very telling.

Um, His opponent sent his kids to the Ultra Elite Potomac School in McLean.

And? Had zero to do with current subject. But nice try whataboutism-er.

It is relevant. His democrat opponent sent his kids to the most expensive and ultra elite school in virginia (more elite than Little Langley, more expensive and harder to get into). He had choice for his kids due to the amount of money he has, and exercised that choice. And, his policy proposal is not to give parents public school choice options outside their zipcodes, and not to give vouchers for privae schools. I think that is very apalling, and very very elite.

That’s not how public school works in this country - no one is owed vouchers or “public school choice.” You go to the public school to which you are assigned or test in to a magnet. That is our public school system. If you don’t like it, it’s on you to find an alternative. Stop promoting the notion that you are OWED anything beyond a free education for your kid in the public school system. That’s not how it works.

- product of public schools.

+1

Taxpayers shouldn't subsidize private school. Despite what the entitled private school elites may try to sell the masses.

Private schools are currently fully enrolled. How would this even work? There aren’t enough seats for additional students.