Anonymous
05/21/2021 16:44
Subject: Compacted Math- FYI
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:But the MAP covers material that may not have been reviewed or discussed this year. They are not being taught for that test.
This is true, and I think MCPS knows this. They seem to be in a position of either "retaining" everyone (i.e.) only letting the 4/5s move to 5 and not 5/6, or trying to find some combo of information to let some students move up to 5/6. If a student does well on the current tests, has As in math, and has a high MAP score, they can probably move on to 5/6 and not be at too great a deficit with what was not taught in 4/5 this year. But if they did well on course content this year, and have a low MAP score, they may struggle next year. It shows that they are good at math, and do well when taught the materials, but may not know as many of the concepts that they should to move onto the next higher compacted level. Of course there are a bunch of what ifs in this - testing circumstances this year, kids who don't do as well on tests to show their knowledge, etc.
Right, but MCPS is not "retaining" anyone in regular 4th Grade Math, they're all moving to 5, with the expectation that the teachers will catch them up on the untaught material over the next couple of years. Why must they retain anyone in 4/5? Even if they don't meet the criteria, they are the stronger math students? Why retain them to repeat some of the 5th grade math, rather than teaching the missing math in 5/6? They don't want to adjust anything about the Eureka curriculum?
Anonymous
05/21/2021 16:37
Subject: Compacted Math- FYI
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Is it 90th percentile of 4th or 5th grade. If they have only covered half of 5th then the latter standard seems crazy.
MAP is an adaptive test, there are three different levels used by MCPS - MAP-P (or MAP- M K-2), MAP-M 2-6, and MAP-M 6+.
All kids take the same "test" in grades 2 through 5, regardless of what course they are in. The test questions adjust based on their past performance.
The percentile score is not a percentage of the material the student got correct, or the percentage of grade level material a student has mastered.
The percentile which shows the student scored as well or better than a certain percentage of students in the norming year that took the test. So a 90th percentile in 5th grade means the student scored as well or better than 90% of the 5th grade students who took the test in the norming year. They calculate scores called RIT scores which take into account the complexity and level of the problems.
Yes, my question is whether the percentile to continue into 5/6 from 4/5 requires a 90th on the 4th or 5th grade scale. Seems crazy to require spring 5th grade since they haven't completed that material.
No one can answer that. Talk to your school. It is very school dependent. You need to supplement at home.
I disagree. I should not have to supplement my child who is getting As in compact 4/5 just to get a higher score on a standardized test. The point of school is to teach the kids math!!
Amen. And if my kid is getting good grades in math (not a subjective class) this should reflect on the MAP.
+1 There was a lot less practice and IMO less retention of information in the online format.
It was just the opposite at our school. Seems like MAP scores have gone through the roof this past year.
Interesting because they haven’t county wide - to the contrary.
Anonymous
05/21/2021 16:27
Subject: Compacted Math- FYI
Anonymous wrote:But the MAP covers material that may not have been reviewed or discussed this year. They are not being taught for that test.
This is true, and I think MCPS knows this. They seem to be in a position of either "retaining" everyone (i.e.) only letting the 4/5s move to 5 and not 5/6, or trying to find some combo of information to let some students move up to 5/6. If a student does well on the current tests, has As in math, and has a high MAP score, they can probably move on to 5/6 and not be at too great a deficit with what was not taught in 4/5 this year. But if they did well on course content this year, and have a low MAP score, they may struggle next year. It shows that they are good at math, and do well when taught the materials, but may not know as many of the concepts that they should to move onto the next higher compacted level. Of course there are a bunch of what ifs in this - testing circumstances this year, kids who don't do as well on tests to show their knowledge, etc.
Anonymous
05/21/2021 15:29
Subject: Compacted Math- FYI
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Is it 90th percentile of 4th or 5th grade. If they have only covered half of 5th then the latter standard seems crazy.
MAP is an adaptive test, there are three different levels used by MCPS - MAP-P (or MAP- M K-2), MAP-M 2-6, and MAP-M 6+.
All kids take the same "test" in grades 2 through 5, regardless of what course they are in. The test questions adjust based on their past performance.
The percentile score is not a percentage of the material the student got correct, or the percentage of grade level material a student has mastered.
The percentile which shows the student scored as well or better than a certain percentage of students in the norming year that took the test. So a 90th percentile in 5th grade means the student scored as well or better than 90% of the 5th grade students who took the test in the norming year. They calculate scores called RIT scores which take into account the complexity and level of the problems.
Yes, my question is whether the percentile to continue into 5/6 from 4/5 requires a 90th on the 4th or 5th grade scale. Seems crazy to require spring 5th grade since they haven't completed that material.
No one can answer that. Talk to your school. It is very school dependent. You need to supplement at home.
I disagree. I should not have to supplement my child who is getting As in compact 4/5 just to get a higher score on a standardized test. The point of school is to teach the kids math!!
Amen. And if my kid is getting good grades in math (not a subjective class) this should reflect on the MAP.
+1 There was a lot less practice and IMO less retention of information in the online format.
It was just the opposite at our school. Seems like MAP scores have gone through the roof this past year.
You know why this is the case, right? Because everyone's cheating at home.
If your kids are cheating its on you.. Mine aren't and it will catch up to them later on when they cannot do the work. In person there was little practice and parents who wanted retention supplemented. You have to teach your kids things like math facts.
Anonymous
05/21/2021 15:19
Subject: Compacted Math- FYI
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Is it 90th percentile of 4th or 5th grade. If they have only covered half of 5th then the latter standard seems crazy.
MAP is an adaptive test, there are three different levels used by MCPS - MAP-P (or MAP- M K-2), MAP-M 2-6, and MAP-M 6+.
All kids take the same "test" in grades 2 through 5, regardless of what course they are in. The test questions adjust based on their past performance.
The percentile score is not a percentage of the material the student got correct, or the percentage of grade level material a student has mastered.
The percentile which shows the student scored as well or better than a certain percentage of students in the norming year that took the test. So a 90th percentile in 5th grade means the student scored as well or better than 90% of the 5th grade students who took the test in the norming year. They calculate scores called RIT scores which take into account the complexity and level of the problems.
Yes, my question is whether the percentile to continue into 5/6 from 4/5 requires a 90th on the 4th or 5th grade scale. Seems crazy to require spring 5th grade since they haven't completed that material.
No one can answer that. Talk to your school. It is very school dependent. You need to supplement at home.
I disagree. I should not have to supplement my child who is getting As in compact 4/5 just to get a higher score on a standardized test. The point of school is to teach the kids math!!
Amen. And if my kid is getting good grades in math (not a subjective class) this should reflect on the MAP.
+1 There was a lot less practice and IMO less retention of information in the online format.
It was just the opposite at our school. Seems like MAP scores have gone through the roof this past year.
You know why this is the case, right? Because everyone's cheating at home.
Anonymous
05/21/2021 15:12
Subject: Compacted Math- FYI
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Is it 90th percentile of 4th or 5th grade. If they have only covered half of 5th then the latter standard seems crazy.
MAP is an adaptive test, there are three different levels used by MCPS - MAP-P (or MAP- M K-2), MAP-M 2-6, and MAP-M 6+.
All kids take the same "test" in grades 2 through 5, regardless of what course they are in. The test questions adjust based on their past performance.
The percentile score is not a percentage of the material the student got correct, or the percentage of grade level material a student has mastered.
The percentile which shows the student scored as well or better than a certain percentage of students in the norming year that took the test. So a 90th percentile in 5th grade means the student scored as well or better than 90% of the 5th grade students who took the test in the norming year. They calculate scores called RIT scores which take into account the complexity and level of the problems.
Yes, my question is whether the percentile to continue into 5/6 from 4/5 requires a 90th on the 4th or 5th grade scale. Seems crazy to require spring 5th grade since they haven't completed that material.
No one can answer that. Talk to your school. It is very school dependent. You need to supplement at home.
I disagree. I should not have to supplement my child who is getting As in compact 4/5 just to get a higher score on a standardized test. The point of school is to teach the kids math!!
Amen. And if my kid is getting good grades in math (not a subjective class) this should reflect on the MAP.
+1 There was a lot less practice and IMO less retention of information in the online format.
Are you sure? I have a 6th grader and during compacted math they never got any homework or practice outside school. No work ever came home so we have no idea what happened in school. If you want practice you have to do it yourself.
The map scores really vary by expectation by school. What someone posted may be true for their school but not another school.
Anonymous
05/21/2021 15:10
Subject: Compacted Math- FYI
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:But the MAP covers material that may not have been reviewed or discussed this year. They are not being taught for that test.
For example, geometry concepts were not covered in detail this year. If a child does not do well on that section of the MAP, it is not a reflection of ability to perform in the math class.
Again maybe this was true at your school but at our school they spent months on this.
Please stop. It is not helpful to continually hear how your school managed to cover lessons not outlined to be covered by MCPS. Most schools covered what was outlined by MCPS and added extra when they could, but did not come close to a "normal" year. I am happy for your kid(s) that your school did, but that is not the norm this year. Our school is great, our DD's teacher is outstanding, and still they did not cover geometry which was not on the MCPS math schedule. People are trying to understand what was required/outlined by MCPS and how much was left out. Not because of what the teacher or school chose not to cover, but because that is what MCPS told them to cover/leave out.
Why does it matter? You either supplement or you don't worry about it. Issue solved. Even before covid, it really depended on the teacher. We had multiple subs and then covid hit last year. Kids barely got any education and it was all fine. Some of us supplemented, some did not. Either way, if you are going into 6th, you'll go into AIM and depending on the school, a few outliers will go into Algebra. Its 4/5 grade. The key is to know math facts and the basics. You can get some workbooks this summer or use the ones MCPS gave you.
Anonymous
05/21/2021 14:33
Subject: Compacted Math- FYI
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:But the MAP covers material that may not have been reviewed or discussed this year. They are not being taught for that test.
For example, geometry concepts were not covered in detail this year. If a child does not do well on that section of the MAP, it is not a reflection of ability to perform in the math class.
Again maybe this was true at your school but at our school they spent months on this.
Please stop. It is not helpful to continually hear how your school managed to cover lessons not outlined to be covered by MCPS. Most schools covered what was outlined by MCPS and added extra when they could, but did not come close to a "normal" year. I am happy for your kid(s) that your school did, but that is not the norm this year. Our school is great, our DD's teacher is outstanding, and still they did not cover geometry which was not on the MCPS math schedule. People are trying to understand what was required/outlined by MCPS and how much was left out. Not because of what the teacher or school chose not to cover, but because that is what MCPS told them to cover/leave out.
Anonymous
05/21/2021 12:48
Subject: Compacted Math- FYI
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:But the MAP covers material that may not have been reviewed or discussed this year. They are not being taught for that test.
For example, geometry concepts were not covered in detail this year. If a child does not do well on that section of the MAP, it is not a reflection of ability to perform in the math class.
Again maybe this was true at your school but at our school they spent months on this.
Anonymous
05/21/2021 11:54
Subject: Compacted Math- FYI
Anonymous wrote:But the MAP covers material that may not have been reviewed or discussed this year. They are not being taught for that test.
For example, geometry concepts were not covered in detail this year. If a child does not do well on that section of the MAP, it is not a reflection of ability to perform in the math class.
Anonymous
05/21/2021 11:51
Subject: Compacted Math- FYI
But the MAP covers material that may not have been reviewed or discussed this year. They are not being taught for that test.
Anonymous
05/21/2021 11:05
Subject: Compacted Math- FYI
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Is it 90th percentile of 4th or 5th grade. If they have only covered half of 5th then the latter standard seems crazy.
Here's a great website that converts MAP scores into percentiles for different grades: https://sites.google.com/view/nweapercentilecalculator
220 in the fall is at the 92.2 percentile for 4th grade (scoring better than 92.2 percent of 4th graders taking the test) and 76.3 percentile compared to fifth graders.
238 in the spring is 96.1 percentile for 4th grade and 87.5 percentile for 5th graders.
So we never did get clarification of whether it's 220/238 or 90th percentile, right?
Thanks for this link, it's helpful.
Anonymous
05/21/2021 10:19
Subject: Compacted Math- FYI
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Is it 90th percentile of 4th or 5th grade. If they have only covered half of 5th then the latter standard seems crazy.
MAP is an adaptive test, there are three different levels used by MCPS - MAP-P (or MAP- M K-2), MAP-M 2-6, and MAP-M 6+.
All kids take the same "test" in grades 2 through 5, regardless of what course they are in. The test questions adjust based on their past performance.
The percentile score is not a percentage of the material the student got correct, or the percentage of grade level material a student has mastered.
The percentile which shows the student scored as well or better than a certain percentage of students in the norming year that took the test. So a 90th percentile in 5th grade means the student scored as well or better than 90% of the 5th grade students who took the test in the norming year. They calculate scores called RIT scores which take into account the complexity and level of the problems.
Yes, my question is whether the percentile to continue into 5/6 from 4/5 requires a 90th on the 4th or 5th grade scale. Seems crazy to require spring 5th grade since they haven't completed that material.
No one can answer that. Talk to your school. It is very school dependent. You need to supplement at home.
I disagree. I should not have to supplement my child who is getting As in compact 4/5 just to get a higher score on a standardized test. The point of school is to teach the kids math!!
Amen. And if my kid is getting good grades in math (not a subjective class) this should reflect on the MAP.
+1 There was a lot less practice and IMO less retention of information in the online format.
It was just the opposite at our school. Seems like MAP scores have gone through the roof this past year.
Anonymous
05/21/2021 09:27
Subject: Compacted Math- FYI
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Is it 90th percentile of 4th or 5th grade. If they have only covered half of 5th then the latter standard seems crazy.
MAP is an adaptive test, there are three different levels used by MCPS - MAP-P (or MAP- M K-2), MAP-M 2-6, and MAP-M 6+.
All kids take the same "test" in grades 2 through 5, regardless of what course they are in. The test questions adjust based on their past performance.
The percentile score is not a percentage of the material the student got correct, or the percentage of grade level material a student has mastered.
The percentile which shows the student scored as well or better than a certain percentage of students in the norming year that took the test. So a 90th percentile in 5th grade means the student scored as well or better than 90% of the 5th grade students who took the test in the norming year. They calculate scores called RIT scores which take into account the complexity and level of the problems.
Yes, my question is whether the percentile to continue into 5/6 from 4/5 requires a 90th on the 4th or 5th grade scale. Seems crazy to require spring 5th grade since they haven't completed that material.
No one can answer that. Talk to your school. It is very school dependent. You need to supplement at home.
I disagree. I should not have to supplement my child who is getting As in compact 4/5 just to get a higher score on a standardized test. The point of school is to teach the kids math!!
Amen. And if my kid is getting good grades in math (not a subjective class) this should reflect on the MAP.
+1 There was a lot less practice and IMO less retention of information in the online format.
Anonymous
05/21/2021 08:29
Subject: Compacted Math- FYI
Anonymous wrote:Is it 90th percentile of 4th or 5th grade. If they have only covered half of 5th then the latter standard seems crazy.
Here's a great website that converts MAP scores into percentiles for different grades: https://sites.google.com/view/nweapercentilecalculator
220 in the fall is at the 92.2 percentile for 4th grade (scoring better than 92.2 percent of 4th graders taking the test) and 76.3 percentile compared to fifth graders.
238 in the spring is 96.1 percentile for 4th grade and 87.5 percentile for 5th graders.