OP said in an earlier thread that she asked her grandma about Mary's mental health, and the answer was basically, "I don't know, maybe..." That's why other posters keep bringing it up. They're not just drawing on the fact that Mary "failed to launch," but that someone who has known her for 50 years left it as an open question.

I can't stand all of the people who immediately want to diagnose a person with mental health issues because they chose the path of least resistance in life.

This woman sounds like a classic failure to launch. She had means and opportunity (several degrees, a fiance at one point, several jobs). She CHOSE to not take advantage of them. She had her mind made up about what she was and wasn't willing to do (management or bust). I see these type of people all the time. Being entitled and believing that the world owes you something is not a mental illness.

The only difference between the people that I interact with all day is that they don't have the luxury of quitting their job, because they have to pay bills. Mary on the other hand, always had an out - go live with and be supported by mom.

If Thelma did anything wrong, it was that she didn't force Mary to be an adult - instead, enabling her to be a quitter and maintaining an entitled view on life.

My parents kicked me out of the house at 17 (because of my behavior - and I do not blame them). When I dropped out of college, they completely cut me off and we didn't speak for 10 years (the day I graduated from college). During the time that I was kicked out of my parents house, I was homeless, got into heroin, and lived under a bridge. I ended up in a hospital one day and realized that I had hit rock bottom. I detoxed while in the hospital. I ended up getting my life together. I made a choice to be a better person. I made a choice to be successful and to find happiness.

I wouldn't trade my parents for anything. Quite frankly, I would have been Mary if my parents didn't hold me accountable and force me to grow up, be responsible, and learn about everything that I was capable of doing (I now have my Master's, my PMP, have a great career, am amazing daughter). I truly believe that I would not have any of these things if it weren't for my parents "tough love".

My parents are also giving all of their assets to charities - nothing goes to the children or any other family member. I am not resentful of this. I understand that my parents were always big believers in social responsibility.

My point is - I feel sorry for Mary - but none of this is OP's fault. She has been placed in a very difficult situation and she is trying to make the best of it. However, for all the people who think that something is going on here that is not right, you are absolutely wrong. Mary had 50 years to make better decisions. The fact that she even believed that she could just leech off her mom for her entire life and afterlife, is really the same reason she is in this situation to begin with. That isn't mental illness - that is entitlement.

Anonymous wrote:The more you write, the more it sounds like Mary might have some form of mental health issue. Does your extended family generally accept the idea of getting professional help for such issues? Or is there more of an attitude of not believing that mental health issues are real and that people are just lazy or spoiled?

Yeah, another poster suggested that Mary's mental health issue is "alternative depression". just because someone's a bum doesn't mean they're depressed. Give me a break.

The more you write, the more it sounds like Mary might have some form of mental health issue. Does your extended family generally accept the idea of getting professional help for such issues? Or is there more of an attitude of not believing that mental health issues are real and that people are just lazy or spoiled?

not a matter of being spoiled.

you were given the property. Its yours.

the person inside the house, if Mary was not given any suvivorship benefits to the property dictated in the will, she needs to GTFO of the house. And yes the new property could be very accommodating and let Mary stay, but the new owner wants to take ownership of her property and begin living in it. Mary has had her free ride, it its reached the end of the line.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Has Mary burned down the house yet?

I bet there's no fire insurance.

We need the next chapter, please.

OP here.

Lol no, however, everyone in the family and the courts know about the situation now, so if anything fishy happens to the house, she will be first suspect on everyone's list. She is not showing any signs of moving out and my grandma went to talk with her last week about making plans. I'm not thrilled that my grandma is considering taking her in, but honestly??? I think because she is so much older than I am and as I grew up I saw her as an "adult", I have less sympathy than my gran who may still see her as a helpless 5 year old. Not sure, because my grandma floats between "she needs to grow up" and "I'd hate to see her on the street".

I have sent some handymen over there to fix some things and clear out the back yard since the weather has been nice. I was in the house 2 weeks ago and all of Mary's stuff is now in the master bedroom. I told her that she is more than welcome to take all of her mother's heirlooms (like China, figurines and jewelry) but she hasn't started to put anything in bubble wrap or boxes yet. She texted me to say that she "does not approve of having the carpet removed in the main floor of the house". The handy men and I removed it the other day because it was old, outdated and needed to be replaced (It was 20 yrs old). Oh and she didn't come downstairs, she texted me that from her room. Ugh it's so hard to take her seriously when she acts like a spoiled kid.

NP here. You sound like the spoiled kid.

How so? Should OP just sign the house over to Mary because she's had it so hard her whole life?

Well, OP, the reason she's in this situation now is because she was a spoiled kid. She can "hold her breath" and outlast the grownups. Thelma was put into the exact same situation as your Grandma is now, because no one really wants to see her out on the street.

I hope your Grandma will help her get into a rental now and not take her in, for both of their sakes. To ease her transition, it might help if your Grandma/family helps to find her a place and prepays the deposit and a month or two of the rent. It would be money well spent. Once she's in her own place, she'll be fine. She just doesn't know that yet. Good luck.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Has Mary burned down the house yet?

I bet there's no fire insurance.

We need the next chapter, please.

OP here.

Lol no, however, everyone in the family and the courts know about the situation now, so if anything fishy happens to the house, she will be first suspect on everyone's list. She is not showing any signs of moving out and my grandma went to talk with her last week about making plans. I'm not thrilled that my grandma is considering taking her in, but honestly??? I think because she is so much older than I am and as I grew up I saw her as an "adult", I have less sympathy than my gran who may still see her as a helpless 5 year old. Not sure, because my grandma floats between "she needs to grow up" and "I'd hate to see her on the street".

I have sent some handymen over there to fix some things and clear out the back yard since the weather has been nice. I was in the house 2 weeks ago and all of Mary's stuff is now in the master bedroom. I told her that she is more than welcome to take all of her mother's heirlooms (like China, figurines and jewelry) but she hasn't started to put anything in bubble wrap or boxes yet. She texted me to say that she "does not approve of having the carpet removed in the main floor of the house". The handy men and I removed it the other day because it was old, outdated and needed to be replaced (It was 20 yrs old). Oh and she didn't come downstairs, she texted me that from her room. Ugh it's so hard to take her seriously when she acts like a spoiled kid.

NP here. You sound like the spoiled kid.

Anonymous wrote:Has Mary burned down the house yet?

I bet there's no fire insurance.

We need the next chapter, please.

OP here.

Lol no, however, everyone in the family and the courts know about the situation now, so if anything fishy happens to the house, she will be first suspect on everyone's list. She is not showing any signs of moving out and my grandma went to talk with her last week about making plans. I'm not thrilled that my grandma is considering taking her in, but honestly??? I think because she is so much older than I am and as I grew up I saw her as an "adult", I have less sympathy than my gran who may still see her as a helpless 5 year old. Not sure, because my grandma floats between "she needs to grow up" and "I'd hate to see her on the street".

I have sent some handymen over there to fix some things and clear out the back yard since the weather has been nice. I was in the house 2 weeks ago and all of Mary's stuff is now in the master bedroom. I told her that she is more than welcome to take all of her mother's heirlooms (like China, figurines and jewelry) but she hasn't started to put anything in bubble wrap or boxes yet. She texted me to say that she "does not approve of having the carpet removed in the main floor of the house". The handy men and I removed it the other day because it was old, outdated and needed to be replaced (It was 20 yrs old). Oh and she didn't come downstairs, she texted me that from her room. Ugh it's so hard to take her seriously when she acts like a spoiled kid.

Has Mary burned down the house yet?

I bet there's no fire insurance.

We need the next chapter, please.

Anonymous wrote:If you aren't the OP who's stringing all of us along with a weird story that reads more like a bad commercial fiction with too many questionable details, contradictions and distorted information than real life, then you sound like someone who's young and who hasn't seen much of the world, which would explain your lack of sympathy and understanding of life in general.

Whatever the situation is, it remains that a mother allowed her adult daughter to live at home for decades long after most people leave the nest, never pushed her daughter out or served her with "tough love" and allowed the daughter to believe that she would inherit the primary residence (making veiled hints about not counting her chicks before they hatch doesn't count). This certainly affected Mary's decision making. Had she known five years ago or ten years ago she wouldn't inherit the house, had she been kicked out, she would have surely been forced to make decisions about her future and long term-well being that would have resulted in actions (jobs, finances) that would help put her in a better and more stable position.

But Thelma did not. Entitled or not, she pulled the rug underneath her own daughter out of a desire to punish her.

I don't know anything more about the story than what's been told to us by one person and we only know her perspective. But I'm hearing of late middle aged woman, single, no real relationships, working as a waitress despite two graduate degrees, who's been hugely bitchslapped by her own mother, and yes, I bet there's a lot of emotional issues going on. Odds are there is. If this is a true story. When you get older and you see more of life and watch many people evolve throughout the years in multiple life circumstances, you do start seeing depths to situations that makes the narrowness of black/white scenarios adopted by the young, naive, unnecessarily harsh, arrogant and distasteful.

Maybe this is a true story. But if it is, have some sympathy for Mary. Don't laugh and sneer at her. Don't take a "gotcha" attitude. She must feel that she's in a terrible, frightening situation. And it's no fun.

What a perfect way to describe it... Thelma got in one last bitchslap for posterity.
While that may be true, that has nothing to do with Larla.

Anonymous wrote:Because we don't know what her mental status is. Depression? Some mild disorder? A more serious issue?

Because she sort of gave up on trying. Something happened.

Because I don't particularly believe Larla's side of the debacle. We've only heard her side. Larla's description of the situation gives hints and clues that some of the details are total bs. So what else is bs?

Put yourself in Mary's shoes. I'm going to assume you're married. Imagine that your home is held in your husband's name. Humor me and assume the laws haven't changed from the 19th century, and your husband holds all property in his name. You are 50 years old. You have invested your energies and what income you have into your life, and your home being a large part of your life, you have put a lot of love, a lot of blood sweat and tears into your home. One day your husband croaks. You subsequently find out he left the house to his grand-niece, who is just starting out and struggling to put herself through college. You know the house inheritance will prove a boon to the grand-niece. But what about you? You are suddenly left high and dry. You realize your husband secretly hated you. He threw in some money to get you started in another living situation, but you BETTER be very, very wise in how you use that money, or you will find yourself homeless in a year or two. You don't know what's worse -- finding out the man you depended on for love, for support, for so much else actually despised and disrespected you, or that he left you a mean legacy from beyond the grave. I realize making a comparison of Thelma/Mary to a husband/wife is rough at best, but trying to show what it might be like to find yourself suddenly not owning your home because someone else owns it unexpectedly. Maybe losing your house to a foreclosure due to unforseen circumstances could be another comparison.

I don't know what the answer is. Maybe Mary will be able to rise to the occasion and find out she is capable of supporting herself and living her own life.

We can only hope that is what will happen.

But it is not and was never owned by Mary. This isn't a sudden change. A foreclosure isn't the same because at least one time you owned the title to that home. Mary is as manipulative as anyone thinks OP is.

And for the PP who suggested that Mary should've "been forced sooner" to make a decision- that also isn't everyone else's fault. Mary was free to make her own decisions all her life. She still is.

My family has a similar situation we are concerned will one day happen. Nothing we can say or do in life can change this person's behavior and though the writing is on the wall I'm sure it will come as a shock.

If you aren't the OP who's stringing all of us along with a weird story that reads more like a bad commercial fiction with too many questionable details, contradictions and distorted information than real life, then you sound like someone who's young and who hasn't seen much of the world, which would explain your lack of sympathy and understanding of life in general.

Whatever the situation is, it remains that a mother allowed her adult daughter to live at home for decades long after most people leave the nest, never pushed her daughter out or served her with "tough love" and allowed the daughter to believe that she would inherit the primary residence (making veiled hints about not counting her chicks before they hatch doesn't count). This certainly affected Mary's decision making. Had she known five years ago or ten years ago she wouldn't inherit the house, had she been kicked out, she would have surely been forced to make decisions about her future and long term-well being that would have resulted in actions (jobs, finances) that would help put her in a better and more stable position.

But Thelma did not. Entitled or not, she pulled the rug underneath her own daughter out of a desire to punish her.

I don't know anything more about the story than what's been told to us by one person and we only know her perspective. But I'm hearing of late middle aged woman, single, no real relationships, working as a waitress despite two graduate degrees, who's been hugely bitchslapped by her own mother, and yes, I bet there's a lot of emotional issues going on. Odds are there is. If this is a true story. When you get older and you see more of life and watch many people evolve throughout the years in multiple life circumstances, you do start seeing depths to situations that makes the narrowness of black/white scenarios adopted by the young, naive, unnecessarily harsh, arrogant and distasteful.

Maybe this is a true story. But if it is, have some sympathy for Mary. Don't laugh and sneer at her. Don't take a "gotcha" attitude. She must feel that she's in a terrible, frightening situation. And it's no fun.

Anonymous wrote:I don't feel bad for Mary one bit, her gravy train is over.
If Mary was depressed or had some kind of mental health issue Roy would be coming to her aid, or at the very least to her defense... but he's not.
Roy is probably very resentful that Thelma enabled Mary to get away with this kind of spoiled, childish behavior for so many years.

Mary has multiple degrees including her Masters, but she decided that when it came down to it if she couldn't be the boss, then she didn't want to work at all.
Mary was capable enough to go to multiple schools, earn multiple degrees, move out on her own multiple times, get engaged, move across the country on her own, etc. So please, let's not all feel bad for Mary ok? Mary has had it easier than most people her age who have worked their entire life.

Mary was lazy because Thelma enabled her to be, why would she change if Thelma didn't force it?
When Mary actually wanted do something she had absolutely no problem getting off her kiester & doing it, right?

Mary doesn't sit around the house depressed all day staring at the four walls, she took all of that money that she flushed down the toilet getting her degrees & became a waitress (even though she's clearly over qualified & could do so much more). No wonder Thelma was pissed at her when she died! I'd be furious if I spent hundreds of thousands of dollars on my daughter getting wasted degrees, just to have her become a waitress. I would have pulled the rug out from under her lazy ass too.

It's amazing that people think that Mary has depression, just because she still lived with her mom... why wouldn't she?? She had it good!

When Mary wanted to do something she had no depression all of a sudden holding her back, what would be the clinical diagnosis for that "selective depression"? umm "alternative depression"?


Mary doesn't sound depressed... Mary sounds entitled.

I don't feel bad for Mary one bit, her gravy train is over.
If Mary was depressed or had some kind of mental health issue Roy would be coming to her aid, or at the very least to her defense... but he's not.
Roy is probably very resentful that Thelma enabled Mary to get away with this kind of spoiled, childish behavior for so many years.

Mary has multiple degrees including her Masters, but she decided that when it came down to it if she couldn't be the boss, then she didn't want to work at all.
Mary was capable enough to go to multiple schools, earn multiple degrees, move out on her own multiple times, get engaged, move across the country on her own, etc. So please, let's not all feel bad for Mary ok? Mary has had it easier than most people her age who have worked their entire life.

Mary was lazy because Thelma enabled her to be, why would she change if Thelma didn't force it?
When Mary actually wanted do something she had absolutely no problem getting off her kiester & doing it, right?

Mary doesn't sit around the house depressed all day staring at the four walls, she took all of that money that she flushed down the toilet getting her degrees & became a waitress (even though she's clearly over qualified & could do so much more). No wonder Thelma was pissed at her when she died! I'd be furious if I spent hundreds of thousands of dollars on my daughter getting wasted degrees, just to have her become a waitress. I would have pulled the rug out from under her lazy ass too.

It's amazing that people think that Mary has depression, just because she still lived with her mom... why wouldn't she?? She had it good!

When Mary wanted to do something she had no depression all of a sudden holding her back, what would be the clinical diagnosis for that "selective depression"? umm "alternative depression"?


Mary doesn't sound depressed... Mary sounds entitled.

Because we don't know what her mental status is. Depression? Some mild disorder? A more serious issue?

Because she sort of gave up on trying. Something happened.

Because I don't particularly believe Larla's side of the debacle. We've only heard her side. Larla's description of the situation gives hints and clues that some of the details are total bs. So what else is bs?

Put yourself in Mary's shoes. I'm going to assume you're married. Imagine that your home is held in your husband's name. Humor me and assume the laws haven't changed from the 19th century, and your husband holds all property in his name. You are 50 years old. You have invested your energies and what income you have into your life, and your home being a large part of your life, you have put a lot of love, a lot of blood sweat and tears into your home. One day your husband croaks. You subsequently find out he left the house to his grand-niece, who is just starting out and struggling to put herself through college. You know the house inheritance will prove a boon to the grand-niece. But what about you? You are suddenly left high and dry. You realize your husband secretly hated you. He threw in some money to get you started in another living situation, but you BETTER be very, very wise in how you use that money, or you will find yourself homeless in a year or two. You don't know what's worse -- finding out the man you depended on for love, for support, for so much else actually despised and disrespected you, or that he left you a mean legacy from beyond the grave. I realize making a comparison of Thelma/Mary to a husband/wife is rough at best, but trying to show what it might be like to find yourself suddenly not owning your home because someone else owns it unexpectedly. Maybe losing your house to a foreclosure due to unforseen circumstances could be another comparison.

I don't know what the answer is. Maybe Mary will be able to rise to the occasion and find out she is capable of supporting herself and living her own life.

We can only hope that is what will happen.