Anonymous wrote:Behind every creation is a creator. Anyone that doesn't see that is truly lost.

Anonymous wrote:

Even atheists pray on a crashing plane.

This atheist has been in a crashing car and has not prayed.

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Anonymous wrote:OP here, I get the feeling that because I'm religious, people are always viewing me as some unintelligent mongo and to the person who said I'm not a free thinking individual, why don't you go suck a big fat one.

If you can't wrap your mind around people thinking differently from how you do, then you are, by definition, unintelligent. Or at the very least, uninformed and closed-minded.

The anger I see on this particular thread comes from religious, not atheist people.

For the record, I am a moderately religious Christian (Lutheran).

I have no problem with other people's views. What I have a problem is is being unfairly stereotyped.

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Anonymous wrote:The only people I saw openly prosletising were Jehova's Witnesses. Even Mormons didn't seem intrusive at all. I guess I don't get into those types of conversations with casual acquaintances, because frankly, I have no idea who's religious and who's not. People occasionally mention going to church, but I have never been offered to be saved or find Jesus LOL

Imagine if an atheist or even agnostic president would get elected. If you can't imagine that, that's the reason why atheists feel that religion intrude too much into our lives.

I think it was actually more common in the past than it is now. Jefferson, for example.

Jefferson was not an atheist. He wasn't even agnostic. He was at the very least a deist with strong Christian ties.

He was a deist who cut out all the miracle stories from the new testament to hear the clear words of Jesus of Nazareth. It's known as the Jefferson Bible - a very slim volume, that can be purchased in bookstores and the original was on display at the Smithsonian a few years ago.

and he said this: "The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the Supreme Being as his father, in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter."
-- Thomas Jefferson, letter to John Adams, April 11, 1823, quoted from James A Haught, "Breaking the Last Taboo" (1996)

Anonymous wrote:The only people I saw openly prosletising were Jehova's Witnesses. Even Mormons didn't seem intrusive at all. I guess I don't get into those types of conversations with casual acquaintances, because frankly, I have no idea who's religious and who's not. People occasionally mention going to church, but I have never been offered to be saved or find Jesus LOL

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Anonymous wrote:It's a very simple explanation for me.

You know how those of you who believe in God/Allah/whatever monotheistic deity you happen to choose feel about the Greek, Roman and Norse pantheons, the religion of the Druids, and all of the other ancient traditions?

When/if you think about those ancient traditions, you understand that those ancient peoples were trying to explain natural phenomena that they couldn't otherwise explain - the seasons, the weather, disease, death, etc. You dismiss those things now and you, an educated modern person, understand for example that lighting is a natural event and not the wrath of a deity.

You don't believe that the gods of those ancient traditions exist, and the only way you would believe it is if one of them turned up on your doorstep and started tossing thunderbolts - and even then you'd probably appeal to Clarke's Law* rather than believe it was a deity of some kind.

Atheists feel the same way as you do about all those ancient beliefs. We just happen to feel the same way about your deity of choice, too.

We don't really think about your deity as part of our daily lives, and we simply don't believe that deity exists. Atheists believe that there is a rational, natural explanation for all things including the origin of our Universe, we just haven't figured some of them out, yet.


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*Clarke's Law - Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

Yes, but the problem with this (for you) is, just because you "don't believe," doesn't make it "not true."

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Anonymous wrote:See, these atheists here claim to be good humanists for the sake of personal codes, but can't stand other people unless they are the right kind of people. Funny.

All of the atheists here say they can't stand believers? Please quote it.

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Anonymous wrote:My opinion is that atheists are cowardly. They claim believers cling to God for childish comfort, but really they are the ones who can't trust in something unless it is spelled out for them in a colored textbook. Even then I have a feeling they suspect that the next scientist/theory will disprove the ones before so refuse to go "all in" on anything.

Again, just my opinion.

Mine too. And they say everything is "just science." Yes, well... Who created the science? They can't really explain that of course.

Anonymous wrote:See, these atheists here claim to be good humanists for the sake of personal codes, but can't stand other people unless they are the right kind of people. Funny.

Anonymous wrote:The thing I find strange about non-believers (atheism) is the same strange thing I find about believers (religious). Both actually believe in something without proof. Atheist believe God or a higher power does not exist but they can not prove it. Religious types believe a God or higher power does exist and also can not prove it.

For me personally, I'm agnostic. Is there a God or higher power? I don't know. But if I had to choose which (atheisim or Religon) is more logically based, I'd have to go with atheism. A leap of faith is just that.

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Anonymous wrote:OP - I am with you on not getting atheism.
I think many of these atheists have never witnessed the miracle of birth.
People talk about the “randomness of the universe.”
It is not random at all.
The fact that so many, many things can go wrong with the birth of a child and most often, a baby is born nearly perfect proves to me that God’s hand is at work and that we have a good and loving God.
And, to think that a giant maple tree can grow out of a seed that is the size of a pea - simply miraculous.
I have witnessed miracles nearly every day.
There are some things that we simply cannot understand or explain through science.

So if a seed doesn't sprout or a baby does in childbirth is it an anti-miracle?

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Anonymous wrote:OP, for me the question is... well which version of "God" should someone believe in, and why? There are thousands of versions of god that humans have created. Which one is the right one, and why are all the others the wrong version of God? For example - do you believe in a vengeful god or loving god? Why? How are you making your decision? What qualities and attributes are the right and wrong ones, and how are you making your decisions? Based on what?

There's an oft quoted saying: "I just believe in one less god."

Atheism is more than not believing in anthropomorphous gods. It is materialistic in its essense, i.e. if I can't see it, it must not exist. It is a lot more restrictive than many people realize. It's one thing to say you don't believe in, say, Christian gods. It's quite another to say that what we can't observe/explain in materialistic terms cannot possibly exist.

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Anonymous wrote:I almost "could" get atheism, but not the brand of it that is often championed here.

I'm an atheist and some of the other atheists confuse me with their rabid behavior. I'm sure there are some people who share your faith that you feel the same way about.

Anonymous wrote:See, these atheists here claim to be good humanists for the sake of personal codes, but can't stand other people unless they are the right kind of people. Funny.